Are privately owned power plants the solution?

Are private power plants the solution?

  • Yes

    Votes: 232 84.4%

  • No

    Votes: 13 4.7%

  • Other

    Votes: 30 10.9%
  • Total voters
    275
Jaws677 said:
Did private schooling make an improvement in the education of our kids?

Does private healthcare look after the government employees and their families?

Do we use couriers to make sure our packages get delivered?

Is it armed response companies driving up and down suburb streets at night ?

Which airline do you book with when planning a trip and you want to make sure you get to go as planned?

So yes IPP seems to be the way forward
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All of those things have some degree of choice applied to them.

If that isn't the case with IPP it will mean continuously higher energy prices.
 
konfab said:
All of those things have some degree of choice applied to them.

If that isn't the case with IPP it will mean continuously higher energy prices.
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This is true, in most other countries there is a choice of provider and they compete with their unit pricing.
Imagine you had private companies doing that in SA, I mean we could actually have deregulated electricity and municipalities wouldn't be involved in power distribution either, so we could have them focus on the other issues.
 
Lupus said:
This is true, in most other countries there is a choice of provider and they compete with their unit pricing.
Imagine you had private companies doing that in SA, I mean we could actually have deregulated electricity and municipalities wouldn't be involved in power distribution either, so we could have them focus on the other issues.
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If they really wanted to solve the issues with South African infrastructure, getting the private sector to own the infrastructure, like it does with fibre, is the solution.

If the municipalities wanted their revenue stream, it would be to go and dig ducts that are large enough to accommodate multiple service providers, then rent them to private infrastructure to provide water, electricity etc.
 
As long as they are not funding the ANC. It must be a level playing field. No BEE, no ANC donations,...... The best quality at the right price.

But then South Africa, woke up and my coffee was cold.
 
Yes because its become quite obvious that under this government we are simply not going anywhere but down..
 
Lupus said:
People think renewables are the pancea to the power issues, forgetting they don't run all the time, unless they have storage or diversified but you'll need a lot to make up generation.
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You mean much like Escom, do not run all the time- need a lot ($$$) to make up generation. I am good with renewables and storage. SA has loads of sun and even loads of wind at times. No problem here.
 
ES1 said:
You mean much like Escom, do not run all the time- need a lot ($$$) to make up generation. I am good with renewables and storage. SA has loads of sun and even loads of wind at times. No problem here.
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you've not seen the dismal numbers for renewables.
 
Private power stations have been tried around the world and are not a silver bullet. They definitely can help when you have an incompetent government running state owned institutions. The issue is private companies are more than capable of ratcheting up prices to maximize profit at the expense of people (look at pharmaceutical companies). The high cost of building power plants means new entrants will make very sure of the financial returns before comitting and will want guarantees from someone for a minimum price before committing to landing the infrastructure so they don't make a loss.

Anyways, its very complex and fully deregulated may not be the best idea as for a fully privatized power sector their ideal operating level will be a position of some scarcity to ensure higher prices although they will control that with tiered pricing rather than load shedding I would imagine (you make no money during load shedding).
 
Private power stations have been tried around the world and are not a silver bullet. They definitely can help when you have an incompetent government running state owned institutions. The issue is private companies are more than capable of ratcheting up prices to maximize profit at the expense of people (look at pharmaceutical companies). The high cost of building power plants means new entrants will make very sure of the financial returns before comitting and will want guarantees from someone for a minimum price before committing to landing the infrastructure so they don't make a loss.

Anyways, its very complex and fully deregulated may not be the best idea as for a fully privatized power sector their ideal operating level will be a position of some scarcity to ensure higher prices although they will control that with tiered pricing rather than load shedding I would imagine (you make no money during load shedding).
 
bwana said:
Will the influx of private power plants prove to be the solution to our Eskom woes?
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It is not an either/or option, so neither "yes" or "no" is the answer.
Simply get out of the way and stop resisting the process of allowing private initiatives. And by doing so, you will also allow grid-tied small scale generation. Just set the rules and standards and stand back.
 
Cius said:
Private power stations have been tried around the world and are not a silver bullet. They definitely can help when you have an incompetent government running state owned institutions. The issue is private companies are more than capable of ratcheting up prices to maximize profit at the expense of people (look at pharmaceutical companies). The high cost of building power plants means new entrants will make very sure of the financial returns before comitting and will want guarantees from someone for a minimum price before committing to landing the infrastructure so they don't make a loss.

Anyways, its very complex and fully deregulated may not be the best idea as for a fully privatized power sector their ideal operating level will be a position of some scarcity to ensure higher prices although they will control that with tiered pricing rather than load shedding I would imagine (you make no money during load shedding).
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Pretty much this actually at the end of the day.

Private power stations are only part of the equation, we also need a proper operating model around it which manages the pricing/distribution. Somehow we need to get governments sticky fingers out of the pie but we still need a central controlling body to keep the costs under control.
 
Lupus said:
People think renewables are the pancea to the power issues, forgetting they don't run all the time, unless they have storage or diversified but you'll need a lot to make up generation.
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When I see "arguments" like this then I always wonder who these mythical beings are who actually forget that the sun does not shine all day, and the wind does not blow all day.

The reality, near as I can tell, is that the people who come with "arguments" such as yours seem to typically want some god, or incredible genius, to come up with 100% of the solution to 100% of the problem AND deliver it in their laps. All in one fell swoop. It does not seem to even compute to them that you can use different solutions to solve parts of a problem. And at different times. One after the other. And, in a generally beneficial way even when you're lucky.

Why is that?

How do you cook a whale?
 
The Trutherizer said:
When I see "arguments" like this then I always wonder who these mythical beings are who actually forget that the sun does not shine all day, and the wind does not blow all day.

The reality, near as I can tell, is that the people who come with "arguments" such as yours seem to typically want some god, or incredible genius, to come up with 100% of the solution to 100% of the problem AND deliver it in their laps. All in one fell swoop. It does not seem to even compute to them that you can use different solutions to solve parts of a problem. And at different times. One after the other. And, in a generally beneficial way even when you're lucky.

Why is that?

How do you cook a whale?
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oh no I don't want some god or miracle, I know that renewables aren't a magic bullet.
 
Lupus said:
oh no I don't want some god or miracle, I know that renewables aren't a magic bullet.
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You are wrong. It is a magic bullet. Just not to the entire problem right now. To some parts of it? Absolutely. Big, important parts as well. Problems which, if solved, could be amazing for the economy even. And not as a second best solution either. Best in place - Through and through.
Subtle difference.
 
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