Jews Are Going Underground

[Jabulani22]

Let's say there's a mass murderer who kills 10 people - the equivalent would be blaming/hating his brother/sister/mother/father/grandparent and all of their future offspring. It's not logical. The blame is on the people who killed Jesus, NOT the whole frikken race. It's just stupid illogical thinking. It's like blaming the current Germans for what Hitler done. Same thing. It's just plain wrong.



So according to you the Apostles and all their future family's generations are bad. What about Joseph, what about the Jews that converted to Christianity and spread it, are they evil as well. Your logic is completely flawed.

First off its nothing like your example , its more like an entire community baying for the blood of some other community's messiah , then when given the choice on who to set free they release a murderer instead and even after killing other folks messiah they go through history never changing their story about it .(except when they convinced the RC that technically it was the romans who dunnit)
2nd , its not my logic that is flawed , you cant go saying Jesus never said jews he said part of them when its well known he said jews , if that means all of them then his followers will kno , if not they would also know.

 

[SoldierMan]

First off its nothing like your example , its more like an entire community baying for the blood of some other community's messiah , then when given the choice on who to set free they release a murderer instead and even after killing other folks messiah they go through history never changing their story about it .(except when they convinced the RC that technically it was the romans who dunnit)
2nd , its not my logic that is flawed , you cant go saying Jesus never said jews he said part of them when its well known he said jews , if that means all of them then his followers will kno , if not they would also know.

That was a specific group of people that was gathered there at the time, not the whole Jewish population decided????? Can't you see this????

There were other Jews who were minding their business tending fields, taking care of children at home, off on journeys far away, but you want to blame the entire Jewish population. It's idiotic.

You keep on dodging my questions, please answer.
- What about the Jews that converted to Christianity and spread it, are they evil and to be blamed as well?
- What about Paul, he was KILLING Christians yet Jesus saw fit to turn his heart even though he was an evil JEW?!!!!
- What about the current generation of Germans, are they to blame for the holocaust, should we hate them? Are they evil?
- What about the current generation of whites in South Africa, should we blame/hate them for what was done in the past?

 

[Jabulani22]

That was a specific group of people that was gathered there at the time, not the whole Jewish population decided????? Can't you see this????

There were other Jews who were minding their business tending fields, taking care of children at home, off on journeys far away, but you want to blame the entire Jewish population. It's idiotic.

You keep on dodging my questions, please answer.
- What about the Jews that converted to Christianity and spread it, are they evil and to be blamed as well?
- What about Paul, he was KILLING Christians yet Jesus saw fit to turn his heart even though he was an evil JEW?!!!!
- What about the current generation of Germans, are they to blame for the holocaust, should we hate them? Are they evil?
- What about the current generation of whites in South Africa, should we blame/hate them for what was done in the past?

I dont personally have any attachment to the subject , i dont want to blame anyone i merely stated why people may want to hate them .
1)Did Jesus say jews or part of the jewish community ?
2)See above
3)Current and previous Germans have actually paid reparations due to worldwide consensus that they were the cause of WW2 , and yes holocaust reparations are being looked for today too.
4)Arent they hated widely ? Your appeal to emotion by linking a home grown group does nothing to further your stance.

Edit - if you dont believe everything Jesus said then dont , thats up to you but dont try change it to fit your world view.

 

[lived666]

First off its nothing like your example , its more like an entire community baying for the blood of some other community's messiah , then when given the choice on who to set free they release a murderer instead and even after killing other folks messiah they go through history never changing their story about it .(except when they convinced the RC that technically it was the romans who dunnit)
2nd , its not my logic that is flawed , you cant go saying Jesus never said jews he said part of them when its well known he said jews , if that means all of them then his followers will kno , if not they would also know.

Well, aren't the Christians lucky then that the Jews, a Jew, some Jews arranged for Jesus to be offed (yeah by the Romans), because without that happening the main Ethos for the Christian religion would not exist as in Jesus died for our sins blah blah and then mustn't forget the fact that he actually didn't really die, sky fairy daddy was just pretending and he was resurrected and now sits waiting in heaven watching soccer and whatnot until judgment day?

 

[SoldierMan]

I dont personally have any attachment to the subject , i dont want to blame anyone i merely stated why people may want to hate them .
1)Did Jesus say jews or part of the jewish community ?
2)See above
3)Current and previous Germans have actually paid reparations due to worldwide consensus that they were the cause of WW2 , and yes holocaust reparations are being looked for today too.
4)Arent they hated widely ? Your appeal to emotion by linking a home grown group does nothing to further your stance.

Edit - if you dont believe everything Jesus said then dont , thats up to you but dont try change it to fit your world view.

I think you need to reread John 8 rather than saying I don't believe Jesus' words. You are the one who doesn't understand what Jesus was saying.

30 Even as he spoke, many believed in him.
31 To the Jews who had believed him, Jesus said, “If you hold to my teaching, you are really my disciples. 32 Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

Are you calling those Jews who believed Jesus evil as well?

 

[Jabulani22]

Well, aren't the Christians lucky then that the Jews, a Jew, some Jews arranged for Jesus to be offed (yeah by the Romans), because without that happening the main Ethos for the Christian religion would not exist as in Jesus died for our sins blah blah and then mustn't forget the fact that he actually didn't really die, sky fairy daddy was just pretending and he was resurrected and now sits waiting in heaven watching soccer and whatnot until judgment day?

So your point is ? People should be happy for mob justice ? conspiracy ?
Im not getting why you would join a conversation to point out the things which happened but in the process use it to further your hatred of a particular religion ?

 

[Jabulani22]

I think you need to reread John 8 rather than saying I don't believe Jesus' words. You are the one who doesn't understand what Jesus was saying.



Are you calling those Jews who believed Jesus evil as well?

I think you are taking what was said and compartmentalising it so as to fit your world view .
Once again it is not me who said these things , if you want answers pray and ask for them .

 

[SoldierMan]

So your point is ? People should be happy for mob justice ? conspiracy ?
Im not getting why you would join a conversation to point out the things which happened but in the process use it to further your hatred of a particular religion ?

He's a satanist, he's just trolling.

 

[Jabulani22]

He's a satanist, he's just trolling.

Quite fitting for a religion which trolls its believers

 

[SoldierMan]

I think you are taking what was said and compartmentalising it so as to fit your world view .
Once again it is not me who said these things , if you want answers pray and ask for them .

No, I quoted the biblical text which clearly shows that there were Jews who believed Jesus and Jesus said that they were His disciples. ITS THERE WRITTEN DOWN IN THE TEXT. READ IT. You have no response to the text because you are wrong and are trying to wiggle out of it.

What do you mean by compartmentalising? Explain it more, because that is just one huge cop-out.

 

[Jabulani22]

No, I quoted the biblical text which clearly shows that there were Jews who believed Jesus and Jesus said that they were His disciples. ITS THERE WRITTEN DOWN IN THE TEXT. READ IT. You have no response to the text because you are wrong and are trying to wiggle out of it.

What do you mean by compartmentalising? Explain it more, because that is just one huge cop-out.

He said if they followed him yes , thereby converting from ...........other religions such as judaism.
Compartmentalising by taking things and reading only the part which suits.
Last chance to answer mine though , Did Jesus say jews or only a portion of ?

 

[SoldierMan]

He said if they followed him yes , thereby converting from ...........other religions such as judaism.
Compartmentalising by taking things and reading only the part which suits.

Well by all means read the whole of John 8. I did. I accept the whole of John 8 just like I accept the rest of the Bible.
He called them His DISCIPLES.

Last chance to answer mine though , Did Jesus say jews or only a portion of ?

At times He was talking to the Pharisees and at times it just says Jews, but He was specifically talking to those who were trying to trip Him up. Trying to find fault.

What about the thousands of people that followed Jesus who believed in Him and din't want Him crucified, are they evil as well.

 

[Jabulani22]

Well by all means read the whole of John 8. I did. I accept the whole of John 8 just like I accept the rest of the Bible.
He called them His DISCIPLES.



At times He was talking to the Pharisees and at times it just says Jews, but He was specifically talking to those who were trying to trip Him up. Trying to find fault.

What about the thousands of people that followed Jesus who believed in Him and din't want Him crucified, are they evil as well.

Its simple , if they believed in Jesus they werent jews , the jews that didnt convert were the people he was talking to/about .
Whether he was talking to who or when is irrelevant , he said jews meaning those which stayed jews not pharises or the guys worshipping idols but all jews.
I can explain the rest of the worlds religions in one sentence too just ask .

 

[lived666]

So your point is ? People should be happy for mob justice ? conspiracy ?
Im not getting why you would join a conversation to point out the things which happened but in the process use it to further your hatred of a particular religion ?

Pont being to use the death of Jesus as a reason to hate Jews is a tad daft because this is basically the raison d'etre for the existence of Christianity.....plus shhh, don't tell everyone, he didn't really die.


BTW snookums Christmas is my favorite time of the year, best holiday ever.

 

[Jabulani22]

Pont being to use the death of Jesus as a reason to hate Jews is a tad daft because this is basically the raison d'etre for the existence of Christianity.....plus shhh, don't tell everyone, he didn't really die.


BTW snookums Christmas is my favorite time of the year, best holiday ever.

So you are saying we should encourage the mob baying for the blood of any messiah from any faith just in case its the right one and we get another holiday ?
No ok boomer.

 

[SoldierMan]

Its simple , if they believed in Jesus they werent jews , the jews that didnt convert were the people he was talking to/about .
Whether he was talking to who or when is irrelevant , he said jews meaning those which stayed jews not pharises or the guys worshipping idols but all jews.
I can explain the rest of the worlds religions in one sentence too just ask .

What if there were Jews that only converted later like Saul/Paul, you are saying that those that didn't believe at that time when Jesus was speaking were unredeemable??

Paul only later believed after his encounter and only after killing many Christians. Is Paul in your view to blame for Jesus' death??

Yeah sorry but they are Messianic Jews. Just because they believe in Jesus doesn't mean they give up their history or lineage. Back when Jesus was speaking to them they did not know what it meant to be a Christian as we know it today, as we have the Bible to teach us.

So essentially they were still Jews, who believed that Jesus was the Messiah as was spoken of in the Torah. They remained Jews and no doubt continued their feasts as well.

 

[SoldierMan]

Pont being to use the death of Jesus as a reason to hate Jews is a tad daft because this is basically the raison d'etre for the existence of Christianity.....plus shhh, don't tell everyone, he didn't really die.


BTW snookums Christmas is my favorite time of the year, best holiday ever.

According to actual (non-Christian) Roman documents through Tacitus, Jesus was crucified. You just don't know your history is all.

The Roman historian and senator Tacitus referred to Christ, his execution by Pontius Pilate and the existence of early Christians in Rome in his final work, Annals (c. AD 116), book 15, chapter 44.[35][36][37] The relevant passage reads: "called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus."

 

[Jabulani22]

What if there were Jews that only converted later like Saul/Paul, you are saying that those that didn't believe at that time when Jesus was speaking were unredeemable??

Paul only later believed after his encounter and only after killing many Christians. Is Paul in your view to blame for Jesus' death??

Yeah sorry but they are Messianic Jews. Just because they believe in Jesus doesn't mean they give up their history or lineage. Back when Jesus was speaking to them they did not know what it meant to be a Christian as we know it today, as we have the Bible to teach us.

So essentially they were still Jews, who believed that Jesus was the Messiah as was spoken of in the Torah. They remained Jews and no doubt continued their feasts as well.

If they continued any or all previous things regarding religion then they werent Christians , simple as that , you cannot be a practicing non Christian and a Christian.

 

[SoldierMan]

If they continued any or all previous things regarding religion then they werent Christians , simple as that , you cannot be a practicing non Christian and a Christian.

Sorry but that's nonsense, even Jesus followed Jewish traditions. Celebrating Jewish history through feasts is not anti-Christian, it's just a celebration. Jesus was the FULFILMENT of the the Old Testament law, it was not put away when He arrived, rather it is still a crucial part of the CHRISTIAN faith. If you think the OT is no longer valid then you are mistaken.

"For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."

Obviously they no longer need to sacrifice animals but celebrating the Passover for instance is not against Christianity. It is history. Just like we celebrate certain dates on the calendar in South Africa or the UK for wars and such.

 

[Jabulani22]

Sorry but that's nonsense, even Jesus followed Jewish traditions. Celebrating Jewish history through feasts is not anti-Christian, it's just a celebration. Jesus was the FULFILMENT of the the Old Testament law, it was not put away when He arrived, rather it is still a crucial part of the CHRISTIAN faith. If you think the OT is no longer valid then you are mistaken.

"For I tell you truly, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."

Obviously they no longer need to sacrifice animals but celebrating the Passover for instance is not against Christianity. It is history. Just like we celebrate certain dates on the calendar in South Africa or the UK for wars and such.

Yeah eat and be merry , just dont go and sacrifice kids or livestock , if you do that you arent Christian , also if you're anything other than Christian , you arent Christian . Go figure right ?
Also OT is valid ofcourse , it wouldnt be in the book if it wasnt.