Car dealer problems

[josh_lister]

Hi guys

I'm looking for a bit of advice on dealing with a dealer that I recently bought a car from.
Once I paid for the car, firstly I noticed that there wasn't a shelf in the boot- that usually come with the car (polo). After I asked the guy I was dealing with me, he didn't seem to know much about it, and told me it was an optional extra (this is a second hand car, so I wasn't dealing with a vw dealer). I asked him to contact the previous owner about it. It's not such a big deal, but still.

Secondly, also after paying for the car, they didn't have spare keys for the car, something they didn't tell me beforehand. Again, he said he would contact the previous owner to ask for them. After (finally) getting back to me about it, he said that the previous owner has moved and cannot find the spare keys.

So is that just that, must I simply go and pay over R2k for a new set, or should they do this for me? I'm thinking the latter, because they didn't tell me that they didn't have any spares for the car beforehand, and you would assume that they do.

Thanks

 

[hondaboysa]

i'm assuming you asking if the car comes with spare-keys? Or was it advertised with spare-keys?

 

[dj_jyno]

You're right - the parcel shelf is standard equipment. Dealer should pay for the spare keys.

 

[Fazda]

You're right - the parcel shelf is standard equipment. Dealer should pay for the spare keys.

^^^ This.

One of the questions we always ask when we are trading in, is if the car has spare keys - if not we take the cost off the trade in value - the dealer has to supply.

 

[josh_lister]

i'm assuming you asking if the car comes with spare-keys? Or was it advertised with spare-keys?

I assumed it did. They didn't seem to know if there were spare keys until I collected the car, signed all the paperwork etc. That's when they looked for them and told me there weren't any and they'd ask the previous owner.

It wasn't advertised with spares, but wouldn't you assume that it does come with them? I guess you shouldn't assume anything with used car salesman...

 

[Fazda]

I assumed it did. They didn't seem to know if there were spare keys until I collected the car, signed all the paperwork etc. That's when they looked for them and told me there weren't any and they'd ask the previous owner.

It wasn't advertised with spares, but wouldn't you assume that it does come with them? I guess you shouldn't assume anything with used car salesman...

As the new buyer, you can insist on the spare keys, and they don't have a leg to stand on, it's their problem as to how they get them, not yours.

 

[josh_lister]

As the new buyer, you can insist on the spare keys, and they don't have a leg to stand on, it's their problem as to how they get them, not yours.

Thought so, just needed a second opinion. Thanks, will be going down there sometime soon. What about the parcel shelf- not as much of a big deal, but is still standard equipment on the car

 

[Dean]

Obviously these are all opinions, and here is mine.

Buying a second hand car is just that - second hand and not new - not as it came out of the factory.
If its sold as is, and something as obvious and 'in your face' as the parcel shelf wasn't there when you viewed the car, then I'm not sure it would be a stretch to assume it didn't come with the car (for whatever reason).

The spare keys - this isn't as obvious or clear-cut.
Generally one expects spare keys so the 'reasonable person' test would probably apply if this were in a court, but being second-hand, again one can't expect all the extras.
My opinion is that spare keys are an extra - one that the car doesn't need to run, and the lack thereof isn't a defect, and therefore wouldn't have to be disclosed.

Just my non-legal 2c and probably worth exactly that.

 

[Fazda]

Obviously these are all opinions, and here is mine.

Buying a second hand car is just that - second hand and not new - not as it came out of the factory.
If its sold as is, and something as obvious and 'in your face' as the parcel shelf wasn't there when you viewed the car, then I'm not sure it would be a stretch to assume it didn't come with the car (for whatever reason).

The spare keys - this isn't as obvious or clear-cut.
Generally one expects spare keys so the 'reasonable person' test would probably apply if this were in a court, but being second-hand, again one can't expect all the extras.
My opinion is that spare keys are an extra - one that the car doesn't need to run, and the lack thereof isn't a defect, and therefore wouldn't have to be disclosed.

Just my non-legal 2c and probably worth exactly that.

Valid points, however, any reputable dealership will supply the spares, as I said earlier, it's factored into the price that they pay for the car in the first place.

 

[catman37]

What's the name of this dealership?

 

[josh_lister]

What's the name of this dealership?

It's CMH Honda Menlyn, in Pretoria. So a reputable dealer

I agree with you Dean, to an extent, but a spare key, IMO is like when buying a cell phone and getting a charger with it in the box. You don't per se need it for it to work, but you expect it to be there. (for lack of a better example)
I think that if they don't have a spare for the car, then they need to tell you that, or give you a few thousand off so that you can buy one yourself

 

[Fazda]

It's CMH Honda Menlyn, in Pretoria. So a reputable dealer

I agree with you Dean, to an extent, but a spare key, IMO is like when buying a cell phone and getting a charger with it in the box. You don't per se need it for it to work, but you expect it to be there. (for lack of a better example)
I think that if they don't have a spare for the car, then they need to tell you that, or give you a few thousand off so that you can buy one yourself

You should be pretty safe with CMH - if the salesman gives you a hard time, insist on chatting to the DP - that should sort it out .

 

[josh_lister]

You should be pretty safe with CMH - if the salesman gives you a hard time, insist on chatting to the DP - that should sort it out .

Thanks will do!

 

[Dean]

I agree with you Dean, to an extent, but a spare key, IMO is like when buying a cell phone and getting a charger with it in the box. You don't per se need it for it to work, but you expect it to be there. (for lack of a better example)
I think that if they don't have a spare for the car, then they need to tell you that, or give you a few thousand off so that you can buy one yourself

A bit of a bad example there... we're talking here about a spare/second; so it's like buying a second-hand mobile phone and receiving only 1 rather than 2 chargers in the box, in a parallel universe where most/all new mobile phones come with two chargers.

Anyway, I'm not here to argue my points, just gave my opinion as requested - though I hope you get sorted out either way

 

[Fazda]

A bit of a bad example there... we're talking here about a spare/second; so it's like buying a second-hand mobile phone and receiving only 1 rather than 2 chargers in the box, in a parallel universe where most/all new mobile phones come with two chargers.

Anyway, I'm not here to argue my points, just gave my opinion as requested - though I hope you get sorted out either way

Sorry Dean - maybe it was a bad example, but used cars do come with spare keys and it is up to the dealer who trades them in to make sure that you have a spare.

We took a car from another dealer yesterday, and one of the first questions was to ask where the spare was. When we were told that the car only had one set, the sales manager turned around to the salesman who was helping him and told him to contact both the other dealership and the first owner and to get the key. End of story.