Small Web Shop development company

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NightShift

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Can anyone recommend a company or consultant in Cape Town that can develop basic web shops at a reasonable price? This seems to be hard to find as most companies are chasing the big fish, or wanting to charge a small planet.

Essentially what I’m trying to get is pretty straightforward to start.
1. A product list of about 80 prodcuts that I can personally add to, remove, categorise, and ammend.
2. A registration module for site users and a cart for them to place goods into
3. Ideally payment gateway integration for credit card payment, but this is a bonus and not a ‘must have’ at the start
4. Logo and Corporate ID creation (ie good graphic design skills – the site cannot look crap, no matter how functional it is)

There is a potentially expansive roadmap of features to add to the site in future but none of that will come to fruition until a start is made. The organisation/consultant would also need references and be able to showcase other designs that they have already succesfully completed.

Anyone know of anyone good? Also for this sort of normal requirement, what are the ballpark figures for such a project?

Thanks!
 
Why not just use NopCommerce? It's free and can do everything you need :-)

If you need help with it, let me know.
 
If you don't have a big budget, use something like osCommerce, or any of the other free web shops out there.
With a bit of testing, you could get very far with it.
 
Nod said:
... osCommerce ...
Click to expand...
Rather try zen cart.

Or do your own research on some free shopping cart software out there.

Once decided on the software, buy a skin for that software that looks good for you (This will work out much cheaper than getting a company, even a small one, to make the site for you). Then find a local hosting company with a good technical department (I can recommend hetzner or webafrica) and ask them to help you load up the site after you purchased your domain and hosting.

All in all this can be done with a little bit of technical knowledge. If you have managed to post here you should be 90% competent to get this going.
 
Why is the misconception that software development is cheap still around....? :confused:

*Sigh* I suppose that's a whole thread unto itself.
 
dequadin said:
Why is the misconception that software development is cheap still around....? :confused:
Click to expand...
But with all the free cart software available out there, setting up a small shopping site does not require that much actual development any more.
 
who said that software development was cheap? Or do you infer that if something is not expensive (i.e. costs less than a small planet) then its cheap? Dont sound so hurt ;)

Actually all I’m trying to do it find some value for money. Id have a budget of around R10-12k for a small website. As such I’d hope for more than something cobled together in OSCommerce over a lunch break, otherwise I would just rather do it myself, and I might if I cant find someone to meet my need. What I’m not looking to do is spend 50-100k on something with several bells and whistles (I simply couldn’t even if I wanted to).

To simplify, I don’t want a Ferrari, and I’d also like to avoid a Go-Kart. A nice reliable second-hand sedan would be just fine for now.
 
Markd said:
who said that software development was cheap? Or do you infer that if something is not expensive (i.e. costs less than a small planet) then its cheap? Dont sound so hurt ;)

Actually all I’m trying to do it find some value for money. Id have a budget of around R10-12k for a small website. As such I’d hope for more than something cobled together in OSCommerce over a lunch break, otherwise I would just rather do it myself, and I might if I cant find someone to meet my need. What I’m not looking to do is spend 50-100k on something with several bells and whistles (I simply couldn’t even if I wanted to).

To simplify, I don’t want a Ferrari, and I’d also like to avoid a Go-Kart. A nice reliable second-hand sedan would be just fine for now.
Click to expand...

Too bad I'm not in CT then. I would've done it for you for 12k. I've quoted less for custom basic online shops before and got shot down as well, due to it being too expensive. :confused: I don't deal with those people anymore, luckily.
 
Markd said:
who said that software development was cheap? Or do you infer that if something is not expensive (i.e. costs less than a small planet) then its cheap? Dont sound so hurt ;)

Actually all I’m trying to do it find some value for money. Id have a budget of around R10-12k for a small website. As such I’d hope for more than something cobled together in OSCommerce over a lunch break, otherwise I would just rather do it myself, and I might if I cant find someone to meet my need. What I’m not looking to do is spend 50-100k on something with several bells and whistles (I simply couldn’t even if I wanted to).

To simplify, I don’t want a Ferrari, and I’d also like to avoid a Go-Kart. A nice reliable second-hand sedan would be just fine for now.
Click to expand...

Let me try to explain what others can't.

You can't buy a Volkswagen (which is better than a Go-Kart) and later down the line put a Ferrari body kit on it and expect it to perform the same way as a Ferrari. You're talking about 2 wildly different vehicles (literally and figuratively) so in the end, you get what you pay for. If you go the cheap option, then you're going to pay quite a bit in having modifications done later on for it to suit your needs. To give you an example of this:

A company I worked for in Dubai wanted a new back-end for their online gift shop. I told them I will rewrite everything, do a relational database design that would suit their exact needs and have it in their custom design (done by the in-house designers) and it will take more or less 3 months. They said "that's too long" and I should just "download something off the internet"

That was March 2008. They're STILL busy with modifications on the site. The original design was butchered to high-hell because it wouldn't really fit in with their "just download this shopping cart" mindset, and something that would've cost them 3 months of my salary, costs them 20+ times that in the end. And it's STILL not finished like they wanted it.

You're looking to spend at least half your budget on DESIGN ALONE. Because you would need some form of stationary and logo/identity to go with your site DESIGN. Then for the rest, it really depends on what you want to start out with. A basic e-commerce backend you described is simple to do, but you forget all the admin that needs to go into it... cancelling orders / credit notes, reports, user management, content management (for pages like T&C/About Us), shipping module (unless you plan to have the same shipping cost for everyone?), vouchers, discounts, special offers on products etc etc etc etc

Sure you could get a generic product off the shelf like osCommerce or Zen Kart or whatever the hell these guys suggest. But down the line, when you're trying to "soop up" your Volkswagen to do the work of the Ferrari, you'll find you're going to spend more time and money in making it LOOK and ACT like a Ferrari, than it would have been if you just got one from the start.

I'd budget R150k for an e-commerce site if I were you. That will get you want from the get-go and you wouldn't have to spend a penny more unless there were serious miscommunication in the beginning (which there always is if you have n00bs working for you) and you can drive around the Ferrari all you like. It will then require minimal support/upkeep from the company who did it in the first place and the ONLY thing you'd have to worry about is marketing and SEO to get things going and get people to buy ****. (nb, more than likely the 150k I estimate will include server costs for a few months and some adwords or whatever to start you out with. It's a nice "max" figure to aim for)

People often think the internet is different to a normal business, it's not

If you were to open a shop anywhere, you'd have to pay for rent/deposit/fittings/logos/stationary/tills/staff/stock all before you even make your first sale. Anyone that goes into a business going "I'll just see how it goes and maybe spend some more money later on" haven't done their marketing research and business plan and have NO clue as to how demand looks like OR if there's any interest in their products. The internet and online shops are no different
 
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AcidRaZor said:
Let me try to explain what others can't.

You can't buy a Volkswagen (which is better than a Go-Kart) and later down the line put a Ferrari body kit on it and expect it to perform the same way as a Ferrari. You're talking about 2 wildly different vehicles (literally and figuratively) so in the end, you get what you pay for. If you go the cheap option, then you're going to pay quite a bit in having modifications done later on for it to suit your needs. To give you an example of this:

A company I worked for in Dubai...[/b]
Click to expand...

I appologise if I lead you to believe that I was in the same league as some company in Dubai who you worked for who have lots of money but dont want to spend it. I'm not. If I was, I'd give you your three months and let you go wild. Alas!

I hear what you are saying with regards to making a VW behave like a Ferrari, so to continue with this analogy, I wouldnt hack and slash it, I'd trade it in when I could afford the ferrari. What you need to keep in mind is that the one is a pre-requisite for the other because i do not have the budget for a ferrari out the box. I agree with most of what you've said, its just not relevent for what i need right now.
 
AcidRaZor said:
...
I'd budget R150k for an e-commerce site if I were you.
...
People often think the internet is different to a normal business, it's not

If you were to open a shop anywhere, you'd have to pay for rent/deposit/fittings/logos/stationary/tills/staff/stock all before you even make your first sale.
...
Click to expand...
You also have to cater for your kind of business.
It would be stupid to rent a 500 sq meter shop, pay thousands for a logo, order tons of stationary - if you only want to open a little biltong shop.

The OP stated that they have about 80 items. They do not need a 150K custom e-commerce solution. Zen Cart and osCommerce and the like are very scalable for new and small e-commerce sites. If their site starts to make money so that they can afford a 150K site then I'd say to go for it. Until then a "download something from the internet" will do.

AcidRaZor said:
"down for maintenance" says it all...
Click to expand...
They are adding a new payment gateway.
Even your 150K solution would have to receive maintenance from time to time.
 
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uFiS said:
They are adding a new payment gateway.
Even your 150K solution would have to receive maintenance from time to time.
Click to expand...

Actually not. Since there's enough QA on development servers done beforehand to make the transition seamless and done after hours. Just speaks volumes about how much business they actually do to be able to afford downtime during normal business hours.

As for your statement about renting a 500sq meter shop etc. I agree, and this is where a business plan/marketing strategy/market analysis comes in handy as well as how you see yourself growing in the next 5 years. To me it sounds like one of those "I have a product that I'm going to sell and Imma do it online and make MILLIONS" type of ideas. Not very well thought out, no marketing strategy, no user poll to see how much demand there is for the products etc.

You have to handle your online business the exact same way you do if you're starting a normal physical business and go from there. Sure you don't need the chocolate fountain that is free to use for your cellphone shop, that's *extra* expenditure. But getting a place that you can go "yea, and when I have enough revenue I'll put a chocolate fountain right there" that fits your needs currently, it will pay off exponentially later on. Imagine you have a business, and you outgrow your space you hired in 6-12 months time. People get accustomed to where you're situated. It's going to do more damage than good to now have to move into a bigger premises just because you didn't have the foresight to account for the growth when your business was still in the planning stages.

Sure the internet is a different beast, you can move servers and grow capacity without any interruption at all really. But if you outgrow your software (and you will), you'll be stuck scrambling to try and pay for better software/programmers to implement something that would've worked from the get go if you planned it properly.

Ask yourself this, currently, as it is now, can you afford to open up a physical shop with the budget you have and the planned revenue you're estimating to earn from it?

If the answer is "No" then you need to rethink your entire business plan/idea.

There are several factors to account for when opening any business. And you need to be aware that for a startup like this there is a trade off to how much time you spend sorting **** out due to issues with your site, and how much you spent getting everything up and running (your budget). Go ahead. Do what you think will work. But out of experience I'm telling you now that the way you're approaching this will fail and cost you more than you ever bargained for.

If your time is worthless to you, then consider whatever you're doing "free". It doesn't really sound that the OP has any experience dealing with stuff like this, so even if he gets a recommendation to go ahead and use a company (Stay away from Cape Town Media), you'll find that the original 3 month deadline and R23k cost for developing/designing/implementing his site turns into a 15 month/150k budget almost overnight. I don't thumbsuck this ****, I'm taking *real* world scenarios. I haven't even told you about the one client I had who paid R750k upfront for a CRM implementation that wasn't even CLOSE to their requirements... but still. Go ahead.

I'd be surprised if you can post 12 months from now and go "I'm doing Rx number of sales and haven't had to spend a penny more than R12k, how awesome is that!"

Remember, initial investment in any business only pays back after 12-36 months. That's what you should aim for. So if your aim is to spend R12k, you're telling yourself, over a max period of 3 years I'll make back the initial investment I just pushed into this new business. Then ask yourself, "is this worthwhile?!"
 
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I've noted your powerful opinions there Acid - ta.

back to the original topic though - thanks to those people who given me leads. If anybody else has any please feel free to PM me.
 
AcidRaZor said:
Actually not. Since there's enough QA on development servers done beforehand to make the transition seamless and done after hours. Just speaks volumes about how much business they actually do to be able to afford downtime during normal business hours.
...
Click to expand...

You confuse large multi million dollar companies with small start ups. (The site I mentioned has been running for a week - so I doubt if they have any sales yet) This is the key. Not every online shop has 150K (or even 12K) to spend on e-commerce software. Not every online store will make millions.
If I have above mentioned biltong shop, and my online shop will net me an extra 2 grand of sales a month, it will be an extra 2 grand a month. And I definitely do not want to fork out 150K to achieve that.
Have you stopped to ask Markd what business he is in? Or even what kind of products they sell?

If these free carts are so useless, how come so many shops are using them? Why are they still being developed?

Most of the good free cart software packages is so mature and has such a large community that it has very few shortcomings and those you encounter can easily be implemented by the community - sometimes at a small fee.

There is a place for free downloaded from the internet shopping carts. Telling everyone to invest 150K in a custom cart is a bit of a narrow view.
 
I would first take a look at how your customers buy from you.
A eCommerce site might not be what you need. Don't over complicate your selling process.

Maybe a simple site, with a down-loadable pdf price list/product list, might be all you need.
Easy to update and edit.
(remember to mention till when prices are valid on the pdf.)
 
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