ICASA to present LLU discussion document

Guys please participate in the process if their solution is bitstream LLU! That is not proper LLU and still leaves Telkom with far too much control.
The main difference between copper based unbundled access and bitstream based unbundled access is the provisioning of the DSLAM. In the case of copper circuit unbundled access the DSLAM connected to the unbundled circuit is always installed and operated by the new entrant. In the case of bitstream access, the DSLAM is installed and operated by the incumbent who also configures the DSLAM and sets up the required technical parameters (speed and quality of service (QoS) attributes) of each user's DSL access link.
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Mike Hoxbig said:
It's one of the LLU possibilities.
http://mybroadband.co.za/news/adsl/19175-naked-adsl-and-llu.html
Since the article hints at Telkom's close involvement with ICASA in the LLU process, bitstream may be a very real possibility. We should settle for nothing less than full LLU.
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Many countries use bitstream as a stepping stone to full LLU, so don't get too married to the "nothing less than full" idea, as it could be counter-productive. So long as ICASA set the QOS, install/maintenance parameters and prices, and perhaps full raw copper access later, I don't care if it's bitstream or not right now. It'll give the ISP's enough control to deliver us 1st world internet ASAP.
 
elvis_presley said:
Many countries use bitstream as a stepping stone to full LLU, so don't get too married to the "nothing less than full" idea, as it could be counter-productive. So long as ICASA set the QOS, install/maintenance parameters and prices, and perhaps full raw copper access later, I don't care if it's bitstream or not right now. It'll give the ISP's enough control to deliver us 1st world internet ASAP.
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I was going to say that it's fine if bitstream is used as a stepping stone to full LLU, but then I realised that we don't live in most countries.

This is a country where our SNO launched 6 years late, and they still don't have a fixed line service as specified in their mandate. Other countries also don't have ICASA as a regulator, where even bitstream access is likely to take a few years to implement, despite the November 2011 deadline.
 
Mike Hoxbig said:
This is a country where our SNO launched 6 years late, and they still don't have a fixed line service as specified in their mandate. Other countries also don't have ICASA as a regulator, where even bitstream access is likely to take a few years to implement, despite the November 2011 deadline.
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I have faith that the Telkom techies will get it done in time if they have to. Technically, there's nothing wrong with Telkom. It's always politics that stops things happening. And it's these same idiot managers and politicians that keep the prices artificially inflated. I have no beef with the Telkom techies.
 
elvis_presley said:
I have faith that the Telkom techies will get it done in time if they have to. Technically, there's nothing wrong with Telkom. It's always politics that stops things happening. And it's these same idiot managers and politicians that keep the prices artificially inflated. I have no beef with the Telkom techies.
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Unfortunately we can't deal with the techies without dealing with Telkom.
 
bekdik said:
Unfortunately we can't deal with the techies without dealing with Telkom.
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Yup, and that's the point of what ICASA is doing - it's saying you screwed around long enough, here are the rules we play by now... and if you don't deliver, X,Y and Z will happen - which will usually be a penalty like too much downtime = ISP doesn't pay for the bitstream access for that month, etc. Even a bad manager or political idiot can understand "do that or you don't get paid" ... we hope :)
 
elvis_presley said:
Yup, and that's the point of what ICASA is doing - it's saying you screwed around long enough, here are the rules we play by now... and if you don't deliver, X,Y and Z will happen - which will usually be a penalty like too much downtime = ISP doesn't pay for the bitstream access for that month, etc. Even a bad manager or political idiot can understand "do that or you don't get paid" ... we hope :)
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That would require a backbone that ICASA simply does not have or has ever had.
 
This elvis guy obviously hasn't seen how SA telecoms works. Telkom do what they're told by ICASA? That's a laugh.
ICASA telling Telkom to do stuff? That's an even bigger laugh!
If you knew what we've had to put up with in the last 10 years or so, you wouldn't be wishful thinking in this thread
 
wishful thinking, I don't think many contenders for bitstream or CHIPAC want to use the copper in the ground, neither will the contract with penalties act as a deterent for service delivery. those stats exclude most of us complainers because we comprise 0.0000001 % of the population serviced, and the target will read, penalties if 5% of target not met.
it is all about DA MONEY
 
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