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Question of the Day: What's the most interesting small town you've visited in South Africa?
Programmer/Developer getting old
- Thread starter debonair
- Start date
kripstoe
Expert Member
Hamster
Resident Rodent
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Let's say you earn R60k pm, that is R720 pa excluding bonuses. So technically it can happen but you'll need to know your ****. That happening at age 27 though - I call BS. Unless you know someone or are related to the owners, earning that much at a toung age is just ridiculous.
If you're a specialist with unique skills that are in demand, then it's entirely possible. Believe what you will, I'm not going to provide proof.
DominionZA
Executive Member
I see it quite a bit. Seems you travelling in the wrong circles dude.
99% of the time developers cost money, not make money.
Besides, I am talking coding. You job cannot be coding, and earn a bar, 99% of the time. This does not happen quite a bit.
Now coding 50% and running a team the other 50% of the time is a different story, as you can run projects under budget, hence you are now a profit centre. And there are very very few projects that can be run and deved by one person that can give margins to give those sorts of salaries
Besides, I am talking coding. You job cannot be coding, and earn a bar, 99% of the time. This does not happen quite a bit.
Now coding 50% and running a team the other 50% of the time is a different story, as you can run projects under budget, hence you are now a profit centre. And there are very very few projects that can be run and deved by one person that can give margins to give those sorts of salaries
HavocXphere
Honorary Master
The magic lies in coming up with it the first place, not in how it works. E=mc^2 is pretty trivial too - I can explain it to a kid (or at a job interview even). And yet I wouldn't dare claiming I can match what Einstein did in coming up with it. Most problems are easy after you've seen the solutions.
:wtf:
Guess this topic went a bit OT 
I guess it depends on what you class a software developer as. Guess its due to a "non regulated" field. If someone who is not in "IT" asks me what I do, I might say "computer programmer". Because that might be something they can relate to. Project manager is "douchy"
and not accurate either. Maybe solutions architect is more descriptive, but that doesn't even sound like a real thing
So if developer =code monkey, then younger might be better (ie 27 YO not 22 yo ). And depends on the job and even work environment. I wouldnt even invite for interview a 50 yo for a junior position
I guess it depends on what you class a software developer as. Guess its due to a "non regulated" field. If someone who is not in "IT" asks me what I do, I might say "computer programmer". Because that might be something they can relate to. Project manager is "douchy"
and not accurate either. Maybe solutions architect is more descriptive, but that doesn't even sound like a real thing So if developer =code monkey, then younger might be better (ie 27 YO not 22 yo ). And depends on the job and even work environment. I wouldnt even invite for interview a 50 yo for a junior position
Wow, I know that's just an analogy, but it is waaay off. This really isn't something that is too hard to come up with: Anyone who was programming mathematical code using a maths coprocessor in the 80's and 90's should be aware that the integer instructions were still way faster than floating point instructions, and used the fact that trancendentals such as exp and log could be quickly approximated using int->float and float->int reinterpretation casts respectively. The rest is just algebra (first year university level). Hell, it looks like the original author didn't even publish the work.
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HavocXphere
Honorary Master
I'm told NDAs and copyrights are fairly common in the software industry.
The code is so famous that it has a freakin wikipedia page. They still don't know how the author arrived at the constant (various theories)...and you conclude "This really isn't something that is too hard to come up with". I think we'll just have to agree to disagree because this argument is a lost cause.
The author isn't in the software industry, he's an academic, and has actually made the basis code available, he just never published a paper on it. Like I said before, the reason it's famous is because the theory behind its behavior is obfuscated, and hence interesting to reverse engineer (that, and the fact that it was found in the Quake code). The constant isn't magical either: people don't know how that exact constant was chosen, but they do know why such a constant was chosen, and how to go about choosing such a constant.
This is a very smart implementation, but the way some people treat it's discovery as god-like just indicates ignorance of what a lot of people consider day to day work. The same guy has done tons of other smart things, they're just not as famous because they weren't included in Quake, and weren't at some point falsely attributed to John Carmack.
The point being that the guy who came up with this wasn't a kid in the first place. I am still trying to figure out why this "makes an _intelligent_ 25 y/o programmer invincible" and "makes a 50 y/o programmer weak". This is the most ageist nonsense I've heard in a long time.
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stevenv
Expert Member
While it stays on topic, this is an interesting thread. And sobering at the same time.
Some interesting links on productivity, not all agreeing (The last link gives the opposite arguments from the first two, even through I more tend to agree with the first two, from what I have seen over the years):
http://blogs.construx.com/blogs/ste...rs-and-teams-the-origin-of-quot-10x-quot.aspx
http://www.johndcook.com/blog/2009/...not-paid-in-proportion-to-their-productivity/
http://www.knowing.net/index.php/2011/12/09/forbes-is-wrong-about-developernomics/
As mentioned in earlier posts in this thread, experience can significantly contribute to productivity, but only if the person keeps on learning. Does not help if the person does not develop his/her skills. Do not expect to develop for 30 years and then be a super programmer if you do not constantly update your skills by reading, studying and doing courses.
http://blogs.construx.com/blogs/ste...rs-and-teams-the-origin-of-quot-10x-quot.aspx
http://www.johndcook.com/blog/2009/...not-paid-in-proportion-to-their-productivity/
http://www.knowing.net/index.php/2011/12/09/forbes-is-wrong-about-developernomics/
As mentioned in earlier posts in this thread, experience can significantly contribute to productivity, but only if the person keeps on learning. Does not help if the person does not develop his/her skills. Do not expect to develop for 30 years and then be a super programmer if you do not constantly update your skills by reading, studying and doing courses.
Every position costs money. Devs build systems which contribute to the efficiency of the org. Try running a bank without computerised systems and then tell me again that devs don't make a co any money.