Russo-Ukrainian War - 2022 Edition - Part 2
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Russo-Ukrainian War - 2022 Edition - Part3
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Ukrainian artillerymen show how six CAESARs fired on the occupiers and their equipment
ROMAN PETRENKO – FRIDAY, 17 JUNE 2022, 13:59
he Ministry of Defence of Ukraine has published a video where one volley by 6 CAESARs [self-propelled howitzers] fired on an area where Russian forces had concentrated more than 15 pieces of weaponry and military equipment.
Source: Ministry of Defence of Ukraine
Details: It has been reported that a Russian 2C-19 Msta-C self-propelled howitzer, as well as the command and staff vehicle of the battery commander were struck by a direct hit [by a Caesar].
According to military personnel, the CAESAR can strike the Kremlin invaders with high accuracy at a distance of 20 km or more from the front line.
Quote from the Ministry of Defence: "[The Ukrainian] artillery are already using the CAESAR and other major NATO calibres effectively on the battlefield."
Background: Emmanuel Macron, the French President, has announced the delivery of six more CAESARs, the flagship of French artillery, to Ukraine.
Ukraine to scrap visa-free travel for Russians from July 1
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Blu82
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Gary Waterworth
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Nicodeamus
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For the origins of the conflict for a leading international politics scholar,
Tip: Mirai will be offended as it contradicts his narrative (but if he listens to the end he will realize that Mearsheimer doesn't discount Russia's imperial ambitions),
Tip: Mirai will be offended as it contradicts his narrative (but if he listens to the end he will realize that Mearsheimer doesn't discount Russia's imperial ambitions),
Nico, you cherry pick experts. Just because someone is a 'leading scholar' does not make him right. This isn't an empirical science. Please take this to heart.
I already told you that some Westerners have set their mind to one approach to Russia. Is that she's too big to fail. But that's not necessarily true. Russia will ultimately fail and the West will have to deal with what's left over.
Ukraine dealing with it now, is almost a miracle. If Ukrainians want to fight, the Anglo-Saxons and their allies will provide them with support even if France and Germany don't want to.
You said some weeks ago that paradigms change when their proponents die off. Maybe Mearsheimer and co have to retire and we'll see a different view.
Still it's tellling that there are many factions and the pseudo-realist faction is only one. We see it by the US response. Mearsheimer and Kissinger have influence but aren't calling the shots, at least not to the full extent. As said this isn't an empirical science where we can measure stuff and decide who is correct.
And war may come. Remember 1914 and 1939. Joseph Beck in 1939 managed to change the situation into a world war. Once the UK was involved the US would follow suit. Axis were doomed from them on.
The situation is even worse now for isolationists because Europe is integrated and NATO exists. China is looming and would like Europe and to push the US away and some continental powers may actually go along with that. The US needs allies in Europe, Ukraine would be a strong ally for the next 50-100 years.
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Russia carrying out their own internal special operation
Gary Waterworth
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Same reply from earlier today
Your point being ?
In his 25 September 2015 lecture "Why is Ukraine the West's Fault?" Mearsheimer stated US and EU policies to Ukraine were a primrose promise, that the Western powers are encouraging Ukraine to be part of the West (even though they will be rebuffed) and encouraging the Ukraine Government to pursue a hardline policy against Russia and that "the end result is that Ukraine is going to get wrecked".[76] In the same lecture Mearsheimer declared: "If you really want to wreck Russia, what you should do is to encourage it to try to conquer Ukraine. Putin is much too smart to try that".[77]
1. Countries have free choice to do what they believe is best for them and their citizens
2. No country has a right to dictate to another country (like Russia did)
3. No country has a right to invade another country
4. This guy was right. Russia invades, its economy will go to ****
5. Putin was an idiot
John Mearsheimer - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
rambo919
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@Cray
Can't quote from previous thread.
The term invasion is used in different ways. In one way it means any kind of forceful entry, in another it means and outright seizure that was completely unwarranted. The former fits with regards to crimea except that they were already there.... the latter does not fit at all unless you worship borders as drawn on a map since there was more acceptance than resistance with regards to the local population. Crimea was basically a successful secession movement.
Your clarification is basically what I said just much more judgemental. I too thought Russia was just gonna do intimidation and was surprised when it actually invaded.... everyone was a bit surprised when they did it the way they did it whether they want to admit it or not.... otherwise everyone would not have been in shock about it.
As I have said numerous times what I or you think was legitimate provocation does not matter, what matters is what Russia thought was legitimate. You must view this from a Russian pov to understand not your own.
When it comes to objectively what was provocation, Ukraine is a little dog that has been acting like a big dog and has been sniping bites at Russia ever since the fall of the Soviet Union. But when it comes to the ethnic Russians within Ukraine the government finally went too far and gave Russia a solid Cassus Belli on a silver platter when it started to victimize these Russians and even started a campaign of slow ethnic cleansing. That alone gave Russia the right to intervene in some way, not necessarily invasion but in some way. This was simply put, stupid. Combined with Ukraine begging to be let into NATO a Russian physical response at some point was inevitable because of internal political pressure on Putin.... in many ways he was forced to invade or have his head put on a pike by the people.
When it comes to attacking the whole of Ukraine to make the donbass safe long term, it's a solid military strategy provided you completely neuter the enemy. Perhaps not solid politically but remember it's Russians doing this and they usually think scorched earth before they think anything else. In hindsight this invasion in itself was not surprising, the way they fcked it up and allowed it to become a full scale war though... is something they won't easily recover from. Again it perhaps was not meant to be a war but it got out of hand and now it is.
Austrian and German are genetically the same, no real difference. It's like saying a Afrikaner and Boer are genetically distinct.... it's simply not true.
And for some reason I must once again repeat the tired old exasperated explanation that... I have no love for Russia. I respect Russia but I do not love it, especially because it is the enemy of my own people as much as it is the enemy of the Slavs. I am simply honest enough to give my enemy a proper assessment. I actually find it offensive to be called a Putin lover given I would have no real opposition to having him shot.
Can't quote from previous thread.
The term invasion is used in different ways. In one way it means any kind of forceful entry, in another it means and outright seizure that was completely unwarranted. The former fits with regards to crimea except that they were already there.... the latter does not fit at all unless you worship borders as drawn on a map since there was more acceptance than resistance with regards to the local population. Crimea was basically a successful secession movement.
Your clarification is basically what I said just much more judgemental. I too thought Russia was just gonna do intimidation and was surprised when it actually invaded.... everyone was a bit surprised when they did it the way they did it whether they want to admit it or not.... otherwise everyone would not have been in shock about it.
As I have said numerous times what I or you think was legitimate provocation does not matter, what matters is what Russia thought was legitimate. You must view this from a Russian pov to understand not your own.
When it comes to objectively what was provocation, Ukraine is a little dog that has been acting like a big dog and has been sniping bites at Russia ever since the fall of the Soviet Union. But when it comes to the ethnic Russians within Ukraine the government finally went too far and gave Russia a solid Cassus Belli on a silver platter when it started to victimize these Russians and even started a campaign of slow ethnic cleansing. That alone gave Russia the right to intervene in some way, not necessarily invasion but in some way. This was simply put, stupid. Combined with Ukraine begging to be let into NATO a Russian physical response at some point was inevitable because of internal political pressure on Putin.... in many ways he was forced to invade or have his head put on a pike by the people.
When it comes to attacking the whole of Ukraine to make the donbass safe long term, it's a solid military strategy provided you completely neuter the enemy. Perhaps not solid politically but remember it's Russians doing this and they usually think scorched earth before they think anything else. In hindsight this invasion in itself was not surprising, the way they fcked it up and allowed it to become a full scale war though... is something they won't easily recover from. Again it perhaps was not meant to be a war but it got out of hand and now it is.
Austrian and German are genetically the same, no real difference. It's like saying a Afrikaner and Boer are genetically distinct.... it's simply not true.
And for some reason I must once again repeat the tired old exasperated explanation that... I have no love for Russia. I respect Russia but I do not love it, especially because it is the enemy of my own people as much as it is the enemy of the Slavs. I am simply honest enough to give my enemy a proper assessment. I actually find it offensive to be called a Putin lover given I would have no real opposition to having him shot.
He believes smaller states actually don't have a right to sovereignty.Same reply from earlier today
Your point being ?
In his 25 September 2015 lecture "Why is Ukraine the West's Fault?" Mearsheimer stated US and EU policies to Ukraine were a primrose promise, that the Western powers are encouraging Ukraine to be part of the West (even though they will be rebuffed) and encouraging the Ukraine Government to pursue a hardline policy against Russia and that "the end result is that Ukraine is going to get wrecked".[76] In the same lecture Mearsheimer declared: "If you really want to wreck Russia, what you should do is to encourage it to try to conquer Ukraine. Putin is much too smart to try that".[77]
1. Countries have free choice to do what they believe is best for them and their citizens
2. No country has a right to dictate to another country (like Russia did)
3. No country has a right to invade another country
4. This guy was right. Russia invades, its economy will go to ****
5. Putin was an idiot
John Mearsheimer - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
He believes bigger states like the USA and Russia cando what they want.
It is a school of thought called Geopolitical realism. It is the same school of thought that Kissinger belongs to.
It was a way for the Cold War warriors in the US to justify the US Imperialism during the 60's and 70's which saw the US invading any country that hinted at finding their own way outside of the US sphere of influence.
The thing is that Russia is not a superpower anymore as has been shown recently.
In fact Russia falls in the Chinese sphere of influence while Ukraine in the American via virtue of NATO.
It's just RealPolitik. But what's real is that Russia is a has been. Just a has been with nukes. And cheap resources which make the German economy competitive.
It's also not the case that the super powers respected each other, there was none of that in Korea, Cuba or Vietnam.