More relief for motorists

[Highflyer_GP]

While I agree with the majority of your philosophy I do however strongly disagree with this last part. IMO you dont reward someone for crap service.

I agree, but I generally give them the benefit of the doubt. I've found that more often than not when you receive poor service it's not from the waiters themselves, but from the chefs botching up your order. It's unfair to penalise them for somebody else's mistake (especially considering that some of these guys work purely on tips), in which case 10% is better than nothing.

NB I said no more than 10%, so crap service from a waiter gets no tip

edit: sometimes it's aptly insulting to hand out a R2 tip - kind of makes a statement better than no tip

 

[Ianf1]

Oh my word. 10 cents would probably equate to no more than R100 less at then of the month in your pocket, yet it means petrol attendants will no longer be earning less than R1400 a month.

That's a good trade off I'd say. And I see you're in Joburg, so chances are pretty good you either don't tip or your tips are crap anyway.

My comment was made not that they don't deserve the tip just that the attitude will change and service will get worse. I do tip when filling up unless the service is meted out with the surly attitude. When this happens I will avoid that garage as I would rather tip and get good service than go get surly service.

 

[BobbyMac]

My comment was made not that they don't deserve the tip just that the attitude will change and service will get worse. I do tip when filling up unless the service is meted out with the surly attitude. When this happens I will avoid that garage as I would rather tip and get good service than go get surly service.

So increased wages = worse service? How?

 

[Ianf1]

So increased wages = worse service? How?

With the current labour laws it is hard to fire someone with a bad attitude. Case in point most Pick 'n Pay employees. With the lower wages they have to deliver a good service to try and get a tip. With higher wages and laws in their favour it is hard to get rid of the bad service employee.
You can and I have fired employees but it is a process. You fire them after the hearing then you call them after 2 weeks to have the appeal if they request go through all the transcripts and confirm the firing. Then hope they don't go to the CCMA. I was involved in one case like this and it cost the company's insurer R400k because our lawyers said they had postponed a case over the December break but the judge did not agree. So the guy got R400k on this, instead of on the merits.
That is why I prefer tips as it keeps employees on their toes.

 

[Skeptik]

We should go the British route and make all garages self-service. That should reduce costs further for the customer.

 

[Highflyer_GP]

We should go the British route and make all garages self-service. That should reduce costs further for the customer.

That should also put people out of jobs. The petrol price isn't exactly cheap in the UK either.

 

[ginggs]

Damn! I thought this thread was going to be about new public toilets erected along the highways.

Haha thats a good idea but also such a bad one!!

You jest! I was recently fortunate enough to drive from Sydney to Brisbane on the Pacific Highway in Australia. The things that struck me were how similar the petrol price was over there, it worked out to about R7.50 per litre, and that every few kilometres there was a rest area with pristine toilet facilities, in the middle of nowhere. I did miss our petrol attendants though, at least it provides employment for some.

If we want relief for the motorist, we should be demanding safe, reliable public transport, not decreases in the petrol price.

 

[Skeptik]

That should also put people out of jobs. The petrol price isn't exactly cheap in the UK either.

That's not what we were taught in Economics. You cannot make a profit by employing excess people. Create jobs by stimulating industry and encouraging growth, but don't pad out the garages, the restaurants, parliament () etc..

 

[Highflyer_GP]

That's not what we were taught in Economics. You cannot make a profit by employing excess people. Create jobs by stimulating industry and encouraging growth, but don't pad out the garages, the restaurants, parliament () etc..

What you were taught in Economics is more about maximising profit for an organisation and less about ethical values To be honest, I'd rather have the excess end up in the pockets of the poor than some greedy oil/government boss.

Let's put it this way - would you feel better about all money received from a 10c increase going towards the bank account of the minister of the department of minerals, members of the board of some oil company, or shared between 20000 (just a guess) pump attendants who could use it to support their families? Or would you prefer these people be unemployed, resort to crime, and then complain about crime levels?

It's very difficult to create jobs by 'stimulating industry and encouraging growth' in a commodity market where prices are fixed. Therefore every cent counts, the question is who do you prefer this money go to.

 

[onlyme]

Lets see.

Self Service Petrol Stations, You mean you actually want to create a situation where I would have to get out of my car possibly in a quite area, with few or no other people around, at various times of the day or night. can you say Hijack Hot Spot?

Artificially inflated prices of SASOL Petrol a good thing? seriously, the argument about it being a good thing else it would all sell out quicker..... that is exactly the same argument telkom uses to legitimize it's price gouging and capping on bandwidth, are we now supporting that too?

 

[Meisteral]

We should go the British route and make all garages self-service. That should reduce costs further for the customer.

Reduce costs - never. Could you imagine the insurance claims? ie: How many people do you see smoking in there cars whilst at the station or on their cellphones? People need to obey rules first.

 

[Skeptik]

Let's put it this way - would you feel better about all money received from a 10c increase going towards the bank account of the minister of the department of minerals, members of the board of some oil company, or shared between 20000 (just a guess) pump attendants who could use it to support their families? Or would you prefer these people be unemployed, resort to crime, and then complain about crime levels?

It's very difficult to create jobs by 'stimulating industry and encouraging growth' in a commodity market where prices are fixed. Therefore every cent counts, the question is who do you prefer this money go to.

The jobs the attendants have are long redundant anyway. They are also exposed to dangerous chemicals all day long. I'd rather they were retrained to build houses.

The government will get their cut no matter what money comes in.

Lets see.

Self Service Petrol Stations, You mean you actually want to create a situation where I would have to get out of my car possibly in a quite area, with few or no other people around, at various times of the day or night. can you say Hijack Hot Spot?

Petrol attendants cannot be relied upon to rescue you. They didn't rescue that bloke who was beaten by 8 people in Cape Town did they? It simply is not a valid reason. You can employ ONE security card to look after the forecourt - they guard the shop anyway.

Reduce costs - never. Could you imagine the insurance claims? ie: How many people do you see smoking in there cars whilst at the station or on their cellphones? People need to obey rules first.

Cellphones do NOT cause fires. Repeat after me ...
Are you saying Europeans are THAT different that they would blow up petrol stations??

 

[supersunbird]

Artificially inflated prices of SASOL Petrol a good thing? seriously, the argument about it being a good thing else it would all sell out quicker..... that is exactly the same argument telkom uses to legitimize it's price gouging and capping on bandwidth, are we now supporting that too?

Errr no, you just need a brain to see it will happen. Anyway, telecoms costing and physical product costing cant be equated, its like trying to equate music copyright infringement with theft (owner losses physical things because someone else takes it). Once a network is in place its costs basically nothing to transmit over that network, the pricing is determined by what it costs to maintain the network and maybe upgrading it in the future and in Telkoms case a large level of greed (and in other cases a more reasonable amount of "profittaking").

Heck, just look at the "fuel shortage" a few weeks back, it only logic, go ask Spock...

 

[bwana]

Reduce costs - never. Could you imagine the insurance claims? ie: How many people do you see smoking in there cars whilst at the station or on their cellphones? People need to obey rules first.

Cellphones?

 

[onlyme]

Petrol attendants cannot be relied upon to rescue you. They didn't rescue that bloke who was beaten by 8 people in Cape Town did they? It simply is not a valid reason. You can employ ONE security card to look after the forecourt - they guard the shop anyway.

It's not about relying on attendants to "rescue" me, it's about the convenience of hijacking a person who is outside his vehicle, with his attention on filling the tank with few or no other people around, the current setup of a forecourt makes it an inconvenient place to hijack people not a safe place, the only thing getting rid of attendants will do is make it a convenient place for hijackings, and no security guard will change that.
now that you mention shop, a quite abandoned forecourt will probably make for a very convenient place to rob the shop as well.