Socialism or Barbarism

Nanfeishen

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Some interesting articles that certainly make quite a bit of sense when one views them objectively.

Time is of the essence. Given the descent into barbarism that the world is witnessing as a result of the breakdown in capitalism, there is a very real danger that US-led militarism could escalate even further from its existing criminal wars in Iraq and Afghanistan/Pakistan into an all-out conflagration with any number of countries designated to be geopolitical rivals or miscreants: China, Russia, Iran, North Korea, Venezuela, Cuba. History proves that this is always the brutal outcome when the profit system is threatened with total collapse.

For those committed to creating a world of social justice and peace, it is vital to communicate as widely as possible as to the precise cause of the present economic failure, with its consequent social misery and violence. Let’s not be under any illusions about the root of barbarism today: it is, as Rosa Luxemburg and others have pointed out, the failure of capitalism as a system of production and distribution to meet human needs in an equitable, democratic and sustainable way.

Equally vital in this hour is the need to put forward an alternative to barbarism in order to mobilise the majority of ordinary people ravaged by the capitalist kleptocracy; to provide a clear set of social, economic and political objectives. Otherwise, the kleptocrats – the corporate leaders, banks, financial gamblers and their political and military servants – will attempt purging the crisis through escalated war (and all the chaos and disinformation that will ensue).

What also needs to be communicated widely is that the objective of democratic control of the economy cannot be achieved within the two-party system of the US and most other western states. These parties have shown themselves to be willing partners-in-crime with the oligarchy, which also includes the leaders of labour unions who have served to emasculate workers and their rights.

To that end, the case must be made more than ever that socialism is a viable alternative to this barbarism. To save time and space here, readers can avail of several existing statements for practical, socialist change (for example, see www.wsws.org and www.workerscompass.org). In brief, the objective is to bring production under democratic control so that basic human needs for food and accommodation, meaningful work, health and education become the determinants of the economy – not the private profit of an elite that has evidently brought whole societies to their knees. As a first step, the major, vital industries (manufacturers, energy, communications and banks) must be properly nationalised, that is, brought under democratic control to meet needs democratically. A half-baked form of nationalism is already underway with taxpayer bailouts of automakers and banks. The trouble is that the kleptocrats are still receiving the lion’s share of financial rewards. So, any baulking by the oligarchy and their media mouthpieces over “public ownership” should be laughed at with derision.

In communicating the viability of socialism, the use of language needs to be precise in order to debunk myths and disinformation so as to help the constituency for change – the majority of citizens – retain their focus on the required direction for democratic change. Here are some myths and disinformation: .............
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=17573

The argument is won: capitalism as an effective system to organise society and provide for human needs has expired. The evidence is conclusive. Trillions of dollars to kickstart the economy in the US and Europe may have given an ephemeral lease of life to the financial class to spin the casino wheel once again, but it is more apparent by the day that the tentative “recovery” has spluttered to a standstill. Gridlocked by unprecedented levels of personal and national debts, the engine of production – the real economy – is in a state of rigor mortis.

This collapse has been a long time in the making. Decades of easy credit was up to now a way for the ruling class – government, corporations, financial institutions – to let the majority of workers subsidise the chronic loss in their livelihoods, which have been drained since the mid-1970s by the oligarchy’s self-aggrandisement from wage cutting, regressive taxation and public spending cuts. The political class – whether liberal or conservative, right or left – have facilitated this giant wealth-siphoning process. .........................
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=17517

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals. In such an economy, the means of production are owned by society itself and are utilized in a planned fashion. A planned economy, which adjusts production to the needs of the community, would distribute the work to be done among all those able to work and would guarantee a livelihood to every man, woman, and child. The education of the individual, in addition to promoting his own innate abilities, would attempt to develop in him a sense of responsibility for his fellow men in place of the glorification of power and success in our present society.
Why Socialism?
by Albert Einstein 1949
http://monthlyreview.org/598einstein.php

I must say i agree with Einstein's view and take on the whole issue.
 
Lots of noble sounding ideas. Everyone will be equal blah blah blah. Even in this so called utopia people will be in charge which is the beginning of the end of this kind of system. It is human nature to take advantage of power. This so called utopia will only make it worse since the people in power will have complete control of your life and will be able to manipulate everyone for their own ends. There you go this system has already fallen apart.
 
Socialism or Barbarism?? ..............or a combination of the ten as we see we are stuck with in South Africa.
 
this socialist utopia delusion is so last century.....
 
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Some interesting articles that certainly make quite a bit of sense when one views them objectively.

Actually, no, no, they don't, they're just spewing garbage that makes absolutely no sense when one 'views them objectively'. They are wrong from so many angles it's difficult even knowing where to start.

We're actually, apart from this tiny one or two year 'blip', living in the world's biggest global economic boom EVER. There has never been anything like it - in China alone some 400 million people have been raised out of poverty in under 20 years. And it's basically a huge capitalist success story. Never in the entire history of humanity have so many people been raised to such high standards of living in such a short time - a mere few decades. All thanks to effectively free trade, really. Your little desire to grab other peoples money under the guise of "social justice" (a meaningless phrase) has been demonstrated quite solidly to be a complete, absolute disaster over and over the past century. However, if you love it so much, you are welcome to go live in Cuba, a veritable paradise and pinnacle of your ideals.
 
Capitalism has failed? When did this happen? I wasn't aware the US was the knight of capitalism. Perhaps it once was pre-1930 but it hasn't been in the last 70-80 years atleast.

You might want to have a closer look at economic theory. The biggest advocates of laissez fair capitalism are the economists who share the "Austrian" viewpoint. They have spoken out again and again against policies in the US and across the world, including the bank bailouts and fractional reserve/fiat banking and how credit elevates the boom and bust cycle. The are the biggest advocates of freedom and free markets and also the biggest critics of "mainstream" economists, governments and their policies.

Why socialism fails has been demonstrated time and time again theoretically and throughout history. It can not be proven that socialist policies create wealth. It has never been done so, not without assuming objective value, which is a false assumption, because value is subjective.

Look up books from Mises on socialism, in fact I think the book is called Socialism. Or go to iTunes, search for Mises and go have a look at the FREELY and LEGALLY available audio books on Austrian economics and such.

You are falsely equating what the US does as "capitalism". Technically it is actually Keynesian policies that are being done.
 
I can't believe you are advocating a "planned" economy. The reason why we are in this predicament is because governments/central bank tried to influence the economy, now you want them to control it?

I should be allowed to own all the fruits of my labour, to tell me otherwise would be to say that I must become a slave to the system.

The fact you are under the impression any institution can correctly estimate the needs and desires of over 6 billion individuals who's values, wants and demands are so wide and varied it would be impossible to even think of, is quite amazing.
 
Cant wait till South Africa reaches that level of enlightenment.

I agree of a nice balance of socialism, especially in health, education and housing with private education etc etc. I do think corporations and their shareholders need to be held more accountable for the actions of a company by the government.
 
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Cant wait till South Africa reaches that level of enlightenment.

Won't happen in our live time, you need a good educational system to maintain it for one, Finland has the best one in the world for example, Sweden is at no3 I believe?
 
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I somewhat agree that as long as the majortiy of people are uneducated ('educated ' not reading and writing, but actually informed and see the world in context) no system will bring peace and equality.

Furthermore as long as there are highly educated, informed and experienced snake oil salesmen and a political elite (visionless fatcat politicians, greedy & crooked businessmen) intent on profiteering at all costs, any system becomes vulnerable to exploitation and eventual failure.

Now that we have global communication and global travel, we should move towards a global perspective.

The truth of our global dire situation is:

- we cannot control nature
- vital resources are limited
- population growth vs resource management

Capitalism can only thrive when resources abound and are limitless.
Socialism can only thrive when all people are educated, informed and willing to participate (work harder & in harmony)

At a global population of ~ 7 billion (with exponential growth) and shrinking resources, no system we currently know of, will save the day.

The truth is obvious, we're in very deep trouble, no matter which way we toss the coin.

The African and Southern American continents and Antartica obviousely have vast amounts of as yet untapped resources - big trouble is coming, take note that the first world is not disarming, first will come peaceful economic investment, then when things get more urgent - first world countries WILL go to war for the last resources.

Anybody who can see the planet in perspective knows we are at the beginning of the Resource War era.

I hope my realistic perspective of the coming chaos is off mark, I really do.
 
We're actually, apart from this tiny one or two year 'blip', living in the world's biggest global economic boom EVER. There has never been anything like it - in China alone some 400 million people have been raised out of poverty in under 20 years. And it's basically a huge capitalist success story. Never in the entire history of humanity have so many people been raised to such high standards of living in such a short time - a mere few decades. All thanks to effectively free trade, really.
Can this be demonstrated?

Why socialism fails has been demonstrated time and time again theoretically and throughout history. It can not be proven that socialist policies create wealth.
What is wealth and why does it need to be created?

Socialism can only thrive when all people are educated, informed and willing to participate (work harder & in harmony)
Anarchy requires the same.

The African and Southern American continents and Antartica obviousely have vast amounts of as yet untapped resources - big trouble is coming, take note that the first world is not disarming, first will come peaceful economic investment, then when things get more urgent - first world countries WILL go to war for the last resources.
They have already long been using hostile measures to extract resources from Africa. I suppose they might become more overt.
 
The Scandinavians have a different perspective to you.

Meh Scandinavia... small isolated countries that benifit from their relations with Europe and natural resources. They need tight government control over their lives just to survive. Sad really.

Capitalism brought a massive improvement in the lives of Westerners. The socialist model was rejected by the U.S and U.K in the late 70s for a reason...
 
they just found the right balance to be honest, having so few people makes it easier to administer and they actually have a government that gives back to its tax payers.

And having a huge tax base (per capita) allows the system to have enough money to fuel their socialist agenda. I would pay up to 55% in tax if I didn't have to pay my RA, hospital bills, had roads repaired, free education and efficient government. No worries.
 
Meh Scandinavia... small isolated countries that benifit from their relations with Europe and natural resources. They need tight government control over their lives just to survive. Sad really.

Capitalism brought a massive improvement in the lives of Westerners. The socialist model was rejected by the U.S and U.K in the late 70s for a reason...

*shudder* I wonder how much air would cost to breath in your utopia.

Unfortunately, corporations which we have no control over except through governments are not really moral beacons of honesty and need to be controlled.

Alan, have you ever watched a documentary called "The Corporation"?

Who gives a **** about the socialist model?.. whether it was in the UK or China or wherever. We are currently talking about the enlightenment in the scandinavian welfare model. A mixture of both Capitalism and Socialism.
 
And having a huge tax base (per capita) allows the system to have enough money to fuel their socialist agenda. I would pay up to 55% in tax if I didn't have to pay my RA, hospital bills, had roads repaired, free education and efficient government. No worries.

So would I! I would pay 70% :D 75% if they include free fiber optic to my house.
 
the huge tax burdens of scandinavian contries have actually been shown to stifle growth in the long term. All these countries showed an increase in unemployment and a decrease in per capita wealth right up to our recent little financial "blip"
The countries to watch really were Ireland, Spain and Portugal which all showed some serious growth and a decrease in unemployment, Ireland especially. All of them decided to decrease the tax burden on individuals and start-up companies.
Don't get me wrong, standard of living for your average viking is way better than in SA, I just don't think socialism in any form is going to work better than a free market system
 
the huge tax burdens of scandinavian contries have actually been shown to stifle growth in the long term. All these countries showed an increase in unemployment and a decrease in per capita wealth right up to our recent little financial "blip"
The countries to watch really were Ireland, Spain and Portugal which all showed some serious growth and a decrease in unemployment, Ireland especially. All of them decided to decrease the tax burden on individuals and start-up companies.
Don't get me wrong, standard of living for your average viking is way better than in SA, I just don't think socialism in any form is going to work better than a free market system

Thats why they are just the happiest, healthiest most educated countries in the world ;) Its a hard life there hey. Theyre doing it all wrong. They must try be more american ;) One of the few countries in that area to adopt the "sell your mom for profits" form of Capitalism America has... Iceland... has now decided to adopt the welfare model like its neighbors. The people in Iceland recently suffered greatly for not creating the right support base and controlling their greed. I like the way France is heading with its welfare system as well.
 
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