Telkom may reduce ADSL price

Communications Minister Ivy Matsepe-Casaburri,
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I like the red highlit of her name in the atricle. Helps show that she is the devil.
 
If any of you are old enough to remember, ISDN was around 900 rand too once (just for line rental) But this was back in '97, when ISDN was already 17 years old and already out dated in the US....

I seriously doubt the price would significantly drop, but 50% less for ADSL 512k would be nice, especially with their 1mb ADSL coming soon.
 
If any of you are old enough to remember, ISDN was around 900 rand too once (just for line rental) But this was back in '97, when ISDN was already 17 years old and already out dated in the US....
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There was no MYADSL in those days! We speak with one loud voice now.
 
<Q>"The cap is not an issue for the end user - but it is for people making money out of ADSL," he said. Some users and businesses use an enormous amount of bandwidth to download vast amounts of data and for peer-to-peer file sharing, causing the service to slow considerably, which means that all users suffer, he said. </Q>

Bull !!!! Don't forget - you can just buy more. This argument has already been worn out and it's still a lie, no matter how many times ther repeat it.
 
Telkom is clutching at straws in my opinion.

It is not that I am opposed to a Cap. It is just that the Cap is restrictive at it's current level. The notion recently was posed by Telkom that ADSL is not even suitable for gaming? :confused:

Telkom Says,
“Telkom's ADSL service was never intended for bandwidth-hungry applications, such as gaming or online trading,” according to the submission. Source IT Web 13 April 2005.

I quote Marconi’s website dated the 25th of September 2002.

The ADSL deployment is a key phase in Telkom's preparations for its imminent initial public offering and the deregulation of the South African telecommunications market. Telkom is targeting residential, small and medium-sized enterprises and the small-office home-office market with new ADSL services, including high-speed Internet access with always-on connections on an incremental basis. ADSL will enable faster downloads, file-sharing across remote IT networks and the ability to access Internet-based broadband entertainment services, including games, video and music.

I cannot make comment about Online Trading, as this is not my field, but Telkom reckons ADSL is not suited for this either? :confused:
What about the Unshaped Service then?
 
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stoke said:
<Q>"The cap is not an issue for the end user - but it is for people making money out of ADSL," he said. Some users and businesses use an enormous amount of bandwidth to download vast amounts of data and for peer-to-peer file sharing, causing the service to slow considerably, which means that all users suffer, he said. </Q>
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There are end users who are involved in the OpenSource software community.

South African users simply can't afford to be part of eg the Linux kernel group unless they have a hefty corporate "sponsor"

The cap as such is not the problem, the size of it is.

A 30GB per month quota should be fine for now. But what about 2 years from now when MultiMedia streams really start to take of?
 
kaspaas said:
... A 30GB per month quota should be fine for now. But what about 2 years from now when MultiMedia streams really start to take of?
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There are any number of computing paradigms that are just not possible locally, due to the restrictions (e.g. distributed clusters, virtual grids, etc.) - true ubiquitous deployment is a pipedream, under the present circumstances. The tragedy is that this stifles innovation, so we'll never reach the point where we can ever be held in high regard globally - on this front, at least. Any kind of restriction, whilst perhaps commercially justified, is definitely not justified when it comes to both pure and applied research and innovation. IMHO, all restrictions of whatsoever kind should be removed for that purpose at least, and apply to all academic/public/private research centres. Regulate and license these institutions through ICASA if you want, but at least remove any usage/access constraints for this purpose...
 
Quote: "The price control regulation stipulates that overall, Telkom cannot increase the prices of its services by more than the inflation rate - less the productivity index, which should be determined in June, Celli said."

Uhhhh, newsflash Telkom. Icasa has determined the productivity index - it's 3,5%. Mr Celli, don't you remember? Icasa wanted to set it at 4%, remember Mr Celli? Telkom then cried like a baby and pleaded poverty, so Icasa revised it to 3,5%.

Basically, all that has to happen now is for the Minister to approve this. Oh wait, Mr Celli, I forgot. Telkom likes to lobby the Minister (remember the 2002 price cap debacle when you refused to comply with the Minister-approved Price Cap? And you ended up in court? And your Minister-lobbying basically got the Minister to refuse to stand by her previous approval of the Price Cap? Is this ringing any bells, Mr Celli?)

By saying that the productivity factor will only be determined in June, Mr Celli, you're saying that you intend to go cry to the Minister (yet again) about this new Price Cap. If I am not mistaken, Mr Celli, Telkom has called the 3,5% "unreasonably demanding".

Don't talk absolute bull**** and say that the productivity factor will only be determined in June. Mr Celli, it amazes me how you feign ignorance when it suits you.

(Just a bit of history here - the productivity factor of 1,5% has been in place since 1977, so yeah, with the new techs that have made things cheaper, its high bloody time the productivity factor was revised.)
 
DEBBIE2 - do you have any insight into who actually calculates this 'productivity index', and whether it's subject to some sort of audit/oversight review by an independent party? Isn't there a SA Productivity Institute, or something like that? Does ICASA have any offiicial (i.e. legislatory) say over whether this factor may be adjusted in any way?
 
kaspaas said:
There are end users who are involved in the OpenSource software community.

South African users simply can't afford to be part of eg the Linux kernel group unless they have a hefty corporate "sponsor"

The cap as such is not the problem, the size of it is.

A 30GB per month quota should be fine for now. But what about 2 years from now when MultiMedia streams really start to take of?
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when I left Germany in 2003 I had an average traffic of 120 to 150 GB... with a 2000/384 Flatrate for 29.95 Euros.
 
Whew mbs...thats quite a question, and has been the subject of a lot of adversarial exchanges between Telkom and Icasa.

To give you a basic summary:

The Telecoms Act of 1996 gave the minister the power to set the Price Cap for three years. The Price Cap formula is expressed as "CPI - X". CPI is the inflation rate, X is the productivity factor.

CPI makes Telkom's prices rise, X makes them go down.

CPI is obviously something that the economy's performance determines, and changes each year. So the minister (was jay naidoo at the time) set the price cap for three years at CPI - 1,5%. In 2000, the regulator (SATRA/ICASA) was to take over the setting of the price cap.

But what happened in 2000 is that ICASA didnt complete its work in time (i dont know why, could have been underfunding issues or political pressures), so Telkom was able to set 2001 prices based on the old formula of CPI - 1,5%.

In 2001, ICASA got their act into gear and created a new cap, which the minister approved, but telkom refused to abide by it. Long story. Landed up in court, and suffice it to say that Telkom just simply refused to abide by the law, and they won the day in an out of court settlement, and the old price cap was continued for yet ANOTHER year.

Things changed a bit in 2003, but I dont know the details of this.

Then, at the end of last year, Icasa started the process to revise the price cap again. This process has been through two round of public commenting, and at the moment Icasa is about to send their proposals to the minister for approval. The proposal is to set X at 3,5%.

The productivity factor (i.e. the value of X) is not subject to oversight by a third party. Icasa has the authority to determine the price cap, but this is subjetc to the ministers approval. The minister can veto icasa's proposals, but she cannot substitute Icasa's proposals for her own. Basically, the minister can keep rejecting Icasa's proposed price cap until Icasa submits one that she wants. So effectively, the minister still has the authority over the price cap's values.

The way in which Icasa arrived at their current proposed figure of 3,5% is very very very very very complicated. At first Icasa would not release info about this. The earlier this year, they decided to make the methodology public. This can be found at: http://www.icasa.org.za/Repository/resources/Telecoms/Note on Methodology 7 December 2004.doc

Further info on the Price Cap can be found at: http://www.hellkom.co.za/info/action.htm (I was trying to get ppl to submit comments to ICASA)

My submission to Icasa, which I sent in as a group submission, can be found at: http://www.geocities.com/vionectro/pricecap.doc

Just another note- in other countries in a similar stage of development, the productivity factor is usually set at about 5-10%.
 
Noble_Nanobot said:
...and will Poison Ivy commit herself this time?
...
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Now that's actually an excellent idea, the ICASA councillors should replace the last page with a volluntary request to be committed to a state mental institution for 90 days...:D
...
Rudolph Muller, the founder of MyADSL, said that although it will be great news if Telkom's ADSL prices dropped, they will need to be reduced by at least 70% to make ADSL affordable in South Africa. To make this possible, Telkom needs to drop its charges for line rental, which is not charged in connection with ADSL services overseas.
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Yep, I agree with RPM there, the ZAR amount of the price decrease has to be a minimum amount equal to the ADSL ripoff fee :(.

IMO the ripoff fee should entitle you to cancel TelkomonopolyDSL, go to your local exchange & walk out with 1 DSLAM for every month you have been paying Telkomonopoly for DSL512...:D j/k
 
noone said:
only 3 months away dude, its not like they said August 2009
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It may as well be at the pace Telkomonopoly is going with current ADSL installations [yes I know they like fired all their staff or something to make more money in the short term...]
 
BTTB said:
It is not that I am opposed to a Cap. It is just that the Cap is restrictive at it's current level. The notion recently was posed by Telkom that ADSL is not even suitable for gaming? :confused:

Telkom Says,
“Telkom's ADSL service was never intended for bandwidth-hungry applications, such as gaming or online trading,” according to the submission. Source IT Web 13 April 2005.

I cannot make comment about Online Trading, as this is not my field, but Telkom reckons ADSL is not suited for this either? :confused:
What about the Unshaped Service then?
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Well taken from telkomsa.net website on the unshaped service :
Unshaped

This service will offer you unshaped international bandwidth and a higher data transfer rate than the shaped service. The unshaped service will not shape the un-cached protocols. All protocols will therefore share the available bandwidth equally. Similar to the current service local bandwidth will remain as is with no shaping implemented. Keeping this in mind this service was typically designed for a niche market including for example your typical Forex Trader, who uses unfamiliar protocols, which are not bandwidth exhaustive.
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Unless they mean other forms of online trading, but there they specifically mention that it is NOT bandwidth exhaustive, and this product was made for such people yet, then at the hearing they say it wasn't made from this????

There used to be a "logo" on one of the ISP's website, I think it might of been TelkomSA, but i cant be sure, it was of a fireball with the words, "512 ADSL- SUPERFAST Gaming" Anyone else remember this or where it can be found?
 
Thanks Kalvaer,

Seems to me as if Telkom say a lot of things at present, but forget what has been said or as in the site you just linked it clearly mentions Forex Trading.

I was sure that I had read it somewhere that the Unshaped service is suitable for Online Trading.
I remember, it was at the launch of the Shaped service. Telkom mentioned Online Trading on their website. It was so that Online Traders could get sub 200 pings to the USA and Europe if I recollect properly.
Some gamers also went for this service and somewhere their is a thread about these pings for the Unshaped Service.

Doing a search. Cant find it yet.
Ok here was the thread. New Package from Telkom(No Port Shaping)
 
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