ankbay unsray

bromster

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With the current economic outlook, and so many banks being underwater on long dated HTM bonds, the risk of mass withdrawals and the associated contagion has me considering risk management.

I'm sitting with the proceeds of a home sale in a 7 day account, trying to wait out the economic slowdown and pick up a decent property if demand in CPT ever decides to wane.

But with all my eggs in one basket and a 7 day lock up, and funds not insured by the SARB in the same way as the FDIC in the USA, I'm feeling a little exposed. Considered physical gold, but don't really want the downside risk.

How do we all feel about local bank liquidity in general wrt global contagion risk?

Any ideas on where you could park money for a year where you would feel safer than say FNB or Capitec? Do local money market funds insure your deposit 100%? I'm a bit of a noob as I don't really use these facilities.

Many thanks.
 
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Our banks are just fine and are insured just not by the government…which is actually a good thing.

Don’t let the broken American system spill over and make you panic about nothing.

Money Market does secure your money yes. If you really don’t want to use a bank park it somewhere like 10X.

7 day lockup is nothing and will give you low yields. Lock it up for much longer and get more reward.
 
I agree. South Africas big banks have a knack of weathering the storms, I wouldn’t be too afraid that they’re going the way of SBV and friends.
 
Our banks are just fine and are insured just not by the government…which is actually a good thing.

Money Market does secure your money yes. If you really don’t want to use a bank park it somewhere like 10X.
Uh, no, there is no deposit insurance in SA banks. That said, our banking system is very safe (especially if you go with the big banks).

Money market does not secure your money. Plenty of people took losses in the money market when African Bank went down (the losses were pretty small though in general).
 
I never have more than 100k in a South African bank account at any given time.
Have a bit of money in a offshore account as a backup.

Rest of My money is tied up in property.
And businesses.
 
With the current economic outlook, and so many banks being underwater on long dated HTM bonds, the risk of mass withdrawals and the associated contagion has me considering risk management.

I'm sitting with the proceeds of a home sale in a 7 day account, trying to wait out the economic slowdown and pick up a decent property if demand in CPT ever decides to wane.

But with all my eggs in one basket and a 7 day lock up, and funds not insured by the SARB in the same way as the FDIC in the USA, I'm feeling a little exposed. Considered physical gold, but don't really want the downside risk.

How do we all feel about local bank liquidity in general wrt global contagion risk?

Any ideas on where you could park money for a year where you would feel safer than say FNB or Capitec? Do local money market funds insure your deposit 100%? I'm a bit of a noob as I don't really use these facilities.

Many thanks.
Hmm really great question
Atleast you were honest from the outset

Your mindset and worry is completely blown out of scale

Ill do some quick context and move on. Im in Investment banking - Currently in an international bank here. this isnt to gloat or anything, just to say I am coming from within

SA's banking environment is rated higher internationally, through S and P, Moodys, World bank etc, than the current sovereign. Now this is an incredible thing to say, but it is fact. In the normal risk context Government is your final straw, the instrinsic idea of risk free rate. So when The Banks (essentially tier 2) sit under the sovereign in the jurisidction they operate liquidity in is higher than the sovereign, what this should tell you is that the market and overall has more comfort in the banks ability to deliver liquidity, ensure stability than the government to which policy and regulation is set


Some other key items to share, is that the scale and size and population, and size of assets in our Local banks are a fraction of the size of the likes of SVB and others. To put that into context, where I work our asset book just in the local context is bigger than all 4 banks, Std bank, absa, nedbank and FNB combined. So when you read that there is contagion and a bank runs out of liquidity, its because the scale of their operations and specificity of their assets are weighted in high risk industries and jurisdicitions, raising the significant need from Basel 3 and latest 4, to ensure capital adequeacy to match the asset quality. This is specifically the problem with banks outside of SA. If you think that SA and AFrica is high risk, you do not understand the underlying and how much more risk there is outside of SA


Capital adequacy requirements in SA are far more stringent regulated and required. WE do not have the scale that a run on the liquidity could occur.

The reality is in fact, government has a higher likelihood of default than our banks. This is fact. I would not concern yourself of safety of your funds within our banks. You should however concern yourself to actually voice this through voting and action in the Political voting occuring next April
There are 34 banking issued licenses in South africa - for interest sakes, google how many licensed banks are in the United states and it will become abundantly clear to you just from that search why its so easy for banks in developed markets to have systemic contagion and liquidity events.


Just put your funds into a stable interest environment, avoid the *too good to be true* rates and be comfortable that your money is safe. You are worrying about items or events that are slim at absolute best.
 
Some other key items to share, is that the scale and size and population, and size of assets in our Local banks are a fraction of the size of the likes of SVB and others. To put that into context, where I work our asset book just in the local context is bigger than all 4 banks, Std bank, absa, nedbank and FNB combined. So when you read that there is contagion and a bank runs out of liquidity, its because the scale of their operations and specificity of their assets are weighted in high risk industries and jurisdicitions, raising the significant need from Basel 3 and latest 4, to ensure capital adequeacy to match the asset quality. This is specifically the problem with banks outside of SA. If you think that SA and AFrica is high risk, you do not understand the underlying and how much more risk there is outside of SA
Asset size and asset quality mean f*ckall when it comes to liquidity risk though. And capital adequacy is at best a contributor to a scenario that can result in liquidity issues. Liquidity issues happen when short-term liabilities are called (i.e. depositors withdraw their money) and the bank does not have sufficient sort-term or liquid assets on hand to meet this demand. It can happen to any bank because most of what a bank does is maturity transformation (specifically converting short-term liabilities [e.g. deposits] into long-term assets [e.g. home loans]) so there will always be a fairly large maturity mismatch between the asset and liability sides of a bank's balance sheet. Basel 3 and 4 have tightened up on the liquidity requirements with things like the Net Stable Funding Ratio (NSFR) and Liquidity Cover Ratio (LCR) but neither of these result in capital requirements nor do they actually make a bank completely immune to a liquidity crisis (i.e. a run on the bank).

Liquidity issues can be triggered by a bank's capital adequacy ratio dropping significantly. This can result in a liquidity issue as depositors try to get their money out of a bank when appears that it may not be able to return their deposits in future. But that is not a function of the absolute level of risk in the assets, it's a function of how incorrect the measurement of said risk was.
 
Asset size and asset quality mean f*ckall when it comes to liquidity risk though. And capital adequacy is at best a contributor to a scenario that can result in liquidity issues. Liquidity issues happen when short-term liabilities are called (i.e. depositors withdraw their money) and the bank does not have sufficient sort-term or liquid assets on hand to meet this demand. It can happen to any bank because most of what a bank does is maturity transformation (specifically converting short-term liabilities [e.g. deposits] into long-term assets [e.g. home loans]) so there will always be a fairly large maturity mismatch between the asset and liability sides of a bank's balance sheet. Basel 3 and 4 have tightened up on the liquidity requirements with things like the Net Stable Funding Ratio (NSFR) and Liquidity Cover Ratio (LCR) but neither of these result in capital requirements nor do they actually make a bank completely immune to a liquidity crisis (i.e. a run on the bank).

Liquidity issues can be triggered by a bank's capital adequacy ratio dropping significantly. This can result in a liquidity issue as depositors try to get their money out of a bank when appears that it may not be able to return their deposits in future. But that is not a function of the absolute level of risk in the assets, it's a function of how incorrect the measurement of said risk was.
No Bank is immune. And overall, no one is saying that our banks are immune. The question is on the liklihood of such. Our financial system is robust
 
No Bank is immune. And overall, no one is saying that our banks are immune. The question is on the liklihood of such. Our financial system is robust
My point was that capital adequacy ratios and bank size do not have an impact on it's ability to survive a liquidity issue which was what you claimed.
 
Our banks are just fine and are insured just not by the government…which is actually a good thing.

Don’t let the broken American system spill over and make you panic about nothing.

Money Market does secure your money yes. If you really don’t want to use a bank park it somewhere like 10X.

7 day lockup is nothing and will give you low yields. Lock it up for much longer and get more reward.
ya, if waiting for the demand in CT to wane then 7 days is not realistic :laugh:

6 months - 1 year.
 
No Bank is immune. And overall, no one is saying that our banks are immune. The question is on the liklihood of such. Our financial system is robust
Thank you for taking the time and the detailed response. That eases my mind somewhat. And thanks for your input @Jehosefat. By capital ratios, do you mean having a minimum prescribed amount of available equity on the asset side of the balance sheet to hedge liquidity risk?

And out of curiosity, how do you guys feel about the level of institutional appetite for self-custody offerings like BTC to retail investors, once the regulatory mudslinging is over and we have a decent framework to work with?

I think the risk of global dedollarisation is largely overblown short to mid term, but the US deficit and limitless debt ceiling has me asking very serious questions about where I want to park my wealth long term.

Thanks again. Have a great evening.
 
@bromster Not really.

Liquidity risk is not a capitalised risk. Under the banking regulations the only risks that are capitalised are: Credit, Market, and Operational. In the case of banks, "Capital" is made up of a few things and the ratios are defined at a few different levels. You have your CET1 Ratio (Common Equity Tier 1) which is just equity as defined by accountants. You then have your Tier 1 Ratio which defined Tier 1 Capital as Common Equity + certain preference shares. And finally you have your Total Capital Adequacy Ratio which is Tier 1 + certain subordinated debt. All three of these are reported by banks and the regulation specify minimums for each of these ratios (they have moved a bit since I worked in this area but I think the minimums are around 8%, 10% and 12.5% respectively in SA). So effectively these risks are covered by the Equity vs Asset parts of the balance sheet. The idea here being that any losses suffered from these risks will first impact retained earnings, then shareholders, then preference share holders, then sub-debt holders and only then would they impact depositors (i.e. this is largely designed to protect depositors).

Liquidity risk is not a capitalised risk. The bank regulations still have requirements around it though. Namely the Net Stable Funding Ratio (NSFR) and the Liquidity Cover Ratio (LCR). The NSFR speaks to minimum percentages of "stable" deposits that a bank need to have relative to how much they lend out (in this case "stable" usually means deposits from individuals rather than companies and term deposits rather than call deposits). The LCR requires certain percentages of "liquid" assets to be held relative to average or expected cash outflows/withdrawals over a 30 day horizon (iirc). These liquid assets include: cash, cash held with the SARB, and Govi bonds (the trick here being that only holding long-dated Govi bonds can bite you in the ass so a bank should hold a spread of maturities matched to it's liability profile [which is what SVB did not do]). So these risks are covered by the Asset vs Liability parts of the balance sheet. Liquidity risks often occur not because the bank has made any losses (or is insolvent), but because it does not have sufficient cash reserves or liquid assets to cover higher than expected withdrawals (i.e. insufficient readily available assets to finance realised liabilities)
 
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