Coding: Self teach or Bootcamp?

[Kompete]

Hi. I am working on a tech startup with some ex-colleagues (after having spent a large part of my career in corporate)
We are all commercially minded and do not have a ‘technical’ co-founder (that can code); and so are looking for a technical co-founder.

In the mean time (while we search for a tech founder) I am thinking of teaching myself to code and to start building our first prototypes and MVPs. And later we will probably hire more specialist developers, etc. Will probably use Ruby on Rails or Python/Django; however I have never coded in my life! OK maybe I did do the odd C+ course while studying engineering, but By no means a coder.

Question is:
- Can anyone recommend any coding boot camps in Joburg or should I just teach myself with online resources? Thanks

 

[Ancalagon]

Given your needs I'd teach yourself.

Learn based on the requirements of your business, not from a school. If you want your startup to work, you don't have the time for the slow pace of teaching. Besides it is extra money that you don't have to spend.

 

[CT_Biker]

Teach yourself. You can clocked up some decent skills if you are attentive and curious.

Why would you participate in the funeral observation that is Ruby?

 

[BouncyNinja]

I am looking to acquire a new skills , which language would be good for a beginner, obviously starting with a near to dead language wouldn't be ideal. What i'm looking to accomplish is a type of reverse Point of Sale system ( if that make any sense) we run a type of a buy back center , and the current software we have is horrible, and looking to do our own one

 

[Kompete]

Given your needs I'd teach yourself.

Learn based on the requirements of your business, not from a school. If you want your startup to work, you don't have the time for the slow pace of teaching. Besides it is extra money that you don't have to spend.

Makes sense

 

[Kompete]

Teach yourself. You can clocked up some decent skills if you are attentive and curious.

Why would you participate in the funeral observation that is Ruby?

I understand a lot of startup have used RoR, sine it allows for rapid prototyping. Have I got that wrong?

My needs is not to become an expert developer, but rather just to fill a skills gap in our startup team, and until we are ready to hire developer/designer

 

[CT_Biker]

I understand a lot of startup have used RoR, sine it allows for rapid prototyping. Have I got that wrong?

My needs is not to become an expert developer, but rather just to fill a skills gap in our startup team, and until we are ready to hire developer/designer

It has a focus on RESTful design, which makes working with API's easier. However further than prototyping it can become difficult to work with(hosting) further down the line It is an okay language, I am not a fan of it.

Realistically, trying to fill a skills gap is not an easy task for a new developer. You need to have good knowledge and experience with the discipline

 

[Traq]

Also, if your requirement is only prototyping, take a look at https://anvil.works/.

 

[370z]

Can you guys recommend the best platform for self-teaching? Are there enough free resources online or is there still some cost involved?

 

[Barbarian Conan]

I am looking to acquire a new skills , which language would be good for a beginner, obviously starting with a near to dead language wouldn't be ideal. What i'm looking to accomplish is a type of reverse Point of Sale system ( if that make any sense) we run a type of a buy back center , and the current software we have is horrible, and looking to do our own one

I am very partial to the Microsoft stack. In other words C# and friends. It has (had?) fewer options to choose from, making it easier to get started. I have found the documentation better and it is easy to find answers.
BUT....
Do you want to run a thick client (install an app on the PC where you will use it)? Will that PC run Windows? If yes on both, then C# with WPF.

OR

Will it be browser based? Then you can learn C# for the server side, and of course Javascript etc for the front end. I still think working off the MS demo projects will be the easiest to get the ball rolling.
There are many more options, and many more answers depending on how you want your app to work. Single page app, as is popular these days. Then you will probably only want a web-api server side and use something like Angular on the front end.
More traditional app with multiple pages? This is simpler to implement, and you can probably just work of the MS demos.

You can even just go for a nodejs server, and then only have to learn one language, but I think it is more difficult to get proper production code out of it if you are just starting out.

Can you guys recommend the best platform for self-teaching? Are there enough free resources online or is there still some cost involved?

With teaching resources, there is usually a cost involved. You get Udemy, which is once off per course, and quite expensive (can be around R2000 per course) if you don't buy on their R100 sales.

Then there's Pluralsight, which is all-you-can-learn subscription based. I prefer pluralsight because there are fewer courses, and might be better curated?
It will also be cheaper if you want to study close to "full time".

Linked in learning is another option. I've heard good things, but haven't used it myself.

 

[BouncyNinja]

I am very partial to the Microsoft stack. In other words C# and friends. It has (had?) fewer options to choose from, making it easier to get started. I have found the documentation better and it is easy to find answers.
BUT....
Do you want to run a thick client (install an app on the PC where you will use it)? Will that PC run Windows? If yes on both, then C# with WPF.

OR

Will it be browser based? Then you can learn C# for the server side, and of course Javascript etc for the front end. I still think working off the MS demo projects will be the easiest to get the ball rolling.
There are many more options, and many more answers depending on how you want your app to work. Single page app, as is popular these days. Then you will probably only want a web-api server side and use something like Angular on the front end.
More traditional app with multiple pages? This is simpler to implement, and you can probably just work of the MS demos.

You can even just go for a nodejs server, and then only have to learn one language, but I think it is more difficult to get proper production code out of it if you are just starting out.


With teaching resources, there is usually a cost involved. You get Udemy, which is once off per course, and quite expensive (can be around R2000 per course) if you don't buy on their R100 sales.

Then there's Pluralsight, which is all-you-can-learn subscription based. I prefer pluralsight because there are fewer courses, and might be better curated?
It will also be cheaper if you want to study close to "full time".

Linked in learning is another option. I've heard good things, but haven't used it myself.

Thank you , i'm very keen to broaden my knowledge, will look at the c# route

 

[Kompete]

I am very partial to the Microsoft stack. In other words C# and friends. It has (had?) fewer options to choose from, making it easier to get started. I have found the documentation better and it is easy to find answers.
BUT....
Do you want to run a thick client (install an app on the PC where you will use it)? Will that PC run Windows? If yes on both, then C# with WPF.

OR

Will it be browser based? Then you can learn C# for the server side, and of course Javascript etc for the front end. I still think working off the MS demo projects will be the easiest to get the ball rolling.
There are many more options, and many more answers depending on how you want your app to work. Single page app, as is popular these days. Then you will probably only want a web-api server side and use something like Angular on the front end.
More traditional app with multiple pages? This is simpler to implement, and you can probably just work of the MS demos.

You can even just go for a nodejs server, and then only have to learn one language, but I think it is more difficult to get proper production code out of it if you are just starting out.


With teaching resources, there is usually a cost involved. You get Udemy, which is once off per course, and quite expensive (can be around R2000 per course) if you don't buy on their R100 sales.

Then there's Pluralsight, which is all-you-can-learn subscription based. I prefer pluralsight because there are fewer courses, and might be better curated?
It will also be cheaper if you want to study close to "full time".

Linked in learning is another option. I've heard good things, but haven't used it myself.

Hmm thanks. Will check those out also! I found some RoR courses on Udemy for like R150 - and initially thought its too cheap too be good :j

 

[Ancalagon]

Python is a very popular prototyping language these days - lots of people use it to build stuff quickly and cheaply.

I wouldn't pay a cent for any course certificate. Don't. You can learn anything you need to know from tutorials, freely available. All you need is out there. All that these programming courses will do is give you a certificate to put on your CV. Is that what you really want?

Some of these courses allow you to do them for free, but you have to pay them in order to get a certificate. You could go with this option.

Don't spend money on things you don't need.

Lastly, I'd highly recommend getting a tech founder involved ASAP. They can hit the ground running much faster, plus they can give you critical advice about scaling your solution up and keeping it secure.

You should be able to build a proof of concept though, a prototype. Just don't make the mistake of taking it to production.

 

[CT_Biker]

Also, if your requirement is only prototyping, take a look at https://anvil.works/.

This is cool

 

[blunt]

I would advise finding some form of formal training - systems design and especially database design - I've come across far too many self-taughts (particularly around database design) that build systems that work just fine on small scale but fail miserably when high traffic starts to hit.

Learning the syntax of the actual language etc. is a different story, the architecture of building software is something that should not be taken lightly.

Just because you can make nice excel spreadsheets does not mean you can make a good database.

 

[Kompete]

Python is a very popular prototyping language these days - lots of people use it to build stuff quickly and cheaply.

I wouldn't pay a cent for any course certificate. Don't. You can learn anything you need to know from tutorials, freely available. All you need is out there. All that these programming courses will do is give you a certificate to put on your CV. Is that what you really want?

Some of these courses allow you to do them for free, but you have to pay them in order to get a certificate. You could go with this option.

Don't spend money on things you don't need.

Lastly, I'd highly recommend getting a tech founder involved ASAP. They can hit the ground running much faster, plus they can give you critical advice about scaling your solution up and keeping it secure.

You should be able to build a proof of concept though, a prototype. Just don't make the mistake of taking it to production.

Yes, was thinking of going with Python also. And yes my first prize it to find a technical cofounder - we are busy looking. Prototype will be purely to test with select users/customers and iterate

 

[charlieharper]

I would advise finding some form of formal training - systems design and especially database design - I've come across far too many self-taughts (particularly around database design) that build systems that work just fine on small scale but fail miserably when high traffic starts to hit.

Learning the syntax of the actual language etc. is a different story, the architecture of building software is something that should not be taken lightly.

Just because you can make nice excel spreadsheets does not mean you can make a good database.

These days even badly developed databases can handle big traffic.

To be fair, if traffic really does become a problem, as a startup with a good business model, thats a trucking good problem to have. Worst case, you'll be having some income already at that stage to sort out the traffic problem.

Teach yourself a full stack framework like Django (python) or Laravel (PHP). YouTube is full of tutorials. Make friends online with developers.

 

[blunt]

These days even badly developed databases can handle big traffic.

To be fair, if traffic really does become a problem, as a startup with a good business model, thats a trucking good problem to have. Worst case, you'll be having some income already at that stage to sort out the traffic problem.

Teach yourself a full stack framework like Django (python) or Laravel (PHP). YouTube is full of tutorials. Make friends online with developers.

i've made a significant amount of money fixing up an ex start-up's system that was built by a 'self taught' chartered accountant that made his database basically replicate spreadsheets. It's an incredibly complex system and if they had just done it right from the start they would not be in this situation and probably would cost them less. They had devs from the start but the CA thought he was the next Steve Jobs and ignored guidance on the key parts of the system ("business logic") where he wanted to do it all himself.

I speak from experience that a big fat server with the latest Microsoft SQL Server including a very pricey license cannot cope when your DB is designed like crap.

 

[cheesus]

DOn't pay thousands of rands for in-person training which is unlikely going to be of better quality than the courses on udemy / pluralsight or lynda.com.