Durban's Stadium Generates R4m

MMS hosted a World Cup semi-final, do you think that it has no suites? It has suites, but not the same amount as Kings Park. MMS has a huge third tier to add boxes.

Also, I'd love to know how much other stadiums in SA make.
 
I have been to the stadium many many times, i know it has suites, but not enough of them.

Don't think they can use the third tier to put boxes... its been designed to have temporary seating thats all.

In terms of cost :
A suite at Kings Park seems to cost about R100k per year (as of this year), and I'm pretty sure that excludes the bigger suites etc.

So at 350 suites for R100k each. that is R35000000 per year, purely off suite rental, and there is a built in 5% escalation clause in the rental contract, plus all alcohol is to bought from through the stadium "bottle store".. etc etc..

Can you see how not having enough suites is a deal breaker for the KZNRU?
 
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ToxicBunny said:
The suites are a minor issue?

Are you mad? Do you have any idea how much money the suites bring in for KZNRU?!?!
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ToxicBunny said:
I have been to the stadium many many times, i know it has suites, but not enough of them.

Don't think they can use the third tier to put boxes... its been designed to have temporary seating thats all.

In terms of cost :
A suite at Kings Park seems to cost about R100k per year (as of this year), and I'm pretty sure that excludes the bigger suites etc.

So at 350 suites for R100k each. that is R35000000 per year, purely off suite rental, and there is a built in 5% escalation clause in the rental contract, plus all alcohol is to bought from through the stadium "bottle store".. etc etc..

Can you see how not having enough suites is a deal breaker for the KZNRU?
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Why can't suits be built at MMS? Also, why are people paying so much for boxes? The Currie Cup semi-final wasn't near sold out. Alcohol sales aren't restricted to KP, that money would be made at MMS too.
 
cr@zydude said:
Why can't suits be built at MMS?
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They can, but at whose expense? Why build new when you already have? And there are far too few boxes at the stadium at present to make it financially viable. And let's not forget the fact that all new boxes will be further from the action than they currently are. Also, why fix what ain't broke?

cr@zydude said:
Also, why are people paying so much for boxes?
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Supply and demand, but that's neither here nor there in terms of this discussion. What they pay is of absolutely no concern to anyone apart from KZNRU...

cr@zydude said:
Alcohol sales aren't restricted to KP, that money would be made at MMS too.
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Not sure what you're getting at here...:confused:
 
R13... said:
What are you talking about? He says the stadium will need to bring in R250m in profit.
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Well right now it doesn't matter, cos they are not bringing in ANY profit at all!
As some of us pointed out would be the case years ago.
 
And let's not forget the high cost-base the KZNRU would have to operate from with the new stadium under their wings? Sharing of the stadium becomes another issue as well...
 
DJ... said:
And let's not forget the high cost-base the KZNRU would have to operate from with the new stadium under their wings? Sharing of the stadium becomes another issue as well...
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Sharing is hardly an issue. The Sharks host 1 game every 2 weeks, and Amazulu host 1 every week or 2. They could easily schedule around each other. The Cheetahs and Bloem Celtic are sharing Free State Stadium at the moment.

One more point, when SA bids for the RWC, which stadium do you think will be used? Do you think the IRB will be happy with decrepit stadiums like Newlands and Kings Park?
 
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There 2 parts of the deal that are "deal breakers." 1- which has been mentioned already, is that there aren't enough boxes and this is where the money is at. It is guaranteed income no matter how empty the stadium is. A possible solution might be to build a ring of executive seats but even then, it is more cost to the union or whoever has to pay for it and it means they still don't have boxes. 2 is that they would be moving from a stadium where you are on top of the action, almost literally, to where you are miles away. That is the idiotic thinking in building an Olympic stadium without having the olympics or a top tier athletic even to keep it in use. If they had used just a touch of foresight they would have brought the union in during planning and they would have either built moveable stands- as is the case at Stad de France- or allowed for enough space to just build a platform- how it is done at Wembley.

It is a pity to see at least 4 of the WC stadiums sitting empty all the time. The soccer clubs can't generate enough revenue to keep them running and we don't have the population to get rugby matches to all of them. Perhaps government should broker a deal where by the Sharks use it in some games in the S15 but stay at Kings Park for most of the season. Just as an attempt to get them and the supporters to say "ah this stadium is so nice and modern maybe we should move." I think the Stormers should play out of CT stadium entirely and WP can stay at Newlands. That one is completely mind boggling to me. If the Lions were half decent and could draw a crowd I am sure they would be playing in Soccer City rather than Ellis Park.
 
Which stadiums sit empty all the time?

Soccer City, most Kaizer Chiefs games
Ellis Park, Lions and Golden Lions, no football
Cape Town Stadium, Ajax
Moses Mabhida, Amazulu
Nelson Mandela Bay, EP Kings, no regular football
Loftus Versveld, Bulls, Blue Bulls, some Sundowns and Tuks games
Free State Stadium, Cheetahs, FS Cheetahs, some Bloem Celtic games
Mbombela Stadium, Pumas, some Wits matches
Peter Mokaba, most Black Leopards games, some Chiefs and Supersport games
 
Peter Mokaba- has games but low attendance.
Mbombela- Also, a few games but nothing that fills it up enough regularly.
Cape Town- Has had more spectators at concerts than at Ajax matches.
Moses Mabhida- As has been discussed.
Royal Ba***eng- Has Platinum Stars but not filled up- not an issue since it is privately owned.

Soccer City gets good use, NM Bay gets decent use I think. Ellis and Loftus were there before so not sure if they count.
 
cr@zydude said:
Which stadiums sit empty all the time?

Soccer City, most Kaizer Chiefs games
Ellis Park, Lions and Golden Lions, no football
Cape Town Stadium, Ajax
Moses Mabhida, Amazulu
Nelson Mandela Bay, EP Kings, no regular football
Loftus Versveld, Bulls, Blue Bulls, some Sundowns and Tuks games
Free State Stadium, Cheetahs, FS Cheetahs, some Bloem Celtic games
Mbombela Stadium, Pumas, some Wits matches
Peter Mokaba, most Black Leopards games, some Chiefs and Supersport games
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How many of those stadiums actually draw crowds that make them financially viable? Green Point, Moses Mabhida & Peter Mokaba all struggle to pay for themselves. These are multi-million rand stadiums that attract a few thousand fans every other weekend.

Ellis Park, Loftus, Bloemfontein, Kings Park & Newlands are all fine. In the case of Ellis Park, that ground was paid for ages ago.

It would have been far better to renovate and modernise the existing rugby grounds. Ground clashing would hardly be a problem anyway. In Jo'burg alone, if Ellis Park was abandoned, we have Soccer City, Orlando Stadium, Rand Stadium and the Johannesburg Athletic Stadium. With 3 major PSL clubs and one Currie Cup union/Super Rugby franchise it is pretty easy to accomodate home games for all of them in a single day; Swallows can utilise Rand Stadium, Pirates can utilise Orlando Stadium, Chiefs can utilise Jo'burg Stadium and the Lions can use Soccer City.

Truth is we have way too many underutilised grounds. PSL clubs do a horrible job of pulling crowds. According to the Sowetan the PSL average 5,000 fans per game. Even the Lions could draw more than that for a Super Rugby match, in which a severe beating was almost guaranteed. There is no way we can justify most of the new grounds we built. Sure they look nice, but they are underutilised.

EDIT: Last weekend 1,000 people pitched up to watch Black Leopards play SuperSport at the Peter Mokaba Stadium. One. Thousand. Capacity; 41,733.

While 1,000 people where up there, 2,000 folks barely squeezed into the Moses Mabhida stadium to watch AmaZulu lose to Ajax. Capacity: 54,000

Conversely 3,000 people watched Wits at the Bidvest Stadium. Capacity: 5,000
 
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Mila said:
Does soccercity make enough?
5 concerts and 3 rugby games a year?
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It gets the Soweto derbies (Chiefs vs Pirates) as well. But yeah, still not enough. That is why I say close Ellis Park (it is nightmare to get to and is in a horrible area) and rebase the Lions there.
 
From my view yes, but we know the lions has no sponsors and has been dropped from the super13/41/15/16( whatever) So I can guess the money to rent space at SS is going to be out of the question. Unless they give it to them and the people in the boxes get the boxes for about the same price.
 
Mila said:
From my view yes, but we know the lions has no sponsors and has been dropped from the super13/41/15/16( whatever) So I can guess the money to rent space at SS is going to be out of the question. Unless they give it to them and the people in the boxes get the boxes for about the same price.
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Yeah, rent may be a stumbling block but I'm sure they could work a favourable deal out.

The Lions at the least guarantee the stadium a minimum of 5 extra games a season. That becomes 12/13 if and when Super Rugby returns. The Lions, even if it is just 5 Currie Cup games, will frequent the ground as much as, and if not more than, Kaizer Chiefs do. Corporates are also more eager to spend on rugby boxes than they are on soccer boxes. It really is a win-win.

I also guarantee that the Lions would pull more fans if they were there. The location of Ellis Park has as much to do with the bad crowds as the lack of on field success does.
 
I agree. 100% they should have built that staduim closer to the airport IMO. But its there now. They might as well use it.
I would not go to ellispark if you paid me.
 
Mila said:
I agree. 100% they should have built that staduim closer to the airport IMO. But its there now. They might as well use it.
I would not go to ellispark if you paid me.
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Wassamatter with Ellis Park? :p
 
Mila said:
I agree. 100% they should have built that staduim closer to the airport IMO. But its there now. They might as well use it.
I would not go to ellispark if you paid me.
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Actually isn't too bad a drive. R24 to Gilloolys, Get on the N3 S and then right on to the Francis Oberholzer which is practically empty for large stretches. From there you have 3 or 4 options to get close to the stadium. Nasrec Road from the North and South, the Soweto Highway from the East and West (if you don't mind a bit of a detour)

Ideally you would have sharing of most of the stadiums by Rugby and PSL teams with most of the others held for reserve or demolished to make way for something else.

Ideally:

Soccer City: Lions + Chiefs vs Pirates Derby + other large events eg Springboks NZ.
Orlando Stadium: Pirates
Rand Stadium: Chiefs home
Loftus: Bulls + Swallows big games
Peter Mokaba: Some Swallows games + anything else it can get
Mbombela: Pumas + any PSL it can get (Black Aces?)
FS is well used already
Ba***eng is private so not a worry
Cape Town Stadium: Stormers + large games for CT PSL games, Athlone for small games. Newlands can be sold for a crazy amount of money.
Durban: Both PSL teams, Sharks won't want to move there. Make the pitch available as a park? Charge a small entrance fee and let it be used for touch rugby or soccer games through-out the week?
NMB: Getting a little use already I think, Kings in S15 might help that. PE is always going to be a tough one though.

Then you can get rid of Ellis Park, Newlands, JHB Stadium (definition of a white elephant) and a couple of other places that are simply a drain.
 
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