Networking with Router

spong

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Hi Guys
I have read through your forum extensively.
We have the problem described by Quazzi at 3 sites. Peer to peer networks running Win98se with static ip addresses. The gateway machine has two network cards. One in the 192.168.10.* range, and the other in the range of the LAN. Using a POTS Router, all is fine. Accessing the router through internet explorer and running the status monitor shows "PPPOE Connect".The LAN and DSL links stay up. But intermittently and for no apparent reason, the DNS servers become unreachable, and web browsing is unavailable. Hit refresh a couple of times and it's back up. It runs for a day or two, and then dies. Restart gateway pc and router, and its back up! Telkom are clueless on this one, and don't want to support ADSL for LANs despite being happy to sell the router. Any ideas pleeeeeeeeeze!
 
Hi Spong - welcome to the forum. 1 simple question, when the other machines internet access is unavailable, can you still browse on the gateway box??

If not, then you have a connection problem - either there is something wrong with your router or your line - my guess is that it is the router.

I'm reposting a previous post for ease of reference because I think it applies here:

Posted - 09/05/2003 : 18:05:42
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Hi Guys

I've been having this problem for the past month. I'm running a Netgear DM602 and this is my 2c worth.

I've logged a plethora of calls with Telkom. I would list all my ref# here but seeing there isn't enough disk space on all the computers in the world, I'll spare that thought.

Ok, to get back to the problem. Once my router sync's up, I've got roughly 5 - 10 mins of surfing time before the router drops its connection. On querying the details through the gateway admin page, I notice that I'm transmitting packets but receiving nothing. Pinging anything but the router returns bugger all so I've been disconnected.

I called the Telkom techs in, they brought their router and plugged in. Sync'd in about 20 secs and no problem. It turns out that everyone has line attenuation (?? spelling). The normal level of line attenuation is generally around 56-58. The cut-off is 60. In other words, anything higher than 60 will cause problems with your connection. On plugging in the POTS router, my line attenuation is sitting at 58. When I plug in my Netgear, it jumps to 63. Although you can use it at values higher than 60, your modem will disconnect because the line is unstable.

How do we fix this??? Well, there's 2 ways of fixing it (and this is according to the telkom techies).

Fix 1 : use another router
or
Fix 2 : use another router :)

Surely there must a filter or something that you can plug into your line that can keep your attenuation at a certain level. I'm no electrical engineer and I have no clue what line attenuation is but if anyone out there can give some advice, please do so.

And by the by, I'm patenting this line attenuation stabilizer device :) unless its already been thought of before

My advice to anyone out there with the same problems, get telkom to check your line attenuation and if its over 60 and you get it working, please tell me what to do. I've just forked out for the netgear and I don't feel like forking out again for another router, especially the very cheap POTS router

Posted - 09/08/2003 : 15:21:54
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Hi guys

Just to update whats happened since my last post. Well, it turns out it was my router. I've changed from a netgear DM602 to a netgear DG814. I must say, what a difference. A crap load more features, firewall, e-mail notifications, its great - I recommend it.

Since I've plugged it in - no problems - score!!!

Another nice feature is that if the line drops, the modem displays it - the 602 didn't which was a pain in the butt. Anwyay, try this router if u still got problems

and last one :

KnKyJ, heres some advice, get Telkom to test your line attenuation, both with your router plugged in and without. If your attenuation jumps over 60 (with your router plugged in), your line will be unstable and your router will have sync problems. If you've got faxes and other phones connected to your ADSL line, unplug them and check your attenuation - have the guys on the phone - they owe it to you to run a few tests and it will only take a few minutes.

My recommendation is

1.) Unplug all your phones except the one you're going to phone telkom with
2.) Phone Tech Support (0800 375 375) and ask them to check the line attenuation - I'm not too sure who u'll need to speak to because I did this with the Telkom techie who phoned cape town (apparantly toll free)
3.) with them on the phone, plug in your router and then each phone one by one, each time asking them to test your attenuation. Once you hit over 60, u'll know which device is causing the problem.

Its a tedious solution, but at least you'll find out what the problem is. Also, it will save you having to buy another router if it's your fax or phone causing the problem. In my case, I plugged in all the phones and no change in attenuation. As soon as I plugged in my router (DM602) it jumped from 58 to 63.

When I got the new router, I phoned in and did the procedure all over again, my attenuation stayed solid at 58, since then no problems.

Rather find out if its your line/router thats causing the problem before thinking that your network has issues - since I've changed my router, I've had no problems browsing from any machine on my network - I hope this helps.
 
That does make some sense, thanks Quazzi.
In answer to your question, no we can't browse or ping past the router from the gateway box when this happens, even though the router monitor says it is connected. When you refer to your experience of the connection dropping, are you saying that the DSL light goes off, or you just can't ping past the router, even though the router monitor says it is connected. I have tried a couple of proxy packages on each of the gateway boxes, thinking they may somehow be causing the session to drop.
We will try
1) removing unwanted devices from the line.
2) getting attenuation readings from Telkom.
3) Putting in a different router.
and will feed the results back to the forum. I am looking for a 100% solution at three different sites, so some useful info may come of it yet.
 
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by spong</i>
<br />When you refer to your experience of the connection dropping, are you saying that the DSL light goes off, or you just can't ping past the router, even though the router monitor says it is connected.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

If I remember correctly, the DSL light stayed on regardless of whether there was a connection or not. I also had my router saying that it was connected and I noticed that if I checked my network monitor, my router would send packets, but receive nothing.

I definately think there is something wrong with your connection (router is my gut feel, line is second choice). When I say that replacing the router is an option, its not to say that your existing router is faulty. I was convinced my old one was faulty and when I tested it at another site, it connected solid with no connection drops - you could imagine my frustration.

The problem here lies with how much attenuation your router places on the line. Replacing the router with another one might solve the problem, or it might not - it all depends on the router on how much attenuation it places on your line and unfortunately the only way to find out is to try it and see.

I hope you come right with this, I remember how frustrated I used to get evertime I had to bounce my router every 10 minutes.
 
I had the same error ( had to reboot the router evey ten min ).[:(!]
After some fustration I found it was a gateway error.

In my case the PC in question was the mail server on a WAN (diginet router) so in order to check mail and be accessed by other users I needed two gateways on the win200 pc. One for the ADSL (xxx.xxx.xxx.251) and another for the cisco router (xxx.xxx.xxx.65). What would happen was that the internet would work until someone checked their mail over the WAN. then ADSL would seem to die.

I did a tracert to the ISP DNS but instead of getting a respons from the ADSL gateway I got time out as it first looked at the cisco gateway. On reboot of the PC all worked again.

Solution: go to command promt and type "route print" to see your routing table. Then add a persistent route to your ISP DNS through your ADSL Gateway eg. "route add xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx(ISP DNS) xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx(ADSL Gateway) -p(persistent so it stays after a reboot)

I hope this helps - but if it did not I am sure it will help someone els. [^]
 
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