911 Pentagon Video Released

[ignacio]

Dont you see what is being debated here. It's actually the freaks like ignacio who said that "this is a conspiracy therefor the reports are all lies". WE sane people at least are actually debating the reports. But if you believe the reports to be accurate then please tell us why you believe so. If not then you would be better of not commenting on things you don't know anything about.

hmmm... not quite what I am saying. Maybe: "this is a NOT a conspiracy therefore the kook reports are all lies". I think that captures my position more accurately.

 

[Prometheus]

The thread is long so I may have missed something, but didn't he say that a scientist/engineer's views that aren't published in a respectable journal or properly peer reviewed are not worth much?

Thats not "discrediting" a scientist, its saying the scientist has not yet earned credibility.

That is only one of the things he said. But he believes that published reports which has been proven incorrect and contradictory is worth more than reports that have been peer reviewed and which the reviewers have not spoken out against. It's like saying the easter bunny is real because a published report said so. He doesn't have the answer and instead of saying so he labels a nuclear physicist a kook together with anyone who found his reports more credible. He tries to discredit the person instead of the facts to prove a point which he never had. If he can't apply reasoning in a discussion he should stay out of it, but instead in order to call us kooks he makes up the lie that we said this is a clear conspiracy when we only questioned the official reports. He is pathetic.

 

[ignacio]

That is only one of the things he said. But he believes that published reports which has been proven incorrect and contradictory is worth more than reports that have been peer reviewed and which the reviewers have not spoken out against. It's like saying the easter bunny is real because a published report said so. He doesn't have the answer and instead of saying so he labels a nuclear physicist a kook together with anyone who found his reports more credible. He tries to discredit the person instead of the facts to prove a point which he never had. If he can't apply reasoning in a discussion he should stay out of it, but instead in order to call us kooks he makes up the lie that we said this is a clear conspiracy when we only questioned the official reports. He is pathetic.

Again, not really what I am saying: again - neither you nor I are structural engineers or PhD physicists or expert peers in any field related to the kook prof - accordingly, and as much as this may hurt kookie eater's ego, we are not the ones to confer credibility on kook prof: journals and peers would do that. With regards to that, no journal has published his paper and no named peers (apart from a linguistics professor) have come forward to claim to have reviewed his paper - journals don't have this luxury: their named journal review board's credibility as well as the credibility of the journal are on the line with respect to how they review and accept papers. He has NOT undergone this rigorous test – or if he has, he has failed it (and hence is not published) - and his paper can accordingly not be afforded the credibility conferred on journal published papers. Again - my training is in a science other than engineering, so I do not make the preposterous supposition that I could evaluate the dynamics involved in the aforementioned phenomena as well as an expert in the field. You and fellow kooks and kookie eater will gladly make that supposition - because you have arrogance to suggest that "reasoning" alone is what gives you the power to do so. (Who knew PhDs in engineering are so meaningless... any old layperson with enough "reasoning" is the peer of a PhD!). I am truly sorry if the gist of what I am saying is going over your head.

 

[eye_suc]

wow prometheus. i am really unimpressed by your tactful approach to discredit ignacio (sp?)

lets not forget: arguing on the internet is like competing in the special olympics

 

[Prometheus]

am i reading this right?

i am very reluctant to reread this whole thread, since most of it is drivel... could somebody maybe provide a synopsis of whats going on here? a-z

kilo, prometheus and highflyer: The official reports aren't making sense.
ignacio and crew: What, your saying it's a conspiracy?
kilo, prometheus and highflyer: No, it's not entirely accurate and it's contradictory and doesn't explain everything that happened like this.
ignacio and crew: You saying you believe the only explanation is nukes.
kilo, prometheus and highflyer: No, saying the reports are inaccurate and we want an explanation.
ignacio and crew: Because I don't know how to explain it to you and I believe all reports to be entirely accurate because that is what I have always believed. I am saying that you believe this is a conspiracy and you are a bunch of cooks together with your nuclear physicist whose science I don't understand.
kilo, prometheus and highflyer: You have indeed proven that you are an idiot.

 

[ignacio]

kilo, prometheus and highflyer: The official reports aren't making sense.
ignacio and crew: What, your saying it's a conspiracy?
kilo, prometheus and highflyer: No, it's not entirely accurate and it's contradictory and doesn't explain everything that happened like this.
ignacio and crew: You saying you believe the only explanation is nukes.
kilo, prometheus and highflyer: No, saying the reports are inaccurate and we want an explanation.
ignacio and crew: Because I don't know how to explain it to you and I believe all reports to be entirely accurate because that is what I have always believed. I am saying that you believe this is a conspiracy and you are a bunch of cooks together with your nuclear physicist whose science I don't understand.
kilo, prometheus and highflyer: You have indeed proven that you are an idiot.

Well, as a seasoned fantacist, you would make a great dramatist. My tips: I would have the sane people set up much like a Greek chorus, providing a grounding amid the turmoil. Then you could have kilo in a King Lear role (blinded from the truth by his conspiracy pride) and you in an Othello role (paranoia and suspicions) and kookie eater as School for Scandal's backbiting Lady Sneerwell, or really, any other bitter woman would work out just as well.

 

[Highflyer_GP]

wow prometheus. i am really unimpressed by your tactful approach to discredit ignacio (sp?)

lets not forget: arguing on the internet is like competing in the special olympics

Nobody needs to discredit Ignacio, he does it all by himself

LOL @ special olympics

 

[mooK]

For the sake of clarity, I suppose it's best to state my views briefly.

As I said in a previous post I'm not particularly for OR against the conspiracy theory thing as an idea in itself, but what we're arguing about here is not about the overall picture, but merely certain parts of the story that we're trying to dissect. Such as the way the towers collapsed and the Pentagon crash.

There may very well be a conspiracy here, but some of you are taking certain points to quite an extreme and making leaps of judgement which are actually quite ludicrous. Which is how the fun flamewar part of this thread started.

I've got a hunch that Ignacio agrees with me here, I don't think he's necessarily against the idea of a conspiracy completely, but mainly certain major points that some conspiracy theorists make which are simply ridiculous.

EDIT: Ah, I think I've found a way to end this thread. At least for the next few weeks. Kilo39, Prom, Highflyer, here ya go, it's the holy grail: http://www.torrentspy.com/directory/920/assorted/conspiracy

 

[pupa]

.

I am not commenting on any particular poster. Only to these so clever freaks on this forum that debate against their better judgement! Fools as they are like so many here in Africa! Everything said about USA or what USA say is always either nonsense, racist or an conspiracy. So lame! Yet they grovel and beg for funds and investment so the can be more corrupt. [sic]. Disease of Africa, all in the genes! IMHO. Take what you can get for free and bite the hand that feed You! These conspiracy theory's of 911 is so worn out already! Typical of the South Africans that debate it so many years after the effect. Same as with Apartheid 12 Years on!

 

[Highflyer_GP]

Pupa if you hate SA and love the USA so much why don't you fsck off there! No offense or anything, but if you think that the grass is so green for US citizens, I suggest you read their Patriot Act. It makes our pending cellphone interception laws look like a walk in the park.

 

[pupa]

I agree about the special Olympics comment, As it is a sports event for "lame ducks" (not without respect) it refers to this forum with, as I stated, all the "lame ducks" (without respect) that post here that do not know what they are talking about!

 

[icyrus]

Pupa if you hate SA and love the USA so much why don't you fsck off there! No offense or anything, but if you think that the grass is so green for US citizens, I suggest you read their Patriot Act. It makes our pending cellphone interception laws look like a walk in the park.

Indeed, but then again they don't live in constant fear of them or their loved ones being rapped and/or murdered...

 

[pupa]

Pupa if you hate SA and love the USA so much why don't you fsck off there! No offense or anything, but if you think that the grass is so green for US citizens, I suggest you read their Patriot Act. It makes our pending cellphone interception laws look like a walk in the park.

I would really like to but who will keep you idiots in check! Their new laws are due to 911, we do not have that threat as we sleep with the terrorists, I think the ANC believe they still are! but have no foe!

 

[ignacio]

For the sake of clarity, I suppose it's best to state my views briefly.

As I said in a previous post I'm not particularly for OR against the conspiracy theory thing as an idea in itself, but what we're arguing about here is not about the overall picture, but merely certain parts of the story that we're trying to dissect. Such as the way the towers collapsed and the Pentagon crash.

There may very well be a conspiracy here, but some of you are taking certain points to quite an extreme and making leaps of judgement which are actually quite ludicrous. Which is how the fun flamewar part of this thread started.

I've got a hunch that Ignacio agrees with me here, I don't think he's necessarily against the idea of a conspiracy completely, but mainly certain major points that some conspiracy theorists make which are simply ridiculous.

Well, I am actually pretty much opposed to the conspiracy as a whole - militant Arabs hijacking planes is obviously the simplest explanation for what happened in this case. If the conspiracy crew wanted to pursue the angle that America's middle eastern policies in the last few decades have both enabled and motivated Islamists - and in this respect that they have brought something like 911 upon themselves, I could possibly agree (fascist Islam's drive to take the world back to the dark ages is also largely to blame). But a far-flung, multinational conspiracy with many participants which resulted in the killing of thousands of Americans and costing billions if not trillions of dollars is beyond reasonable.

 

[Highflyer_GP]

I agree about the special Olympics comment, As it is a sports event for "lame ducks" (not without respect) it refers to this forum with, as I stated, all the "lame ducks" (without respect) that post here that do not know what they are talking about!

No, actually it doesn't mean that. Fighting on a forum is like competing in the special olympics because even if you win you're still retarded.

Indeed, but then again they don't live in constant fear of them or their loved ones being rapped and/or murdered...

Reason I posted that was because he wasn't complaining about the crime level, he was complaining about the mentality of South Africans on this forum, yet at the same time idolising the USA. People on this forum are not the ones responsible for the violent crime mentioned, hence he shouldn't take his frustrations out on us. Instead of bitching about it on a forum, maybe he should try and make a difference to rectify whatever it is that's bothering. Which is why the special olympics comment applies especially to him. He should move to the USA if he thinks that things are so rosy there. While crime levels aren't as high there as they are here, they are still high. If anyone has been to New York they would know what it's like in Brooklyn and Harlem.

 

[pupa]

Well, I am actually pretty much opposed to the conspiracy as a whole - militant Arabs hijacking planes is obviously the simplest explanation for what happened in this case. If the conspiracy crew wanted to pursue the angle that America's middle eastern policies in the last few decades have both enabled and motivated Islamists - and in this respect that they have brought something like 911 upon themselves, I could possibly agree (fascist Islam's drive to take the world back to the dark ages is also largely to blame). But a far-flung, multinational conspiracy with many participants which resulted in the killing of thousands of Americans and costing billions if not trillions of dollars is beyond reasonable.

Now thats logical sense! WTF is all this arguing about! Then we are on the same wavelength?

 

[pupa]

No, actually it doesn't mean that. Fighting on a forum is like competing in the special olympics because even if you win you're still retarded.


Reason I posted that was because he wasn't complaining about the crime level, he was complaining about the mentality of South Africans on this forum, yet at the same time idolising the USA. People on this forum are not the ones responsible for the violent crime mentioned, hence he shouldn't take his frustrations out on us. Instead of bitching about it on a forum, maybe he should try and make a difference to rectify whatever it is that's bothering. Which is why the special olympics comment applies especially to him. He should move to the USA if he thinks that things are so rosy there. While crime levels aren't as high there as they are here, they are still high. If anyone has been to New York they would know what it's like in Brooklyn and Harlem.

It seems you were commenting about Yourself, You do phrase everything as you see it in your simple mind, so I agree with you, you must be correct about your retardation as you were one of the prime players here. About the crime levels do not bluff yourself, Go look at statistics per capita and population and feel proud! At least there they do what is needed to do, here the GVT and the police is lame ducks or as you put it part of their own special olympic's

 

[Highflyer_GP]

It seems you were commenting about Yourself, You do phrase everything as you see it in your simple mind, so I agree with you, you must be correct about your retardation as you were one of the prime players here. About the crime levels do not bluff yourself, Go look at statistics per capita and population and feel proud! At least there they do what is needed to do, here the GVT and the police is lame ducks or as you put it part of their own special olympic's

Obviously you've never heard the phrase before, so go on making an ass of yourself about your interpretation of what it means Let me ask you something - have you actually been to the Bronx, Harlem or Brooklyn? The way you're commenting seems like you know exactly what's being done there as if you lived half your life there and half here.

 

[ignacio]

Now thats logical sense! WTF is all this arguing about! Then we are on the same wavelength?

I am not entirely sure what wavelength you are on - since I couldn't quite determine the purpose of your pro-US, anti-SA brainstorm - but if you are anti-conspiracy, then we are on the same wavelength.

 

[pupa]

Obviously you've never heard the phrase before, so go on making an ass of yourself about your interpretation of what it means Let me ask you something - have you actually been to the Bronx, Harlem or Brooklyn? The way you're commenting seems like you know exactly what's being done there as if you lived half your life there and half here.

The only @ss I make is the one you see in the mirror in the morning before you brushed your teeth. I have been to America and like any country there is areas to stay away. Here in South Africa everywhere is a mess, You do not know if you will see your loved ones tonight no matter where you go. ATM Iraq could be safer in some areas at least! (Pun)