PhD graduate can't find work

[Nicodeamus]

The vast majority of senior academics have PhDs, but the vast majority of PhDs are not academic - labeling them as "professional students" is silly. There aren't enough academic positions available, and for most STEM work, industry is a more interesting and lucrative place to be than academia anyway.

Why is why most STEM PHD students, are students who did not manage to find work, so they just ended up going for a PhD. They end up being very impractical as well. The best way to do a Phd is to do it through a company that will sponsor you.

 

[silkenphoenixx]

Quite a few academics of my acquaintance regurgitate the same paper with a slightly different slant ad nauseum. So a "not insignificant research output" is subjective.

Yeah, that can happen. The DoHE / DST don't care about the quality of the publications, they just care about the number. Any insightful chancellor would scoff at their CV though.

He worked as a research assistant at UCT for over 2 years according to his CV

This is kind of typical for postgraduate students, did it during my M, there were PhD students around as well.

Why is why most STEM PHD students, are students who did not manage to find work, so they just ended up going for a PhD. They end up being very impractical as well. The best way to do a Phd is to do it through a company that will sponsor you.

Well, their professors can also have guided them into that channel. Their departments get funding based on the number of BSc, Hons, M and PhD graduates they produce, so they all encourage their students to stay on and get as many degrees as possible. It's also quite easy to get funding from the NRF to study further if you have good marks, the only proviso being that you have to work in South Africa for at least the number of years that you were funded by NRF. They don't actually promise you a job afterwards though.

 

[cguy]

Why is why most STEM PHD students, are students who did not manage to find work, so they just ended up going for a PhD. They end up being very impractical as well. The best way to do a Phd is to do it through a company that will sponsor you.

Your first line is just a made up statistic. Professors are highly incentivized to take on the best and brightest as students. I don't know anyone who has ever done a PhD sponsored by a company - if they expect one to work and do the PhD part time, it sounds like a recipe for never finishing.

 

[silkenphoenixx]

Your first line is just a made up statistic. Professors are highly incentivized to take on the best and brightest as students. I don't know anyone who has ever done a PhD sponsored by a company - if they expect one to work and do the PhD part time, it sounds like a recipe for never finishing.

I work at a company which sponsors PhDs for certain employees but we are research focused and a national institution. Definitely not typical of the private sector though there are occasionally exceptions.

 

[cguy]

I work at a company which sponsors PhDs for certain employees but we are research focused and a national institution. Definitely not typical of the private sector though there are occasionally exceptions.

Yeah, I can see it done for CSIR, defense, government contracting, etc., but the job usually has to fall into the narrow category of "research work done by non-PhDs that is also OK to be made public". In industry, this exceedingly rare, since (IP concerns aside) they would typically hire experienced/proven researchers if the job entailed research, and if the job didn't entail research, it's unlikely that the overlap of the day job and the PhD research would be enough for doing both the job and the PhD research to make sense (job will likely suffer or PhD will likely never be completed). National institutions are motivated to pay (a salary) to create more researchers, industry in general is not.

 

[krycor]

Qualification does still mean something but job experience makes employers salivate at the very thought of having you do their bidding. Happened to me when the employer said they cannot pay me enough to match my qualification but that they would love to have me as part of their team of technicians. I accepted without any reserve and was just happy to get my foot in the door at that time. That opportunity allowed me to network my skills to other employers for a better position. People with a PhD are just "professional students" IMO.

This kinda why I said inflation is something many forget.

Granted R3.5k is very low even as an intern but if there is an opportunity for a proper paying job after.. after 2yrs, tough to decline.

At the end of the day, yrs experience and salary is what counts. You can try the roll of the dice for a better offer or you can take the year proper work experience and build from there. With an intern position usually there is 2weeks notice so he is free to continue searching..

 

[HeftyCrab]

At the end of the day, yrs experience and salary is what counts. You can try the roll of the dice for a better offer or you can take the year proper work experience and build from there. With an intern position usually there is 2weeks notice so he is free to continue searching..

Ive met a handful of PhD graduates (science related fields) who sort of had the same attitude.

They all expected to earn more than others their age because they have earned a PhD (even if they dont have industry experience). They turn down jobs that dont offer crazy amounts of money, even though it would get them a foot in the door.

Next they sort of get a realisation that they probably should have stopped at a Masters (if they didn't want to become academics), and rather earn some work experience. Of the handful that I know a few have said that a PhD sort of puts them in a difficult position. Everyone tells them that they are over qualified for the roles that they apply for, but can't apply for the higher level roles because they don't have the experience.

No one told them that unless you are going to work in a very specialised field where you can use your PhD, employers will rather employ someone else for less.

Of course once they get their foot in the door they usually shine and grow very quickly as they prove themselves.

Note: Im not knocking PhD's. Just noting what I have experienced.

 

[redspark]

...The mayor met Dr Mekuto in her office on Wednesday and offered him a job.

Me thinks this is the reason why the mayor is facing suspension from the DA.

 

[Nicodeamus]

Ive met a handful of PhD graduates (science related fields) who sort of had the same attitude.

They all expected to earn more than others their age because they have earned a PhD (even if they dont have industry experience). They turn down jobs that dont offer crazy amounts of money, even though it would get them a foot in the door.

Next they sort of get a realisation that they probably should have stopped at a Masters (if they didn't want to become academics), and rather earn some work experience. Of the handful that I know a few have said that a PhD sort of puts them in a difficult position. Everyone tells them that they are over qualified for the roles that they apply for, but can't apply for the higher level roles because they don't have the experience.

No one told them that unless you are going to work in a very specialised field where you can use your PhD, employers will rather employ someone else for less.

Of course once they get their foot in the door they usually shine and grow very quickly as they prove themselves.

Note: Im not knocking PhD's. Just noting what I have experienced.

It is a big problem In SA that the academics are totally out of sync with the industry. There are opportunities for industrial Phds, but very often the Proffs would like to push their onlwn research and end up badly advising the students. I dont see the point of doing a Phd, unless you are going to he an expert in where you are going to be working or if you want to stay in academia.

 

[Nicodeamus]

I work at a company which sponsors PhDs for certain employees but we are research focused and a national institution. Definitely not typical of the private sector though there are occasionally exceptions.

This was certainly the case in the cement manufacturing industry. I know that companies such as SASOL and Aurecon also offer a great deal of studying opportunities (it does come at a cost though). Lots of staff do not take advantage of it and very often thr Universities do not know. Companies don’t like sponsoring a random student simply for the sale of sponsorship.

 

[cguy]

It is a big problem In SA that the academics are totally out of sync with the industry. There are opportunities for industrial Phds, but very often the Proffs would like to push their onlwn research and end up badly advising the students. I dont see the point of doing a Phd, unless you are going to he an expert in where you are going to be working or if you want to stay in academia.

One generally does a PhD to work as a researcher. Most PhDs don't get to work on the exact topic that they are experts in, it's more that the tools, knowledge and methodology can be applied relatively widely. For STEM, anyone doing cutting edge innovation, will need researchers. The topic or Prof's preference are usually not that important as long as the PhD isn't some sort of soft topic.

 

[Kloofvreter]

Peasant