Can I Revert Code Back For Non Payment?

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shauntir

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So, I was young and stupid and had no idea what I was doing.

It was my first time as a freelancing and first time doing any form of business. Actually started out because of a post on this site. Anyways, the first client was an intro from someone on this forum. The client needed work urgently done and so I rushed to do it. We didn't draw up documents and only had verbal agreements.

Simply, I'd do the work and get paid a month later after his clients paid him. However, I then took on another project for him that was handed to me from said poster on this forum. It was a long term project that we estimated not be more than a 100 hours. However, as time went on, it got longer and longer.

The agreement was that I just log the time for work done. However, I did request payment a month and a half later and received some payment. Then, I continued for another 2 months however, I kept requesting payment for the rest of the work already done. These emails were ignored.

Finally, I simply said I need payment with no excuses! Got an email saying he couldn't since the client wasn't willing to pay yet. I then terminated doing business with him (in a very nice manner actually). Shortly after, I kept emailing for payment.

It has been 1.5 months now and he keeps on saying his client hasn't paid him. With no written agreement, am I within my rights to revert the system back to a point in time - the date from which I haven't received payment based on the number of hours owed?


TL;DR

Can I "revert" a system back to a point in time for non payment even though we had no writted agreement?
 
IMO - if you have access to the installed system I would revert or remove it completely until payment has been made.
Was also in a similar situation when I started contracting in 2005.
Lesson learned. Will never do any work without some form of deposit for projects or an agreement for retainers.
For web applications I typically go 50% deposit before starting, 30% when it reaches staging and the final 20% when it gets to production. Thankfully I don't do these types of projects anymore. They are mostly retainers ongoing indefinitely which suits me better.
 
I wonder if the myBB contact will recognise that he introduced you to this person and if he'll comment?

I'd love to know who the forum member is.
 
Not really. Btw, only certain types of contract have to be in writing, and your verbal contract is perfectly valid. The only difficulty is proving what the contract is when it comes to a dispute.

So, start by building a paper record.

The heart of your case is that the other party has failed to deliver their part of the agreement, ie payment. Your action at law is for specific performance, or, failing that, cancellation of the contact.

Write them a registered letter stating that you have completed your side of the contact (describe all the contractual elements) by delivering your side of the work whole and entire on X date, and asking for payment by Y date (say, 15 to 30 days hence).

On failure to pay, write a final letter demanding payment within two weeks or legal action. Reserve your rights.

After that, Small Claims Court, or speak to your lawyer.
 
Some interesting points.

Mike Smit, I 100% agree. Getting at least a 30% deposit upfront is a must.

Mmaumau, he possibly could. He did advise me to get a written document but silly me just didn't make enough time for it.

Arthur, the verbal contract does have a few holes in it as well. For example, on a project that he contracted out to me, he paid 50% upfront and hence, that would violate the general agreement of being paid only once his client pays him?

Also, we did not discuss the full details on take over of the long-term project. Would him providing part payment while I was working on this project then lead to the fact that the original "payment on his client paying first" be void? Not to mention, when we terminated business, he used the 50% deposit for the other project as part payment for the long-term one.

I have sent through the invoice some time ago and it does have a due date.

I will follow your suggestion and send through a registered mail with said information. I would also like to add the rule of reverting the system back if I do not receive payment in the registered mail. Will look into the small claims cour and try finding a lawyer. Though that is gonna cost $$$
 
shauntir said:
Some interesting points.

Mike Smit, I 100% agree. Getting at least a 30% deposit upfront is a must.

Mmaumau, he possibly could. He did advise me to get a written document but silly me just didn't make enough time for it.

Arthur, the verbal contract does have a few holes in it as well. For example, on a project that he contracted out to me, he paid 50% upfront and hence, that would violate the general agreement of being paid only once his client pays him?

Also, we did not discuss the full details on take over of the long-term project. Would him providing part payment while I was working on this project then lead to the fact that the original "payment on his client paying first" be void? Not to mention, when we terminated business, he used the 50% deposit for the other project as part payment for the long-term one.

I have sent through the invoice some time ago and it does have a due date.

I will follow your suggestion and send through a registered mail with said information. I would also like to add the rule of reverting the system back if I do not receive payment in the registered mail. Will look into the small claims cour and try finding a lawyer. Though that is gonna cost $$$
Click to expand...

I would suggest not removing anything yet as then he does not have to pay you. Going the small claims route, you need to register a letter requesting the payment ( email is still a bit iffy in the court of law). You don't need a lawyer since it's a small claims court. After the registered letter, you go to the SC court, this will need to be in his magisterial district.
After filling in the approriate documentation, they will supply you with a summons that you give to the master of the court, this is in triplicate, your copy, and the other two, Original & his copy, you give to the sheriff of the court, this cost is about R80.00 for them to deliver, & can be reclaimed as well. You need to go back to the Sheriff of the Court once they have delivered it for you to collect the original & the R80.00 invoice.
Ensure that you have all your correspondence with you on the evening of the court case. Write down as much as you can remember for your own notes & cross-index it for easy referral.
A small claims court does not work on Guilty or Not-Guilty, but the balance of probablilities that the money is owing to you. If you had to remove the code, he has then not got it & very likely you will lose, even though you spent time writing it.
You want to prove that you were more than reasonable requesting the payment, you gave him more than a reasonable chance to pay and you have been over-accomodating to make him happy with the program.
 
patrick123 said:
I would suggest not removing anything yet as then he does not have to pay you. Going the small claims route, you need to register a letter requesting the payment ( email is still a bit iffy in the court of law). You don't need a lawyer since it's a small claims court. After the registered letter, you go to the SC court, this will need to be in his magisterial district.
After filling in the approriate documentation, they will supply you with a summons that you give to the master of the court, this is in triplicate, your copy, and the other two, Original & his copy, you give to the sheriff of the court, this cost is about R80.00 for them to deliver, & can be reclaimed as well. You need to go back to the Sheriff of the Court once they have delivered it for you to collect the original & the R80.00 invoice.
Ensure that you have all your correspondence with you on the evening of the court case. Write down as much as you can remember for your own notes & cross-index it for easy referral.
A small claims court does not work on Guilty or Not-Guilty, but the balance of probablilities that the money is owing to you. If you had to remove the code, he has then not got it & very likely you will lose, even though you spent time writing it.
You want to prove that you were more than reasonable requesting the payment, you gave him more than a reasonable chance to pay and you have been over-accomodating to make him happy with the program.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. It is very helpful. Won't be reverting code. My only hurdle is that he is in Cape Town and I'm in Durban. So going to his magisterial distrinct is going to probably be more costly... Still though, will see if there is a way around that.

If the amount wasn't "large" according to my standards (+R28k).
 
shauntir said:
Will look into the small claims cour and try finding a lawyer. Though that is gonna cost $$$
Click to expand...
I speak under correction, but no lawyers are allowed in the small claims court. It is just you, him and the magistrate.
 
Just had a look. R 15 000 is the maximum amount that I could claim.

Guess I send the registerd mail, keep bugging him and then get legal council if he still doesn't pay. If that is too costly, then revert back would be my only option so that he too feels the "pain".
 
I think you can only claim a maximum of R12K from the SCC.

*edit* You are right R15K is it.
 
Getting a lawyer is a bit iffy. Although they could get someone to represent you in Cape Town, you have to pay them up front even though you can add their costs onto the total amount.
The defendant will most probably claim that he cannot pay and will go through what is called a "Section 65" to see how much he can afford to pay you monthly. Of course with him working for himself, a garnishee order won't help either.
 
patrick123 said:
Getting a lawyer is a bit iffy. Although they could get someone to represent you in Cape Town, you have to pay them up front even though you can add their costs onto the total amount.
The defendant will most probably claim that he cannot pay and will go through what is called a "Section 65" to see how much he can afford to pay you monthly. Of course with him working for himself, a garnishee order won't help either.
Click to expand...

Oi :(

Think this is one of the biggest lessons I've learnt. Could have avoided it entirely. If only I was firm with what I knew was right and never budge. Sometimes when you want to start off and bag that first client, you end up doing more harm than good.

*Edit* don't know how much of a difference this makes but I'm a registered PTY and he would probably be a CC or sole prop from the looks of it.
 
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Too early to take it back - if you do you will almost certainly end up with nothing. Bespoke code isn't just stock you can resell to someone else...
 
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shauntir said:
So, I was young and stupid and had no idea what I was doing.

It was my first time as a freelancing and first time doing any form of business. Actually started out because of a post on this site. Anyways, the first client was an intro from someone on this forum. The client needed work urgently done and so I rushed to do it. We didn't draw up documents and only had verbal agreements.

Simply, I'd do the work and get paid a month later after his clients paid him. However, I then took on another project for him that was handed to me from said poster on this forum. It was a long term project that we estimated not be more than a 100 hours. However, as time went on, it got longer and longer.

The agreement was that I just log the time for work done. However, I did request payment a month and a half later and received some payment. Then, I continued for another 2 months however, I kept requesting payment for the rest of the work already done. These emails were ignored.

Finally, I simply said I need payment with no excuses! Got an email saying he couldn't since the client wasn't willing to pay yet. I then terminated doing business with him (in a very nice manner actually). Shortly after, I kept emailing for payment.

It has been 1.5 months now and he keeps on saying his client hasn't paid him. With no written agreement, am I within my rights to revert the system back to a point in time - the date from which I haven't received payment based on the number of hours owed?


TL;DR

Can I "revert" a system back to a point in time for non payment even though we had no writted agreement?
Click to expand...

Next time have a simple contract drafted noting you own the code until payment is received in full.

Of course none of this matters if you really need the money.
 
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If you have access to the system, remove all of your code ASAP.
 
if "your" code is on their system, you may not log in and delete it.

this I guess is similar to you cant break into someones house to take back what someone stole from you
 
Also, it is probably no longer your code. Unless you expressly agreed that you retain ownership until full payment, ownership probably passed when you delivered the code to them. The fact that they haven't yet paid in full is an accounts receivable problem. By unilaterally disabling/crippling it or removing it from their systems exposes you to severe legal repercussions.

Of course you will in future reduce all these provisions and contingencies to writing.
 
Well, there is a mutual understanding that the code only belongs to the client upon full payment.

I will not remove the code yet. I will send through a registered mail detailing our business "agreements" and if I do not receive payment, removal of the code for the time not paid will be enforced.

In that way, the client has notice of this and I would not be doing it unilaterally. I know he could technically take a backup, though, this way, I would have legal standing. Also, when we met earlier this year, he verbally agreed that he would pay irrespective of his client paying him or not. Does that hold any ground?

Should he not agree to the terms of the registered mail, I think I may try the small claims court for the maximum amount possible.


On a side note, I have my now "new" agreements with clients that expresses that code only belongs to the client upon full payment. I just reverted some code for a client due to non payment since that is legal.

With this guy, its too complex without things in writing...
 
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