Another "Investing / shares" thread - please help

[SauRoNZA]

So some of you have actually made some money through investing.. ?

Made about R18 000 off a R100k last year. And that's an Alexander Forbes managed fund, not even something I keep an eye on myself.

 

[SauRoNZA]

Sort of... the golden rule of investing and personal finance is: "Pay yourself first"
What this means is that you need to put that money away at the start of the month and adjust your spending accordingly. Not the other way round. Takes lots of discipline

You are exactly right.

Your worst enemy is yourself.

So basically "hide" the money from yourself so you never get used to it being there...then you also won't feel the urge to "bail yourself out" with that money every time an "emergency" happens that isn't really such an emergency.

Number one failure most people have is that the moment they have more money coming in for whatever reason they make up something to buy with the money, something they normally don't need.

Someone gets an increase of 10% and instead of "hiding" that money from themselves they suddenly think of some magical new expense...even though they were living quite happily within their means just the month before.

That being said there is a fine balance between hoarding all your money (and ultimately never enjoying life) or burning it all on stuff you don't need.

When I get my Tax return every year for instance I do sort of a 2 or 3-way split, some goes towards purely buying whatever I like or going to eat somewhere fancy or just generally enjoying life. Another portion will go into something for the house that normally needs doing but wasn't a high priority and then the third will be invested in some shape or form...normally just being dumped in my bond.

 

[marco]

Yes it is the best without any doubt. The point is not to grow the capital here but rather to have a stash ready in case of emergency.

It really depends on how accessable you need the emergency fund to be. I like the option as I have instant access to it with its own debit card. If you are happy to wait a day or two to access the funds then as Clint said a unit trust is also a very good option as you will get much better returns, but you might need to put in more cash per month depending on the service provider. Go have a look at Allen Gray and Coronation websites and see what they require and charge.

Also please please please ignore Marco. I cannot stress this enough.

Now you explain what was wrong with my reply to the OP?

He expressed an interest in investing on the JSE and I recommended the safest and cheapest JSE LONG TERM stocks ie. Satrix Divi and Satrix Indi to start off with while he learns more about stocks.

Buying into these two on the JSE is cheaper than buying from Satrix website. These are the best performing ETF's and beat most UT's even without the management fees. No management fees on the JSE. There is only one UT that beats them and that is 36One.

We all know that equities beat all other instruments over time.

Doing this through a broker the OP can deposit money into his cash account on the JSE monthly and pick a time that is appropriate to buy like in dips to improve his performance.
This way he will learn how it works before he goes big.

Now what is wrong with this advice? I'm sure not even Clint, my arch debunker can say that this advice is not good for what the OP wants.

 

[marco]

Now please GenderBender, explain to me and the peeps here why I am winning the investor of the year on the very reputable ShareNet website.
I hope this link works. My handle is orca.
http://www.sharenet.co.za/v3/stockpicks/index.php?id=3&facebook=

It works. Just checked. I used my same shares in the competition that I have in my portfolio and keep it as such monthly.

Apology please.

 

[ClintZA]

Marco, I think you'll find that the recommendation to not follow your advice by some is probably based more on some of your previous posts rather than this one specifically. However, even in this one you say some questionable things. What do you mean that a unit trust company will not sell in a market crisis? Which company are you referring to as the ones I deal with will sell whenever you ask them to?

I think it is also the fact that in every thread you feel the need to discuss your personal achievements that irks some. Gloating is rarely smiled upon. Your repeated mention of your 80/90/100% returns is also inadvisable. You are setting others up for danger if you imply that these sorts of returns should be what they expect. When someone invests sensibly and achieves a decent 15% return they are not going to see it as such with you telling them that 80%+ is the norm.

 

[marco]

Let's keep to the topic of THIS post Clint. I was with Equinox Managed Account and the 2008 crises dropped my shares to -45%. I had to tell them to sell before it went lower. Some companies will have a stop loss.

The only reason I posted my achievements is GenderBender's remark.

No, 80% is not the norm. It is achievable though but only if you know the stock market. As you say, a 15% is decent.

After 14+ years of studying the stock market, I have achieved this. Albeit a bit late before my retirement.
This is why I recommended Satrix to the OP and JSE as a learning curve. This was his question.

 

[ClintZA]

Let's keep to the topic of THIS post Clint. I was with Equinox Managed Account and the 2008 crises dropped my shares to -45%. I had to tell them to sell before it went lower. Some companies will have a stop loss.

I am happy to stick to this post only, Marco, but you asked for reasons as to why AlmightyBender said what he did and I offered a reason.

So what you said earlier was not quite the truth then regarding them not selling in a market crisis? What you meant was they do not sell without instruction from you to do so. I think most would find this fair.

There was nothing wrong with the SATRIX advice, just beware of some of the other things you say that may call into question any advice you give. I have never personally had a go at you but if I see something that may lead others astray I will mention that.

 

[marco]

Yes, I did give "advice" on specific shares on some other posts but have ceased to do so from now onward.

 

[AlmightyBender]

I have a problem with you giving this guy any type of advice without knowing a single meaningful thing about his risk profile. The strong performance of the Satrix Divi and Indi imply that those indexes are getting riskier and riskier the more they climb. If you had said that Satrix is a good place to start and then let him make his own choices based on his goals and risk profile, then I wouldn't have said a thing.

If you were a financial advisor and you did this type of thing then the Financial Advice Ombud would not hesitate to make you pay for your clients losses. My problem with you is that you regurgitate very specific investment advice in every thread that you participate in which I view as unethical and dangerous for anyone who might take what you say at face value. If you were only more general in what you told people directly to do then nobody here would have any problem with your input.

You might also be the top performer on ShareNet but you are also very likely the riskiest and least diversified. If one tiny thing goes wrong your "portfolio" collapses. Just look at what happened to 1Net. Got investigated by the FBI and their share price dropped something like 45% instantly. It is impossible to predict something like that. An infinite amount of unpredictable events could cause a share price shock. 99.9% of of investors cannot and should not be exposed to that level of risk. It works for you and thats great. Well done I truly hope that it works out for you and you have a wonderful retirement.

And yes you do repeatedly bring up your achievements over and over. We know already.

 

[marco]

I only bring up my performance when people like you state or "plead" people not to listen to my advice. Or when someone stated that I know nothing about investing. How else can I convince people like you except with proof.
I spend at least 12 hours a day researching stocks and studying the market and have done so over the past 15 years.

I recommended Satrix to the OP of this thread as he is interested in stocks on the JSE. Satrix is diversified and is a low risk ETF that he can invest in and learn WHEN to buy into it for better gains.
This way he will not make mistakes as I did when I started by buying Top40 stocks like BIL, EXX, and such when I knew nothing about investing or these stocks. Satrix will go up over the years while he studies the market and only then can he switch to single stocks that he thinks will do better.

I started off here by giving advice on stocks to buy and what stocks I hold and received 3 PM's thanking me for the 27% and 30% they made over 3 months.
No more PM's please. I will not give stock advice.

 

[Freaksta]

I started off here by giving advice on stocks to buy and what stocks I hold and received 3 PM's thanking me for the 27% and 30% they made over 3 months.
No more PM's please. I will not give stock advice.

We'll keep you to this... No more stock advice...

 

[marco]

OK. Here goes my stock picks for December. Wait for it. A very liquid stock and will take you to great heights. Drum roll.............
SAB.

Two cases of Castle Larger for Xmas.

I bet I got your blood pressure rising there.

 

[HavocXphere]

I only bring up my performance [-]when people like you state or "plead" people not to listen to my advice.[/-] in all investment related threads.

Fixed that for you chief.

Actually kinda keen to see a noob try to implement marco's version of not-advice....

 

[marco]

Fixed that for you chief.

Actually kinda keen to see a noob try to implement marco's version of not-advice....

Glad to see you happy with my advice.

 

[Priapus]

Wow, talk about a thread derailment of note...

So, in other news, I was told yesterday that I am getting a 13th cheque this month and a 9% salary increase as of next year, January!

I've decided to settle my FNB CC completely and close it. Same for the Game account (There is like 800 still owing on it)
In the new year, the only debt I will have is the car and my cellphone contract, so that's pretty awesome and a salary increase!

I can then start my rainy day fund.

I have decided, no more credit for me. That crap is stupidly expensive. Next time, I will rather just save up for something I want. Cash is king!

 

[supersunbird]

As long as you have some "debt" like the cellphone contract and the car (all paid on time of course) you will keep you credit profile running along, which will give you a good record when buying that house or next car.

 

[Bundu]

Wow, talk about a thread derailment of note...

So, in other news, I was told yesterday that I am getting a 13th cheque this month and a 9% salary increase as of next year, January!

I've decided to settle my FNB CC completely and close it. Same for the Game account (There is like 800 still owing on it)
In the new year, the only debt I will have is the car and my cellphone contract, so that's pretty awesome and a salary increase!

I can then start my rainy day fund.

I have decided, no more credit for me. That crap is stupidly expensive. Next time, I will rather just save up for something I want. Cash is king!

congrats and good decision to get rid of CC and Game debt - Cell phone I regard as normal expenses, same as food and electricity for axample

 

[Priapus]

Well, I don't plan to cancel the cell phone contract when it's up for renewal in 2014. However, once the car is paid off, I am keeping it for a little longer and then will sell it, and whatever I get from it, I will use as a deposit for the next car I would like.

So, having a constant debt is a good thing?

If I were to go off the grid (No debt what so ever) is that a bad thing?

 

[Priapus]

congrats and good decision to get rid of CC and Game debt - Cell phone I regard as normal expenses, same as food and electricity for axample

Completely agree with you there. It's cheaper for me to be on a cell phone contract, than pre-paid scheme.

My thinking was, 50% of my bonus will clear the FNB and Game completely. The other 50% will be used to take a nice trip to the coast this December and to buy the SO that nice watch she wants for Christmas.

Starting in the new year, I will have around 1k extra is salary increase and my outgoings will have dropped by the same about. So, I will finally be in a position to start saving properly.

 

[Bundu]

having no debt for an extended period, clears your recent credit history and could make getting a loan difficult.

Also remember that a car is probably the worst investment you can do, so never 'spoil' yourself with a fancy car whilst you are trying to save