American Shooting

greg0205 said:
June 29th is the 180th day of 2018... This is the 195th mass shooting in the US this year.

https://www.massshootingtracker.org
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NarrowBandFtw said:
That's a VERY loose definition of "mass shooting" just for the sake of drama I guess.

Literally a week ago there was a shootout at a taxi rank on my commute to work and the road was closed, 4 people injured, THAT would make this list by their definition. Sure as hell wasn't a "mass shooting", just taxi thugs having a shootout.
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Indeed. Basically they include all shootings with 4 or more people shot including, gang related, robberies etc. Coz 180 mass shootings this year looks so much better than 20* mass shootings when pushing their agenda. If they applied the same definition to other countries, especially ones with tough laws or even outlawing guns totally it would show a very different story to the naritive been pushed.

*20 figure pulled out my ass.

Want proof or to argue that, go ahead and do some research. Don't have the time or energy to pull the actual figures.
 
NarrowBandFtw said:
I reckon it's a bit futile to try and nail down a "correct" number, but with the dictionary definition of "mass" being "a large number of people" you're basically asking what number constitutes "a large number".

4 certainly is not large, when I have a family dinner with 4 people I don't go around claiming it was a mass dinner. So while I can confidently say 4 is not "mass", I can't really say what number would qualify as "mass". Double digits at a minimum I imagine.
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The sensible gun law liberal in me is quite comfortable taking a lower number as a baseline because an issue this serious deserves more than being derailed into semantics about what constitutes "mass".

Either way, no one, journalist or no, deserved what Ramos handed out with his shotgun yesterday.
 
eg2505 said:
never understood why there are so many mass shootings in America, hardly ever in Canada.
is it something in the water or something?

its almost every week or something.

RIP to those that passed away.
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No its because Canadians and Americans are the same.....
 
Eniigma said:
Indeed. Basically they include all shootings with 4 or more people shot including, gang related, robberies etc. Coz 180 mass shootings this year looks so much better than 20* mass shootings when pushing their agenda. If they applied the same definition to other countries, especially ones with tough laws or even outlawing guns totally it would show a very different story to the naritive been pushed.

*20 figure pulled out my ass.

Want proof or to argue that, go ahead and do some research. Don't have the time or energy to pull the actual figures.
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I spend a lot of time in N&CA, the Sports and the Entertainment threads... Is there a reason I *only* see you posting in US shootings threads?
 
greg0205 said:
I spend a lot of time in N&CA, the Sports and the Entertainment threads... Is there a reason I *only* see you posting in US shootings threads?
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Probably because we always butt heads so to speak on the topic. I do post in others, but not as much as gun related stuff. It happens to be something I'm passionate about.


I also go through spurts of being active here and then just lurking, depending on work load and work ethic. ;)
 
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eg2505 said:
so its easier to get a weapon in the US than canada?
figured as much, especially with those 2nd amendment and NRA clubs.

is that why even locally, we dont have mass shootings? due to it being so hard to get a gun?
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Historically our mass shootings have had a common denominator... The SAPS. We also had Sizzlers, Shell House, the Heidelberg Tavern and Saint James 'tho and those exclude the violence between the ANC and IFP in the early 90's.
 
Eniigma said:
Probably because we always butt heads so to speak on the topic. I do post in others, but not as much as gun related stuff. It happens to be something I'm passionate about.
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Roger that.
 
Pitbull said:
I see the difference, but without context it's nothing but a number right? Just puts it into context a bit.

Edit: 109 farm attacks in the year so far 35 deaths (last number I saw) And the US as whole stands on 195 mass shootings. A country with 325 million people.
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Can't be. This country has stringent gun control laws.
 
greg0205 said:
The sensible gun law liberal in me is quite comfortable taking a lower number as a baseline because an issue this serious deserves more than being derailed into semantics about what constitutes "mass".
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Ironically derailment is exactly what you will get when you open the door for it by shouting mass shooting at every opportunity, even for cases where it can be dissected and disproved. Calling virtually every shooting a mass shooting doesn't get the proper conversation going for either shootings or mass shootings, it just gets derailed and politicized. Very much similar to how anything and everything is called racism these days: people are desensitized to the word by now, it's still a serious issue, yet we have apathy.

greg0205 said:
Either way, no one, journalist or no, deserved what Ramos handed out with his shotgun yesterday.
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No innocent person deserves that no. There are of course other scenarios that justify the use of deadly force.
 
Alan said:
Can't be. This country has stringent gun control laws.
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Let's crunch some numbers:

Not even using taxi violence or daily shootings like in Cape flats. Comparing farm attacks to Mass shootings in the US.

Population in the US - 325mil
SA - 56mil

So America has 5.80 times more people than in SA.

They had 195 mass shootings till date, SA had 109 farm attacks.

If the US had 56mil people that would come to 33.62 mass shootings compared to our 109 farm attacks with 35 killed farmers. So still farm attacks and even farm murders are more than that of the US. So in comparison SA farm attacks are 3.24 times worse than mass shootings in the US and farmers killed 1.04 times.

Jusus, I think the liberals on MyBB have their views a bit skewed :o

Btw, SA has very good gun control laws in place.

If we were to add daily shootings and killings of which 4 or more have been killed or injured our Number will outshine that of the US by miles! Yet, MyBB liberals think discussing gun controls in the US is better than discussing farm murders.
 
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Pitbull said:
Let's crunch some numbers:

Not even using taxi violence or daily shootings like in Cape flats. Comparing farm attacks to Mass shootings in the US.

Population in the US - 325mil
SA - 56mil

So America has 5.80 times more people than in SA.

They had 195 mass shootings till date, SA had 109 farm attacks.

If the US had 56mil people that would come to 33.62 mass shootings compared to our 109 farm attacks with 35 killed farmers. So still farm attacks and even farm murders are more than that of the US. So in comparison SA farm attacks are 3.24 times worse than shootings mass shootings in the US and farmers killed 1.04 times.

Jusus, I think the liberals on MyBB have their views a bit skewed :o

Btw, SA has very good gun control laws in place.

If we were to add daily shootings and killings of which 4 or more have been killed or injured our Number will outshine that of the US by miles! Yet, MyBB liberals think discussing gun controls in the US is better than discussing farm murders.
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With respect, Pitbull, it's not the numbers so much as the confounding manner of the US shootings.

Even farm murders in this country have a bloody and criminal reason behind them, while the US shootings tend to be more some dude who just went off pop.
 
Aquila ka Hecate said:
With respect, Pitbull, it's not the numbers so much as the confounding manner of the US shootings.

Even farm murders in this country have a bloody and criminal reason behind them, while the US shootings tend to be more some dude who just went off pop.
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Someone made a point of mentioning the numbers though.

The numbers seem to give some kind of weight to a view few people see as a political issue in the US, when we have even worse numbers locally. Just trying to understand the reasoning behind it. Nothing more nothing less.
 
Pitbull said:
Someone made a point of mentioning the numbers though.

The numbers seem to give some kind of weight to a view few people see as a political issue in the US, when we have even worse numbers locally. Just trying to understand the reasoning behind it. Nothing more nothing less.
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Start a different thread then.
 
Pitbull said:
Someone made a point of mentioning the numbers though.

The numbers seem to give some kind of weight to a view few people see as a political issue in the US, when we have even worse numbers locally. Just trying to understand the reasoning behind it. Nothing more nothing less.
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Spin that whataboutism baby!
 
Pitbull said:
Why?

I'm debating the figures from this thread. It's relevant to what this thread is going to develop into, all of these does...
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This thread is about the shooting in Annapolis, Maryland. Has nothing to do with so called farm murders in SA,. There is a thread dedicated to the farm murders. You are debating why no one gives a **** about farm murders.
 
Aquila ka Hecate said:
With respect, Pitbull, it's not the numbers so much as the confounding manner of the US shootings.

Even farm murders in this country have a bloody and criminal reason behind them, while the US shootings tend to be more some dude who just went off pop.
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I agree the manner and way these things happen there is a worry. The thing though is america has always had guns, lots of guns and loose laws around them compared to elsewhere, but they haven't always had these issues.

It's not the guns, the access to them or laws around them, America is mentally ****ed in the head it seems, and it's just getting worse.
 
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