Apple's Message to Customers

[ngwe23]

It's all explained in the request, genius.
Customised ROM that prevents any data from being deleted and allows for repeated pin inputs with no delay.
Simple.
And then once this is opened, the customised ROM is then destroyed.

I see you didn't look up the word "precedence". How long before China and Russian come knocking requiring that all iPhones sold in those countries have a special ROM. Apple's credibility goes out the window. The stakes couldn't be any higher.

 

[LazyLion]

I see you didn't look up the word "precedence". How long before China and Russian come knocking requiring that all iPhones sold in those countries have a special ROM. Apple's credibility goes out the window. The stakes couldn't be any higher.

Apple still retains control over the requests and the design of their phones.
Nothing has to change.
Anybody can try to brute force a phone by entering 10,000 pin codes, in this case they are just asking apple to make the process faster.

 

[ngwe23]

Apple still retains control over the requests and the design of their phones.
Nothing has to change.
Anybody can try to brute force a phone by entering 10,000 pin codes, in this case they are just asking apple to make the process faster.

And you do not consider this to be a step in the wrong direction? You are naive if you think that this is government's final goal. This request is just the thin end of a wedge. BB security is trash now because they made compromises such as this.

 

[bwana]

Apple still retains control over the requests and the design of their phones.
Nothing has to change.
Anybody can try to brute force a phone by entering 10,000 pin codes, in this case they are just asking apple to make the process faster.

Depending on how the phone was set up on the 11th attempt the OS might erase all the data on the phone.

Even, in the unlikely event that has not been enabled, the delay between entries increases after every incorrect attempt. IIRC after the 9th attempt the delay is an hour or more so those 10000 attempts would take more than a year.

 

[LazyLion]

And you do not consider this to be a step in the wrong direction? You are naive if you think that this is government's final goal. This request is just the thin end of a wedge. BB security is trash now because they made compromises such as this.

We don't live in a perfect world, we have nut jobs trying to perform mass killings on innocent people.
I know that it would be great to have 100% infallible privacy, but there has to be a trade off.
I am not a fan of government surveillance, and I agree with Apple that is has to be avoided.
But I don't think that opening this one phone is going to affect that at all.
All Apple is doing is making it possible for the Feds to brute force this one phone.
That procedure can be done clinically and in a controlled manner so that no other phones are compromised.

I know Apple is trying to look all Noble here and like a champion of privacy rights, but the trade off is that they are looking like unpatriotic A-holes who don't want to help protect innocent people.

 

[LazyLion]

Depending on how the phone was set up on the 11th attempt the OS might erase all the data on the phone.

Even, in the unlikely event that has not been enabled, the delay between entries increases after every incorrect attempt. IIRC after the 9th attempt the delay is an hour or more so those 10000 attempts would take more than a year.

See Post #39.

 

[bwana]

See Post #39.

I was responding to your assertion that "Anybody can try to brute force a phone by entering 10,000 pin codes".

 

[LazyLion]

I was responding to your assertion that "Anybody can try to brute force a phone by entering 10,000 pin codes".

Which I had addressed already at post #39.

 

[ngwe23]

We don't live in a perfect world, we have nut jobs trying to perform mass killings on innocent people.
I know that it would be great to have 100% infallible privacy, but there has to be a trade off.
I am not a fan of government surveillance, and I agree with Apple that is has to be avoided.
But I don't think that opening this one phone is going to affect that at all.
All Apple is doing is making it possible for the Feds to brute force this one phone.
That procedure can be done clinically and in a controlled manner so that no other phones are compromised.

I know Apple is trying to look all Noble here and like a champion of privacy rights, but the trade off is that they are looking like unpatriotic A-holes who don't want to help protect innocent people.

Moving the goal posts. You have broadened the discussion from Apple to rights to privacy in general. I am not prepared to have that discussion now.

 

[icyrus]

I know Apple is trying to look all Noble here and like a champion of privacy rights, but the trade off is that they are looking like unpatriotic A-holes who don't want to help protect innocent people.

Yeah because the US government in particular has a long track record of not abusing their position and technology to breach people's rights for no other reason than that they can, all in service of this ridiculous think-of-the-children smokescreen.

 

[LazyLion]

Yeah because the US government in particular has a long track record of not abusing their position and technology to breach people's rights for no other reason than that they can, all in service of this ridiculous think-of-the-children smokescreen.

14 people dead and 22 Injured is not a "smoke screen"....

The attack was the second-deadliest mass shooting in California after the 1984 San Ysidro McDonald's massacre, and the deadliest in the U.S. since the 2012 Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting.[8][9] It was also the worst terrorist attack to occur in the U.S. since the September 11 attacks.

 

[icyrus]

14 people dead and 22 Injured is not a "smoke screen"....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_San_Bernardino_attack

Terrorism (domestic or foreign) poses no real threat to the US. The loss of life is tragic but not cause for giving government unwarranted power that cannot be undone.

Power hungry government officials and politicians prey on people's emotions around events like these to empower themselves at all of our expense. They are aided and abetted by people who cannot properly weigh risks and are prone to unfounded fears.

Make the world a better place and reject this idiocy before it takes root.

 

[noxibox]

14 people dead and 22 Injured is not a "smoke screen"....

Yes, it is a smokescreen. They use every opportunity to increase their powers and expand surveillance.

It's all explained in the request, genius.
Customised ROM that prevents any data from being deleted and allows for repeated pin inputs with no delay.
Simple.
And then once this is opened, the customised ROM is then destroyed.

If it were done internally at Apple, with only a few people involved, the code locked down with steps taken to make sure it cannot even leave the room, then maybe. You put it into the hands of the FBI and they will try to take it to use again.

 

[kianm]

How would mr cook feel if it had been his daughter murdered?

He is gay though?

 

[Dave]

This story just took a strange turn.

In an interesting turn of events, it has been revealed that the Apple ID passcode tied to the iPhone involved in the current tussle between Apple and the FBI was changed after it was in the custody of the U.S. government.

As reported by Buzzfeed News, Apple executives revealed that the company had been in touch with the government and working on a solution to accessing the San Bernardino shooter's iPhone since January. When testing one possible solution, the company discovered that the Apple ID passcode associated with the iPhone had been changed, making it more difficult to access the information the FBI is after:

The executives said the company had been in regular discussions with the government since early January, and that it proposed four different ways to recover the information the government is interested in without building a back door. One of those methods would have involved connecting the phone to a known wifi network.

Apple sent engineers to try that method, the executives said, but the experts were unable to do it. It was then that they discovered that the Apple ID passcode associated with the phone had been changed.

http://www.imore.com/san-bernardino-shooters-iphone-passcode-was-changed-while-government-custody

So who changed the password while it was in the custody of the FBI?

 

[Dave]

The Apple ID password linked to the iPhone belonging to one of the San Bernardino terrorists was changed less than 24 hours after the government took possession of the device, senior Apple executives said Friday. If that hadn’t happened, Apple said, a backup of the information the government was seeking may have been accessible.

The executives said the company had been in regular discussions with the government since early January, and that it proposed four different ways to recover the information the government is interested in without building a backdoor. One of those methods would have involved connecting the iPhone to a known Wi-Fi network and triggering an iCloud backup that might provide the FBI with information stored to the device between the October 19th and the date of the incident.

Apple sent trusted engineers to try that method, the executives said, but they were unable to do it. It was then that they discovered that the Apple ID password associated with the iPhone had been changed. (The FBI claimed earlier Friday that this was done by someone at the San Bernardino Health Department.)

http://www.buzzfeed.com/johnpaczkow...asscode-changed-in-government-cust#.qrv6VX0K0

 

[LazyLion]

So who changed the password while it was in the custody of the FBI?

It was the FBI themselves...
http://gizmodo.com/san-bernardino-county-calls-the-fbi-liars-over-terroris-1760317923

 

[Dave]

It was the FBI themselves...
http://gizmodo.com/san-bernardino-county-calls-the-fbi-liars-over-terroris-1760317923

I realised that , I meant which individual, and why isn't s/he being prosecuted for obstructing the case? Why doesn't s/he disclose the code s/he changed it to?

 

[bwana]

I realised that , I meant which individual, and why isn't s/he being prosecuted for obstructing the case? Why doesn't s/he disclose the code s/he changed it to?

I think the new details need to be entered on the phone before it can sync again which they can't do because…

 

[Dave]

I think the new details need to be entered on the phone before it can sync again which they can't do because…

So a definite case of obstruction of justice by whoever authorised the password change...