BigEars
Senior Member
So much stuff going on here. This has become an impossible thread to reply to.
Mods...please do stuff. Create categories or something...
Mods...please do stuff. Create categories or something...
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Inverter/Deep Cycle battery charging question
- Thread starter howardb
- Start date
lived666
Executive Member
That is a truck battery, it is high cycle not deep cycle. It is a good battery and will work but not as long as the Enertec 54105 which is the Energizer deep cycle more suitable for back-up power. They both cost very similar around R1500ish depending where from.
I was also sold the EC18 as deep cycle but the supplier has arranged to swop for the correct model.
The_Traveller. If your ups had 6x 7ah battery's in. It was meant to charge those one's in maybe 5-6hours (to get them back to the 90%) <if your lucky maybe in 3-4hours>
So by putting 102ah's on there... <lets take 3-4hours charge to do 6x7ah>
42ah in 4hours(7ah per battery for 4hours) x 6 (to get to 24hours in a day). = 252Ah per day.
Although my calculations might not be so 100% scientific... (you have to take battery voltages into account, The Chargers efficiency etc).
Just a ruff estimate.. 24hours will give you 252Ah +-.
You have 6x102Ah which is 612Ah. {so thats 2.5days to recharge them, calculating on 4hours recharge for the 6x7ah's. It could be far worse if it's 6hours for the 6x7ah's. Which would mean it would be closer to 3.5 to 4days to recharge)
So by putting 102ah's on there... <lets take 3-4hours charge to do 6x7ah>
42ah in 4hours(7ah per battery for 4hours) x 6 (to get to 24hours in a day). = 252Ah per day.
Although my calculations might not be so 100% scientific... (you have to take battery voltages into account, The Chargers efficiency etc).
Just a ruff estimate.. 24hours will give you 252Ah +-.
You have 6x102Ah which is 612Ah. {so thats 2.5days to recharge them, calculating on 4hours recharge for the 6x7ah's. It could be far worse if it's 6hours for the 6x7ah's. Which would mean it would be closer to 3.5 to 4days to recharge)
How exactly are your batteries wired?
http://www.really4me.com/pictures/Battery-Wiring-Diagram-Multi-Batt.jpg
Take note that the negative & positive 'feed' is on different ends.
As opposed to
http://www.freesunpower.com/images/series_parallel1.gif
This is the wrong way to do it.
I connected them the first way. (series) Ups connects to the positive and negative at opposite ends of battery bank. Between I've connected positive to negative, positive to negative etc.. to get a total of 72volts.
Thank you for your detailed response. The load I place on the UPS never exceeds 500w, and the power rarely goes off for more than two hours, so the batteries shouldn't lose more than 10%. If this is the case then the batteries should be able to recharge in 24hours. My thinking behind buying such a big bank of batteries was that they wouldn't need to discharge as low as smaller/less batteries, therefore lasting longer.
Even if it does take 2 or 3 days to fully charge, is this bad for the batteries? I always thought the slower they charge the longer they last.
I found a solution. The ups they sent me was the standard version. They were supposed to send me the long run version that can charge up to 12ah. Sending it back today and will wait for the new unit to arrive. In the mean time I'm going to charge each battery individually with my smart charger to make sure they're all balanced when the new unit arrives.
mattvan1 , its a gamble really.. You basically doing semi cycling (just shaving power off the top)
It's good... So that means your definitely using less than the 50% capacity... and obviously then you only have to refill the amount you used. (so the charging amount is less to recharge)
Only the initial 1st Charge will take Super long...
You don't want to charge the battery's too quick.. but you want them to be charged enough so that you can survive multiple loadsheddings.
I would say a 10A charger should be strong enough and sufficiently quick.
I switched my Mecer 2400va down to 10A (from 20A. i'm running 2x 105ah Deep cycle battery's - energizer Premium)
It's good... So that means your definitely using less than the 50% capacity... and obviously then you only have to refill the amount you used. (so the charging amount is less to recharge)
Only the initial 1st Charge will take Super long...
You don't want to charge the battery's too quick.. but you want them to be charged enough so that you can survive multiple loadsheddings.
I would say a 10A charger should be strong enough and sufficiently quick.
I switched my Mecer 2400va down to 10A (from 20A. i'm running 2x 105ah Deep cycle battery's - energizer Premium)
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Thank you for putting my worries to rest. I've swapped the ups (ss pro plus 2kva standard - 1A charging max) for the long run version (ss pro plus 2kva long run) that will charge up to 12A. They messed up my order and sent the wrong one the first time round...
I'm sure this should all work now.
The_Traveller
Expert Member
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Yip a 12A is surely better.
your batteries sitting at 15.4V was definitely not normal. I know when a battery needs to go through a desulphation phase, will jump into the 15v range. Maybe I'm wrong ...
Its a good idea to charge each battery 100% with your smart charger
Also maybe topup them once every month as well with smart charger
BigEars
Senior Member
I wonder where KOPITE is? Hope he is OK still.
KOPITE
Executive Member
I'm here bud, just popping in now and then to see what discussions is taking place.
I ordered my 2000w pure sine inverter with 20amp charger over the weekend. Can't wait to test it.
But it seems like loadshedding has ended and I'm sitting with all the stuff.
Selling my rct2000va without any batteries and 12amp 3 stage charger soon.
kopite... don't hold ur breath 
The winter is upon us and yes.. There will be loadshedding. Maybe not for a week or so..
Then there will be loadshedding for a couple of days.. and then maybe no loadshedding for 3-4 days again.
It's Eskom's old story over and over.
The winter is upon us and yes.. There will be loadshedding. Maybe not for a week or so..
Then there will be loadshedding for a couple of days.. and then maybe no loadshedding for 3-4 days again.
It's Eskom's old story over and over.
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Conspiracy theory time... make what you want of it but there's rumors that within the next 8 months to a year we will be experiencing power outages for up to two weeks at a time, and that municipalities have been warned to make extra preparations to deal with riots and looting etc. Not sure how true this is but eskom and the government would definitely want to keep this secret.
So far each battery has taken +/- 15A using the smart charger so the ups definitely wasn't charging them properly. Thanks everyone for the help and advice. I'll def be back if I have any further problems.
SilverNodashi
Expert Member
I know this is an old thread, but since the particular batteries were discussed here, I thought I'd ask. Does anyone have any technical specs on the Energizer EC18 batteries? Specifically, I'm looking for the DOD VS time charts.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Geoff.D
Honorary Master
I know this is an old thread. The information available in this thread is quite interesting and mostly correct except for some very glaring errors. The most important error that has to be corrected is this one above. I am surprised that no one in the know corrected this post with the correct information.
Batteries in parallel:
Connecting batteries in parallel maintains the voltage of the battery bank at whatever the battery rating is (12v, 24V etc) BUT increases the A-hr available. 2 x 12 V 102A-hr batteries will result in a battery bank rated at 12V with a total capacity of 204 A-hr
Batteries in Series:
Batteries placed in series increase the total voltage of the battery bank BUT maintains the A-hr rating at whatever a single battery delivers. For example 2 x 12V 102 A-hr batteries connected in series increases the battery bank voltage to 24V but the capacity of the battery bank remains at 102 A-hr
The problem comes from a lack of understanding of the basics and the way in which the calculations are done. An incorrect calculation method still gives the right answer.
(Exam question in school physics Standard 7 in my days at school. Using the incorrect calculation method got you zero points even if the answer was correct).
Ripping out batteries in a commercially supplied UPS
I am not at all sure that ripping the batteries installed in a commercial UPS and replacing them with larger capacity batteries is a good idea long term. Rather go and get yourself a properly designed Inverter that allows for an external battery bank to be connected to it.
"Balancing batteries"
Very surprised that a person in the industry does not know about the need to ensure batteries in a battery bank should all be at the same charge level before connecting them up.
Note also that unless ALL the batteries in a bank are "balanced" and charged to the same rate initially, the charging of the bank will not result in all the batteries being optimally charged. So one should try and get all the batteries into the same state of initial charge BEFORE placing into a battery bank. Regular checking of individual batteries in a bank should be done to detect a weaker cell before it leads to damage of the other batteries.
The more normal term used is "equalising batteries".
Next time you replace the batteries in a torch where batteries are placed in series with each other, take a multimeter and check the individual battery voltages. You may be in for quite a surprise! It is extremely rare that you will find all the batteries are at the same voltage. There is always one battery that will be completely flat and useless and others with some life in them.
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Geoff.D
Honorary Master
I see no one answered your question last year. Unfortunately to get this sort of info out battery suppliers and manufacturers is extremely difficult. One has to either run an experiment yourself or try and deduce it from the supplied data sheet on the battery. I would look up on the Internet for ways to use the data sheet info to deduce the DoD/ vs time information.
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