Terror attack outside U.K. Parliament

STS said:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uganda_Anti-Homosexuality_Act,_2014

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_violence_against_LGBT_people_in_the_United_States
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The fact that you actually had to search for that and only came up with handful of examples pretty much reinforces my point. "Jesus Christ!" isn't usually, if ever, followed by a BOOM.

Additionally homosexuality is treated the same in most Middle Eastern (read: Muslim) countries as Uganda, so not sure what you were referring to.

With regards to the LGBT hate crimes (not really relevant to this thread, but I'll bite): again, only a handful really stood out as "inspired" by Christianity. In Syria you don't get kicked in the head if you're gay: you get thrown off a building while it's being recorded.

Radical Christianity (is that even a thing?) is not intent on wiping out our way of life. Radical Islam most definitely is. I doubt anyone here could even dispute that.
 
nabeeltootla said:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...nding-khalid-masood-isis-terror-a7647196.html

Nice to see Muslims there acting the way Muslims should, rather than homicidal maniacs like that terrorist did.
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If some of the more short sighted people had their way all these moderate peace loving Muslims would be shipped off to countries under the control of extremists where they can be absorbed into into the ranks of their militancy. All moderate Muslims trying to escape the control of these extremists will be turned away and sent back to be absorbed into the ranks of extremism or to die. Somehow these people in the West think that forcing millions of Muslims to live in places of extremism thus increasing the might of the extremists will somehow make them safer. It boggles the mind. If you have a choice to integrate moderate Muslims into Western society to be allies in the fight against extremism or to make them your enemy and send them off to fight against West, what do you choose?

This quote seems apt:
The jihadis shoot their propaganda across the internet in search of the Western world’s frightened and dispossessed. On Twitter and Facebook, from YouTube to Google Play, the Islamic State militant group (ISIS) traffics in lies, bombarding Western Muslims seeking adventure, compatriots or an outlet for their religious fervor.

The message is stark, terrifying: Your countries hate you. They despise your beliefs. They seek to destroy your faith and convert you to theirs. Your safety, your obligation to true Muslims, is to join the camp of Islam, the caliphate, and take up arms against the infidels.
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And some westerners happily help them along by actually hating Muslims and despising their beliefs - where can these Muslims turn to for safety? Into the arms of the jihadis of course. smh
 
C4Cat said:
If some of the more short sighted people had their way all these moderate peace loving Muslims would be shipped off to countries under the control of extremists where they can be absorbed into into the ranks of their militancy. All moderate Muslims trying to escape the control of these extremists will be turned away and sent back to be absorbed into the ranks of extremism or to die. Somehow these people in the West think that forcing millions of Muslims to live in places of extremism thus increasing the might of the extremists will somehow make them safer. It boggles the mind. If you have a choice to integrate moderate Muslims into Western society to be allies in the fight against extremism or to make them your enemy and send them off to fight against West, what do you choose?

This quote seems apt:

And some westerners happily help them along by actually hating Muslims and despising their beliefs - where can these Muslims turn to for safety? Into the arms of the jihadis of course. smh
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Well said
 
C4Cat said:
If some of the more short sighted people had their way all these moderate peace loving Muslims would be shipped off to countries under the control of extremists where they can be absorbed into into the ranks of their militancy. All moderate Muslims trying to escape the control of these extremists will be turned away and sent back to be absorbed into the ranks of extremism or to die. Somehow these people in the West think that forcing millions of Muslims to live in places of extremism thus increasing the might of the extremists will somehow make them safer. It boggles the mind. If you have a choice to integrate moderate Muslims into Western society to be allies in the fight against extremism or to make them your enemy and send them off to fight against West, what do you choose?

This quote seems apt:

And some westerners happily help them along by actually hating Muslims and despising their beliefs - where can these Muslims turn to for safety? Into the arms of the jihadis of course. smh
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The whole "all Muslims are bad" rhetoric that comes from the frothing mouths of the likes of Stochos and marine1 etc. is exactly what helps feed the terrorists (not jihadis, since the true meaning of jihad is not what it's used for nowadays).
All it does is alienate the Muslims who practice Islam and don't seek to hurt innocent people, and make them feel less belonging to regular society. That's never an excuse to turn to the terrorists for a better sense of belonging, but it certainly helps do that. Especially since it makes the recruitment tactic of "kill the westerners because they hate you and will never let you practice your religion in peace" more effective.

Heck the same people actually go as far as to try and convince normal Muslims that their peaceful attitude is not how real Muslims should behave and that the religion they follow actually demands them to become violent. If anything, they are probably a bigger driving force for Muslims who commit terrorism that the recruiters who simply have to sit back and let the bigots do their work for them.

It is the responsibility of a Muslim to know his religion well enough to be able to laugh at the ridiculousness of these assertions, however many aren't educated enough (it is a real problem that some 'scholars' actually preach hatred and are most certainly wrong in doing so) or are too emotionally vulnerable to be able to withstand the constant barrage of misinformation. I sincerely hope that both the bigots and the terrorists lose this battle their fighting, for the sake of innocent people on all sides.
 
nabeeltootla said:
The whole "all Muslims are bad" rhetoric that comes from the frothing mouths of the likes of Stochos and marine1 etc. is exactly what helps feed the terrorists (not jihadis, since the true meaning of jihad is not what it's used for nowadays).
All it does is alienate the Muslims who practice Islam and don't seek to hurt innocent people, and make them feel less belonging to regular society. That's never an excuse to turn to the terrorists for a better sense of belonging, but it certainly helps do that. Especially since it makes the recruitment tactic of "kill the westerners because they hate you and will never let you practice your religion in peace" more effective.

Heck the same people actually go as far as to try and convince normal Muslims that their peaceful attitude is not how real Muslims should behave and that the religion they follow actually demands them to become violent. If anything, they are probably a bigger driving force for Muslims who commit terrorism that the recruiters who simply have to sit back and let the bigots do their work for them.

It is the responsibility of a Muslim to know his religion well enough to be able to laugh at the ridiculousness of these assertions, however many aren't educated enough (it is a real problem that some 'scholars' actually preach hatred and are most certainly wrong in doing so) or are too emotionally vulnerable to be able to withstand the constant barrage of misinformation. I sincerely hope that both the bigots and the terrorists lose this battle their fighting, for the sake of innocent people on all sides.
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if people want war they must get war

it seems to me most people don't fully appreciate the consequences of war, perhaps they should experience it
 
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saturnz said:
if people want war they must get war

it seems to me most people don't fully appreciate the consequences of war, perhaps they should experience it
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Disagree. Just because people are ignorant, and spout hate because of their ignorance, does not make it a reason for any sort of violence let alone a war.

A war is no small thing, and there are always suffering of innocents.
If people want war, they need therapy.
 
I'm beginning to think that terrorist attacks perpetrated by Muslims has a religiously motivated "coolness" effect.

A nutjob muslim sees an act of terror and says how cool is that. I want to try it. Perfect example is the Munich shooter.
This animal was inspired by the French trucker who mowed down a whole​ bunch of civilians.

The sad thing is the support. Muslims crying allahakbar and among those is the next lunatic who feels it's a good idea to drive over tourists.
 
C4Cat said:
If you have a choice to integrate moderate Muslims into Western society to be allies in the fight against extremism or to make them your enemy and send them off to fight against West, what do you choose?
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Muslims battle to integrate. That is the problem, their belief system fundamentally sets religious law higher than secular laws.

The fundamental reason is why do they leave their countries? You take Turkey for example, they haven't been bombed to smithereens by the west, yet they have immigrants all over Europe? Why is that? Could it be that the values they take with them when they go abroad are the very values that created the society where they flee from? If that is so, then why do they insist on keeping the values that they grew up with. If you moved to a gun-friendly state in the US because of its low crime levels, would you start criticising the gun laws, even those things might be the reason why you moved there in the first place.

I don't particularly see the Muslims coming to the west in this wave of immigration as being particularly receptive to concepts such as free speech. You only have to see the slew of Islamic Blasphemy laws disguised as hate speech that are being passed in so-called liberal countries like Canada.


And some westerners happily help them along by actually hating Muslims and despising their beliefs - where can these Muslims turn to for safety? Into the arms of the jihadis of course. smh
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I do love your logic. "The Muslims we apparently want in our society, must be taken in by us otherwise they will become terrorists and start killing people." For people who you are trying to defend, that is a horrid thing to say.
 
konfab said:
Muslims battle to integrate. That is the problem, their belief system fundamentally sets religious law higher than secular laws.

The fundamental reason is why do they leave their countries? You take Turkey for example, they haven't been bombed to smithereens by the west, yet they have immigrants all over Europe? Why is that? Could it be that the values they take with them when they go abroad are the very values that created the society where they flee from? If that is so, then why do they insist on keeping the values that they grew up with. If you moved to a gun-friendly state in the US because of its low crime levels, would you start criticising the gun laws, even those things might be the reason why you moved there in the first place.

I don't particularly see the Muslims coming to the west in this wave of immigration as being particularly receptive to concepts such as free speech. You only have to see the slew of Islamic Blasphemy laws disguised as hate speech that are being passed in so-called liberal countries like Canada.



I do love your logic. "The Muslims we apparently want in our society, must be taken in by us otherwise they will become terrorists and start killing people." For people who you are trying to defend, that is a horrid thing to say.
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The vast majority of Muslims are not migrants, they are 2nd/3rd generation with integrated parents (who often are absolutely not religious).

They left their countries in the 1950/70s when Europe was in dire need of cheap labor (be it turkish in Germany, Moroccan/Tunisian/Algerian in France...).

The vast majority of terrorists is the same.

There are no value issues with the parents who migrated but much more with the kids (who have only been to their original country on holiday most of the time).
 
Patrick_Hockstetter said:
The perpetrator was born in the UK and lived there 52 years. He was one of the integrated ones.

Let that sink in.
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Yes, that's the point.
Please read this: http://europe.newsweek.com/donald-trump-fueling-isis-560999 and this https://www.brookings.edu/blog/mark...rism-and-why-trump-might-benefit-as-a-result/

Trump is also sending a message to Muslims at home and around the world—America does not like you. This vitriol makes it easier for the Islamic State and other groups to recruit. For decades jihadists have argued that the United States is engaged in a war against Islam, and Presidents George W. Bush and Barack Obama tried hard to make it clear that U.S. wrath was focused on a small group of terrorists, not Muslims in general. Trump’s actions and rhetoric add credibility to the jihadists’ narrative of civilizational war.
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Patrick_Hockstetter said:
The perpetrator was born in the UK and lived there 52 years. He was one of the integrated ones.

Let that sink in.
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previous offences - Criminal damage,knife possession,assaults, grievous bodily harm, public order offences

Except for ISIS "claiming" responsibility (which they happy to do even if the perpetrator has nothing to do with them, ) this guy just seems like a run of the mill agro Criminal who went extra nuts - and plowed through people.
If he wasn't muslim this wouldn't be anything else then a senseless crime.
 
The Voice said:
The fact that you actually had to search for that and only came up with handful of examples pretty much reinforces my point. "Jesus Christ!" isn't usually, if ever, followed by a BOOM.

Additionally homosexuality is treated the same in most Middle Eastern (read: Muslim) countries as Uganda, so not sure what you were referring to.

With regards to the LGBT hate crimes (not really relevant to this thread, but I'll bite): again, only a handful really stood out as "inspired" by Christianity. In Syria you don't get kicked in the head if you're gay: you get thrown off a building while it's being recorded.

Radical Christianity (is that even a thing?) is not intent on wiping out our way of life. Radical Islam most definitely is. I doubt anyone here could even dispute that.
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I only picked a few because i actually couldn't be ****ed to deal with people like you, if you had an open mind and a better agenda you could open up google and look for this stuff yourself, just gave you two links to mull over because I had a job and life to get back to. Couldn't care if you change your mind, read the links or stay the way you are for the rest of your life
 
C4Cat said:
Yes, that's the point.
Please read this: http://europe.newsweek.com/donald-trump-fueling-isis-560999 and this https://www.brookings.edu/blog/mark...rism-and-why-trump-might-benefit-as-a-result/
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Why do you care what Jihadists think? Your "moderate" Muslims are not meant to be part of them anyway? If they are willing to listen to what those people have to say then they are not particularly moderate and thus would be a security risk.

The other thing is that people automatically assume that going into another country is a right. It is not. It is a privilege. If the US wants to shut down its borders for whatever reason, it is B.S that citizens in other countries should get offended. If Namibia decided tomorrow that they no longer wanted South Africans because they like eating Spur in peace, what right would South Africans have to visit their country?


The problem with Bush and Obama is they said one thing, yet acted in a completely different manner. "This isn't a war against Islam, it is merely a conflict against terrorists, so we should bomb other countries.
Trump is simply a bit more honest about it, recognising it as a war between culture and ideals. Even you will even have people who apparently support these ideals by screeching "Je suis Charlie". If you say you support freedom of speech and freedom of the press, you are supporting ideas that are antithetical to central beliefs in Islam. The very worrying thing is that so called liberals don't see this.
 
isie said:
previous offences - Criminal damage,knife possession,assaults, grievous bodily harm, public order offences

Except for ISIS "claiming" responsibility (which they happy to do even if the perpetrator has nothing to do with them, ) this guy just seems like a run of the mill agro Criminal who went extra nuts - and plowed through people.
If he wasn't muslim this wouldn't be anything else then a senseless crime.
Click to expand...

C0i_D7VVQAA6h3r.jpg
 
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