Make e-tolls unworkable

Fudzy said:
So you just get charged Rx each time you go through? I thought it was based on distance between two gantries?
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That was my understanding of the system... (like a normal toll booth, only more of them)
 
Fudzy said:
You mean pension fund money?
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Yeah, I kinda remember reading they used money from some pension fund to support some costs... although that might have just been someone speculating or a really bad memory my side.
 
Fudzy said:
So you just get charged Rx each time you go through? I thought it was based on distance between two gantries?
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Yes, every gantry has a set value, the BS they spewed awhile ago about cents per a kilometer was a lie.
 
Lupus said:
Yes, every gantry has a set value, the BS they spewed awhile ago about cents per a kilometer was a lie.
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Eina, so some people might do less distance than others and get charged more. Dumb system is dumb.
 
Fudzy said:
Eina, so some people might do less distance than others and get charged more. Dumb system is dumb.
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It's the calculated distance between off ramps you're being charged for. So it is per kilometre.
 
phaktza said:
It's the calculated distance between off ramps you're being charged for. So it is per kilometre.
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So if you drive backwards on the highway, and get negative KMs... they'd pay you instead? Sounds dangerous, but I think someone should test :D
 
2012 said:
So if you drive backwards on the highway, and get negative KMs... they'd pay you instead? Sounds dangerous, but I think someone should test :D
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We all know how well that worked out for Ferris Bueller...
 
phaktza said:
It's the calculated distance between off ramps you're being charged for. So it is per kilometre.
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It isn't - that may have been the basis for some of the fees but the charge is to drive under a gantry.

There is a section where the N12 and the R24 overlap each other - I may have the numbers wrong but it is the section of road between Eastgate and the road to the airport. That section has absolutely no bearing on distance from on ramp to off ramp.

And the bit from William Nicol to Malibongwe is free, but not if you go to Beyer Naude?

It's deliberately done to be confusing because none of this makes any sense unless you're buddies with the people collecting the tolls.
 
The tolls are per gate.
According to the calculator @ http://tollcalc.sanral.co.za/etoll/

As an example I get onto the highway @ Rigel and then take the N4 into town - this will cost me R5.80 (driving 8km on the N1)
If I get on at Lynnwood and then on to the N4 it will still be R5.80 (driving 3km on the N1)
 
Albereth said:
And what will this do?

Cemera records all number plates. Sensor records all tags. Match is done between number plates and tags. All unmatched number plates have invoice raised.

Let's assume your number plate matches the decoded tag.

A debit is raised against your tag. If there are no funds associated with the tag an invoice will be raised against the number plate associated with the tag, i.e they have your details. Unless your Nigerian buddies are hacking into SANRAL and editting the balance per number plate all that is going to happen is that you'll be out of pocket for the decoded tag and you'll still owe on the toll.

The way you break this system is by not registering - they have to raise invoices for every number plate.
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I don't really think so.
if yes, why we need etag? for what?
if the system can scan each number plate easily, then what they need you to do is only to register your number plate(s) with your ID. then they also can do the exactly the same process as etag does. Then everything is done. you don't need an etag.


The problem is the number plate system I think it needs more computing time for doing the pattern recognition. Theoretically, they can do that but it needs far more time to do when it compares to etag. That is the reason why they want everyone to register etag rather than number plate. I guess they will not match with your etag with your number plate.
 
Albereth said:
And what will this do?

Cemera records all number plates. Sensor records all tags. Match is done between number plates and tags. All unmatched number plates have invoice raised.

Let's assume your number plate matches the decoded tag.

A debit is raised against your tag. If there are no funds associated with the tag an invoice will be raised against the number plate associated with the tag, i.e they have your details. Unless your Nigerian buddies are hacking into SANRAL and editting the balance per number plate all that is going to happen is that you'll be out of pocket for the decoded tag and you'll still owe on the toll.

The way you break this system is by not registering - they have to raise invoices for every number plate.
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SANRAL my suggest that their technology has that kind of capability, but I seriously doubt it. The traffic department has also spent billions on software and database systems...still they cannot tie up my Licensing data with outstanding fines.
 
And they need to have a database of every taxi in the country in order not to bill them when they pass through a gantry - I really doubt they have such a database.
 
MightyQuin said:
SANRAL my suggest that their technology has that kind of capability, but I seriously doubt it. The traffic department has also spent billions on software and database systems...still they cannot tie up my Licensing data with outstanding fines.
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The fines systems and the license registration system have many different owners.

Here SANRAL owns the system - and teh only external reference they need is to enatis for your address.

Yes, there are always bits of incomplete data in any database but this one is simple.

Where is could fail is in the volumes and that's what they've been testing for the last several months.

But we don't attack the system. We let the system work of its own accord. That's what will break it. Following it to the letter. It will be a burden for you and I but that's nothing compared to the burden that it will be for SANRAL.
 
DreamKing said:
I don't really think so.
if yes, why we need etag? for what?
if the system can scan each number plate easily, then what they need you to do is only to register your number plate(s) with your ID. then they also can do the exactly the same process as etag does. Then everything is done. you don't need an etag.


The problem is the number plate system I think it needs more computing time for doing the pattern recognition. Theoretically, they can do that but it needs far more time to do when it compares to etag. That is the reason why they want everyone to register etag rather than number plate. I guess they will not match with your etag with your number plate.
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The etag allows for pre-payment and keeping the funds associated with a tag. Copying an etag is more difficult than a number plate so it is meant to help stop fraudulent use of number plates. It is also a device that could be used for all toll types - free flow and the traditional tool booth without the need to retrofit cameras into a toll booth.

When the etag goes under the gantry they can immediately debit the account. They could do that with number plates but it isn't as accurate and is a little slower. There also isn't an account associated with it and I guess teh guys who run enatis have already paid their bribes - there is a whole new source of enrichment from the new lot.

Anyway, back to point. It is easier to manage exceptions than every single event. And this is what SANRAL are hoping for.

The match has to be there because there will be untagged cars using the road and they have to be sorted from the tagged one. You have to remove the matched plate and tag from your list.
 
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