House Build

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Caldo

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Just sharing the journey incase anyone is interested...

About a year ago, we decided to sell our perfect house (which was recently renovated) and start a new build.
This was the worst idea in my life ever!!!!

We first battled to find the perfect land, but eventually we found something.
A piece of land that was subdivided.
A Big Plus - there was a cottage on the land. We were more interested in the land, but the cottage gives are a roof while we building.

Now that the background is set, here some experiences and tips for anyone planning to do something as stupid as this.

Architectural plan
Get an architect that is quick and agile. Some of the architect are just slow for no reason!!! My guy toke 2 months to produce the first version. Some back and forth change lasted another 3 months. Eventually plan submitted with the council, and now I wait for final approval.

Engineering service
This can get very expensive!!! Depending on your house plan and also you land terrain, these engineers are not slow to charge for their services. Shop around for a inexpensive engineer (don't know if they exist) and try to get his site visits to a minimum. These guys are on site for 15-20 mins, but charge you like they were there for half a day!!!


Contractor
Alot to say here!!!!
While I have not started on the house build, I have done abit of site leveling and clearing in preparation for the main build.
I have engaged about 8-10 different contractors.
Some wanted to charge for a site visit, I understand why, it's time out of their day. But I never paid anyone for a visit, even though they came out - bona fide.
You can negotiate to waive this call out fee - if they want the job!
Shop around for contractors!!!
Ask around, don't get tired!!!
Some of these guys lie!!!
Try to do inspection of some of the previous projects.
Contractor prices are aways negotiable!!! Don't just accept the first, second or third quote!!!

------

Hopefully I get the plan back from the council soon, then I can give some positive feedback
 
Don't be a cheapskate. But do share your experience. But do pay the people or do the job yourself. Why don't you pay for site visits? Sies man and shame on you. This is nothing to brag about. Disgusting.

1. Architects must jump when the Client who doesn't want to pay says jump and can't make up their minds and makes a 100 changes. "oh and please can you also change this SMALL thing, quickly."
Get yourself a lapdog drafty. Of course make sure your designer is SACAP approved.
You want to live in a house for 20 years but you want the Architect to design it in 2 days? Pfft...

How much did you pay the Architect and how big is the house?

2. Engineers are not cheap. Nowhere in the world. But they are not free either.

3. Contractors. This is the part that is frustrating in SA. Well, KZN at least. Hopefully I can stay near or on site when I build and supervise things myself. But I am also not planning to go with the cheapest contractor either. But most definitely will need to stock up on Panados.
 
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Two things: Make sure that you have
1. Alternative plans for water: plan for a borehole; and
2. Ample North facing roof space for solar panels.
 
Caldo said:
Some wanted to charge for a site visit, I understand why, it's time out of their day. But I never paid anyone for a visit, even though they came out - bona fide.
Click to expand...
Agreed. I am open to paying for site visits, as long as there is an agreed deliverable at the end of the visit. No deliverable, no pay.
 
They have to charge call out fees, it’s very arrogant of you to see this as an attempt to make a few bucks

When you start behaving in such a manner you will put yourself on the back foot, remember you are choosing someone to build your house for you, a good strong, well built house, do you really want to start off by showing so much animosity
 
RedViking said:
Don't be a cheapskate. But do share your experience. But do pay the people or do the job yourself. Why don't you pay for site visits? Sies man and shame on you. This is nothing to brag about. Disgusting.

1. Architects must jump when the Client who doesn't want to pay says jump and can't make up their minds and makes a 100 changes. "oh and please can you also change this SMALL thing, quickly."
Get yourself a lapdog drafty. Of course make sure your designer is SACAP approved.
You want to live in a house for 20 years but you want the Architect to design it in 2 days? Pfft...

How much did you pay the Architect and how big is the house?

2. Engineers are not cheap. Nowhere in the world. But they are not free either.

3. Contractors. This is the part that is frustrating in SA. Well, KZN at least. Hopefully I can stay near or on site when I build and supervise things myself. But I am also not planning to go with the cheapest contractor either. But most definitely will need to stock up on Panados.
Click to expand...
Here is some more detail, I provided each contractor with a copy of the house plan site plan and engineering drawing.
I then ask them to give me a estimate, subjected to review upon site visit.
Some was able give me an estimate.
Other would insist on a site visit first and it will cost ~R800.
I understand why they would charge for a site visit, I personally don't see the need to pay for a site visit, which is requested by the contractors himself and not me.
My intesion is get an idea of what the estimate charge is and decide whether is it worth continuing discussions or not.


I assume you are a architect, hence your reaction.
From my first sketch to the final plan, there has not been much change, so no "100 changes". Only change was to the windows and doors to ensure we meet the council requirement.
It took my architect almost a month to change the windows, after I complained, he did it within a few hours.
I still believe the guy could have produced and finalised the plan earlier.
I paid R80 per m2, the house size is 513m2
Plus a admin fee of R1800.

Agree engineers are not cheap, hence my comment about keeping site inspections to a minimum, because every site inspection comes with a ~R1700 invoice.
 
Pak Fa Fui said:
They have to charge call out fees, it’s very arrogant of you to see this as an attempt to make a few bucks

When you start behaving in such a manner you will put yourself on the back foot, remember you are choosing someone to build your house for you, a good strong, well built house, do you really want to start off by showing so much animosity
Click to expand...
There are some work that required a site visit, I do not disagree.

Context is important here.
The structural walls, slab, roof, etc. details and specifications are all on the plans.

Do I need to pay for a site visit for a contractor to give a quote on these?

Honestly, I don't think I site visit is required in this case.
 
RedViking said:
Don't be a cheapskate. But do share your experience. But do pay the people or do the job yourself. Why don't you pay for site visits? Sies man and shame on you. This is nothing to brag about. Disgusting.

1. Architects must jump when the Client who doesn't want to pay says jump and can't make up their minds and makes a 100 changes. "oh and please can you also change this SMALL thing, quickly."
Get yourself a lapdog drafty. Of course make sure your designer is SACAP approved.
You want to live in a house for 20 years but you want the Architect to design it in 2 days? Pfft...

How much did you pay the Architect and how big is the house?

2. Engineers are not cheap. Nowhere in the world. But they are not free either.

3. Contractors. This is the part that is frustrating in SA. Well, KZN at least. Hopefully I can stay near or on site when I build and supervise things myself. But I am also not planning to go with the cheapest contractor either. But most definitely will need to stock up on Panados.
Click to expand...
The architect is SACAP registered. When the architect submits the plan with the council, they have to list the SACAP registration number.
 
Caldo said:
There are some work that required a site visit, I do not disagree.

Context is important here.
The structural walls, slab, roof, etc. details and specifications are all on the plans.

Do I need to pay for a site visit for a contractor to give a quote on these?

Honestly, I don't think I site visit is required in this case.
Click to expand...
Plans are 2D. It doesn't give you an idea of the terrain you're dealing with, which they need to factor in...
 
Caldo said:
There are some work that required a site visit, I do not disagree.

Context is important here.
The structural walls, slab, roof, etc. details and specifications are all on the plans.

Do I need to pay for a site visit for a contractor to give a quote on these?

Honestly, I don't think I site visit is required in this case.
Click to expand...
I’m not in the industry at all but from a little experience the site visits are important due to things they need to assess, things like water and sanitation access, water level and water tables, basic ground work, types of soil, depth of foundation etc
Then factor in what you want to build, double or triple story and all the council requirements needed for such a build.

Building is not cheap, no one ever said it was, I can also tell you if this is the way you are now, it will get worse for you. You have to be easy on the budget, you will go over, how much over is the key.
If and when the contractors recommend something, ask why so you have a full understanding of what they trying to achieve and make a compromise.
 
Mike Hoxbig said:
Plans are 2D. It doesn't give you an idea of the terrain you're dealing with, which they need to factor in...
Click to expand...
Agree, for foundation, retainers wall, yes visit is required.

For slab - a contractor can quote based on the drawings.
 
Pak Fa Fui said:
I’m not in the industry at all but from a little experience the site visits are important due to things they need to assess, things like water and sanitation access, water level and water tables, basic ground work, types of soil, depth of foundation etc
Then factor in what you want to build, double or triple story and all the council requirements needed for such a build.

Building is not cheap, no one ever said it was, I can also tell you if this is the way you are now, it will get worse for you. You have to be easy on the budget, you will go over, how much over is the key.
If and when the contractors recommend something, ask why so you have a full understanding of what they trying to achieve and make a compromise.
Click to expand...
Water and sanitation access, water level, water tables... Does not apply in this case.

Agree, almost a guarantee that the cost will over run.
But I would not suggest anyone goes easy on the budget, otherwise it will run away very quickly.
 
Caldo said:
Here is some more detail, I provided each contractor with a copy of the house plan site plan and engineering drawing.
I then ask them to give me a estimate, subjected to review upon site visit.
Some was able give me an estimate.
Other would insist on a site visit first and it will cost ~R800.
I understand why they would charge for a site visit, I personally don't see the need to pay for a site visit, which is requested by the contractors himself and not me.
My intesion is get an idea of what the estimate charge is and decide whether is it worth continuing discussions or not.


I assume you are a architect, hence your reaction.
From my first sketch to the final plan, there has not been much change, so no "100 changes". Only change was to the windows and doors to ensure we meet the council requirement.
It took my architect almost a month to change the windows, after I complained, he did it within a few hours.
I still believe the guy could have produced and finalised the plan earlier.
I paid R80 per m2, the house size is 513m2
Plus a admin fee of R1800.

Agree engineers are not cheap, hence my comment about keeping site inspections to a minimum, because every site inspection comes with a ~R1700 invoice.
Click to expand...
Let's put it this way. There are clients you would like to work for, and then there are clients you would want to avoid. I'm sorry if I got the wrong impression.

The tone of your OP is you don't want to spend money and you want them to do things your way. One of the reasons I don't sommer do work for South Africans. Very entitled and don't want to pay. Not they I am currently SACAP registered here, that's another story for another day.

I'm sure there is more to the story and you have your reasons, but generally I get bad vibes from the OP and see it too often.

But then again, Just as there are bad clients, there are bad professionals as well. But very difficult for an engineer or architect to do something well and when they are on the client's leash. But yes, important you do your homework on the design team as well, same you would do on the contractors.

I would rather build a 250m² well designed passive house with a high quality team, finishes and materials, than a 500m² on a tight budget. Also make sure it is solar ready and sustainable in the long run.

Anyways, doesn't matter, I am interested what the build is gonna be like and what the end costs are going to be compared to the expectations.

Which area are you building?
 
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Pak Fa Fui said:
Building is not cheap, no one ever said it was, I can also tell you if this is the way you are now, it will get worse for you. You have to be easy on the budget, you will go over, how much over is the key.
If and when the contractors recommend something, ask why so you have a full understanding of what they trying to achieve and make a compromise.
Click to expand...
Covid completely screwed things up. Prices are insane. Maybe locally made brick and concrete is not too bad?
 
RedViking said:
Let's put it this way. There are clients you would like to work for, and then there are clients you would want to avoid. I'm sorry if I got the wrong impression.

The tone of your OP is you don't want to spend money and you want them to do things your way. One of the reasons I don't sommer do work for South Africans. Very entitled and don't want to pay. Not they I am currently SACAP registered here, that's another story for another day.

I'm sure there is more to the story and you have your reasons, but generally I get bad vibes from the OP and see it too often.

But then again, Just as there are bad clients, there are bad professionals as well. But very difficult for an engineer or architect to do something well and when they are on the client's leash. But yes, important you do your homework on the design team as well, same you would do on the contractors.

I would rather build a 250m² well designed passive house with a high quality team, finishes and materials, than a 500m² on a tight budget. Also make sure it is solar ready and sustainable in the long run.

Anyways, doesn't matter, I am interested what the build is gonna be like and what the end costs are going to be compared to the expectations.

Which area are you building?
Click to expand...
I think I am in the category of "clients that you would not want to work with"...

I am cost aware and cautious, but I pay where needed.
The architect was paid in full (m2 estimate) before he even started the plan. In fact I had a credit, after the final plan area was measured. The credit was used for the council payment. I know him, so I trust him, only problem I have is that he is very slow!!!

The engineer was recommended by the architect. I paid the engineer 50% deposit and remaining on delivery of the plans, as per his request.
Site inspection were paid on the day.
If I could do it again, I would rather shop around just for comparative pricing.

The contractor that did my site clearing was paid a deposit when he started and paid on time as the work continued, as per his requirement.

I made sure that I paid my bill on time. The guys put in the work, so they must get paid.
I didn't put much diligence and negotiations in the site clearing stage with the contractor, but ja, let's just say good lessons learnt. I will try to do better with the house build.

My intension is to install solar as part of the finishing. (if I still have money left)
Smart lighting also on the list of finishing, as well as gas.

In Joburg, Northcliff.
Sure, I will update on the progress and spent
 
RedViking said:
They sometimes borrow other SACAP users details. Make sure the SACAP details are the same as the designer.
Click to expand...
I know the guy, he did some work for me previously. Good guy, just slow.

He sent me a copy of the submission, only his details are listed.
 
RedViking said:
Plans are 3D these days. BIM. Even cooler if you spend a bit extra and get the site scanned with point cloud and send a geotechnical to do soil surveys.
Click to expand...
These are the type of things that adds to runaway cost.
The 3D designs are cool and looks really good.

But it is an unnecessary cost.
 
"In Joburg, Northcliff"

Oooh dat's nice :thumbsup: surprised you found an empty piece of land there.
 
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