Common Climate Change lies

Nicodeamus said:
Isn't it ironic that if you give corporations the incentive to get around their responsibility through regulation, then they end up going the easy route. You should really read a book called 'human action' by Ludwig von Mises. It describes quite well how market driven incentives work.
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Which is why we need better regulation. We already know what will happen if there is no regulation... and if you still dont, then watch the next 10 years. PS - Not ganna get into a government vs non-government debate here, thats for another thread.
 
ghoti said:
Which is why we need better regulation. We already know what will happen if there is no regulation... and if you still dont, then watch the next 10 years. PS - Not ganna get into a government vs non-government debate here, thats for another thread.
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Regulation costs money, there is always a price on regulation, therefore it makes going green more expensive. This is a fact you cannot deny facts.
 
Nicodeamus said:
Regulation costs money, there is always a price on regulation, therefore it makes going green more expensive. This is a fact you cannot deny facts.
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Not everything that is good for humanity is a profit making opportunity for some company. This is fact, you cannot deny the facts.
 
ghoti said:
Not everything that is good for humanity is a profit making opportunity for some company. This is fact, you cannot deny the facts.
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You can apply this exact same argument to government!

As for the thread, I mostly agree with the scientific views.
 
porchrat said:
LOL no but the guys operating in it are certainly there to make profit :D

Climate change tenders for all your mates!! :D
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Yup, a good example of what happens with a corrupt system. Just like with the cops. A lot of them are corrupt as well. You dont sort out the crime problem by getting rid of police, you sort it out by improving the police and removing the corrupt elements. I do believe complete transparency and accountability are required to make the system work correctly. A goal I doubt we can ever achieve with a corporate board, but something I do think we will achieve with our governments. If you look at governments 100 years from today. They were less transparent and less accountable. Slowly things are changing for the better, but this type of change takes time. The advent of the Internet is speeding it up though.
 
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100 years from today we had less governments as well. There are to many interests nowadays to have a single go greener policy.
 
Nicodeamus said:
100 years from today we had less governments as well. There are to many interests nowadays to have a single go greener policy.
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We also had less people and less to manage (meaning there are more points of management now than there were in the past as our sophistication has grown).
 
ghoti said:
Not everything that is good for humanity is a profit making opportunity for some company. This is fact, you cannot deny the facts.
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Reality though dictates that profit goes above planet earth and humanity, if something is not profitable it won't work. Let's be totally honest ghoti how many humans actually give a shyte? Do you see people driving less? Do you see cheap electric cars?

So let's say yes we are causing the planet to warm and by doing so causing the weather to change, what then? Go back to sticks and stones?

So give us an idea of what we can expect if every single person accepted that we are to blame.
 
ghoti said:
Yup, a good example of what happens with a corrupt system. Just like with the cops. A lot of them are corrupt as well. You dont sort out the crime problem by getting rid of police, you sort it out by improving the police and removing the corrupt elements. I do believe complete transparency and accountability are required to make the system work correctly. A goal I doubt we can ever achieve with a corporate board, but something I do think we will achieve with our governments. If you look at governments 100 years from today. They were less transparent and less accountable. Slowly things are changing for the better, but this type of change takes time. The advent of the Internet is speeding it up though.
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If I've garnered anything from the experiences I've had with our government it is this: If you want something done efficiently don't rely on government.

In the end when your ass isn't on the line regardless of how well you perform you're going to sit around and do nothing.

You may squeal all you want about how things are getting better but as things currently sit I wouldn't rely on this government to fry me a decent egg.
 
porchrat said:
If I've garnered anything from the experiences I've had with our government it is this: If you want something done efficiently don't rely on government.

In the end when your ass isn't on the line regardless of how well you perform you're going to sit around and do nothing.

You may squeal all you want about how things are getting better but as things currently sit I wouldn't rely on this government to fry me a decent egg.
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Well i think that applies to practically every government.
 
killadoob said:
Reality though dictates that profit goes above planet earth and humanity, if something is not profitable it won't work. Let's be totally honest ghoti how many humans actually give a shyte? Do you see people driving less? Do you see cheap electric cars?
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World wide immunizations which cost governments a load have worked. See much smallpox around the world atm?

So let's say yes we are causing the planet to warm and by doing so causing the weather to change, what then? Go back to sticks and stones?
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Build more nuke stations less coal stations.

So give us an idea of what we can expect if every single person accepted that we are to blame.
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No single rain drop believes it is guilty for the flood huh?
 
The only way I see a government working is by having a borderless society so that they can compete against each other. The US is a good example of this (well sort of).
 
porchrat said:
If I've garnered anything from the experiences I've had with our government it is this: If you want something done efficiently don't rely on government.

In the end when your ass isn't on the line regardless of how well you perform you're going to sit around and do nothing.

You may squeal all you want about how things are getting better but as things currently sit I wouldn't rely on this government to fry me a decent egg.
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Yeah, sucks that we have uneducated people running a complex system. Wished we had more educated people like in Finland. Bleery NATS really created dumb people with their Bantu Education Act :(
 
ghoti said:
Build more nuke stations less coal stations.
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From my limited knowledge of Nuke stations, it's just as harm full if not more so than Coal.
Nuclear waste has a live cycle of up to 10k years. The amount of waste we would have been going through since we started with coal would have already created a problem now where we would have been running out of space to store it safely. And that does leave a negative footprint too.

As I said, my lack of knowledge on this topic is great but it has it's own downside to not so?
 
Pitbull said:
From my limited knowledge of Nuke stations, it's just as harm full if not more so than Coal.
Nuclear waste has a live cycle of up to 10k years. The amount of waste we would have been going through since we started with coal would have already created a problem now where we would have been running out of space to store it safely. And that does leave a negative footprint too.

As I said, my lack of knowledge on this topic is great but it has it's own downside to not so?
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Well just don't build it on a fault like as they did in Japan, however Sa would be ideal for nuclear stations, the amount of waste is very little and they can just invest into refraction processes.
 
Pitbull said:
From my limited knowledge of Nuke stations, it's just as harm full if not more so than Coal.
Nuclear waste has a live cycle of up to 10k years. The amount of waste we would have been going through since we started with coal would have already created a problem now where we would have been running out of space to store it safely. And that does leave a negative footprint too.

As I said, my lack of knowledge on this topic is great but it has it's own downside to not so?
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That was true until recently. Now the Chinese have invented a way to use it so the uranium lasts 60 times longer.
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2011-01/04/content_11788510.htm

The more we invest in this technology, the longer we can make it last, the better we can deal with the waste. I personally think the way that we will have to deal with it is space disposal. Throw it at the sun. We create about 27 tonnes a year currently (without the chinese advancements). We send more weight into space with satellites for our entertainment. Dunno why we cant send it to space if its for our health. Though theyre ganna have to work out a safer system of delivery than current means. You dont really want a "Challenger" event happening with nuclear waste.

As Nico pointed out, if you dont build your nuke stations on top of fault lines, then nuclear energy is far safer than coal energy. Even with the Japanese disaster, more people die pulling coal out the ground each year than all the people combined in all the nuclear accidents together (Japan and Chernobyl - Maine Island didnt result in deaths).

Again, the amount of nuclear waste that the world produces each year is tiny in comparison.
 
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