Quickbooks

[Celine]

a friend of mine was outsourcing to a particular business for 12 years. she was doing their payroll, PAYE VAT UIF etc. they have dismissed her for dishonesty because she paid herself her bonus which she has done for the past 12 years. she received an email from some person they employed in a supervisor capacity who emailed her in mid december saying that no one was going to be receiving bonuses because the company couldn't afford it. she had it in her contract that this bonus would not ever be taken away from her because they did not pay her telephone or internet.

now - she has been using quickbooks. she purchased this programme herself out of her own pocket and did not ask for reimbursement. the business would email an excel spreadsheet to her each day/week/month and she would put the info herself into quickbooks and go about her business. this business has 84 employees. not once did she ask for reimbursement when the licence renewal came around.

now the business is demanding that she give them a backup of the payroll system and other info before they release her UI19. she has told them they are not entitled to any info as they did not pay for this and if they want any info they must continue using their xcel system they emailed to her each month.

i am in total agreement with her here as they trying to make things easier for themselves. they have their own quickbooks but have never used it.

anyone know the legal issues regarding this.

 

[mister]

I don't know the legal issues, but I sure as hell wouldn't give them the quickbooks data! Unless they agree to a hefty fee! And as for the UI19, just report them to the department of labour

 

[Gadget Man]

There are a couple of separate issues here, from a legal viewpoint.

First of all, she is an independent contractor and not an employee. She purchased the tools (Quickbooks) and captured all the info in Quickbooks. The company is entitled to the work she captured and not the program or the licence for Quickbooks. Quickbooks stores the captured work as a Company, and that's what the company is entitled to as they paid for that to be done.

The issue of the bonus is separate and a contractual one. If it was in her contract, then she is entitled to it, provided that it is air tight. If the clause said the bonus is discretionary, then she is not entitled to it.

 

[Gadget Man]

The UI19 is labour issue. They can't withhold that.

If the company goes after her for the data, she will loose. She can only keep it if she refunds all payments they made to her.

 

[syntax]

There are a couple of separate issues here, from a legal viewpoint.

First of all, she is an independent contractor and not an employee. She purchased the tools (Quickbooks) and captured all the info in Quickbooks. The company is entitled to the work she captured and not the program or the licence for Quickbooks. Quickbooks stores the captured work as a Company, and that's what the company is entitled to as they paid for that to be done.

The issue of the bonus is separate and a contractual one. If it was in her contract, then she is entitled to it, provided that it is air tight. If the clause said the bonus is discretionary, then she is not entitled to it.

its what i would have thought as well...

 

[Gadget Man]

I also doubt that there will be a UI19, because of her being an independent contractor. Was she registered for UIF to start with?

 

[Sackboy]

There are a couple of separate issues here, from a legal viewpoint.

First of all, she is an independent contractor and not an employee. She purchased the tools (Quickbooks) and captured all the info in Quickbooks. The company is entitled to the work she captured and not the program or the licence for Quickbooks. Quickbooks stores the captured work as a Company, and that's what the company is entitled to as they paid for that to be done.

The issue of the bonus is separate and a contractual one. If it was in her contract, then she is entitled to it, provided that it is air tight. If the clause said the bonus is discretionary, then she is not entitled to it.

They are entitled to the output and not the system or process itself AFAIK.
She can just tell them she deleted the data if she wants. She bought the package and has control over everything in it. They can make her an offer of course.

Bonuses are never guaranteed and cannot be demanded. There appears to have been an agreement to remimburse her for expenses, so she should be calling it that and not "bonus". She should have receipts to show what the items paid were.

 

[Celine]

I also doubt that there will be a UI19, because of her being an independent contractor. Was she registered for UIF to start with?

yes she was registered for UIF.

 

[Celine]

They are entitled to the output and not the system or process itself AFAIK.
She can just tell them she deleted the data if she wants. She bought the package and has control over everything in it. They can make her an offer of course.

Bonuses are never guaranteed and cannot be demanded. There appears to have been an agreement to remimburse her for expenses, so she should be calling it that and not "bonus". She should have receipts to show what the items paid were.

even if the business was not interested in using the programme themselves to begin with? they used the xcel spreadsheet system which they forwarded to her each period. so they have that. it was her that decided it would be easier for her as the payroll administrator to use quickbooks and to transfer all the information onto the quickbooks system. this wasn't required from her per say.
so the question is - even tho they do have their own info on a different system, does this entitle them to her system and her work on a system she decided to purchase at her own cost and expense.
i hear what you are saying that it is their information, but DOES it entitle them to control over the information she processed at her own expense, time and effort?

 

[Drake2007]

They are entitled to the data that they paid for, however that does not mean it has to be easy and convenient for them to use it. If she wants to get nasty then they are quite welcome to recapture it all over again from her printouts which they can be billed for and not the original quickbooks files as there would be nothing stated in the contract as per the format of the data.