The Brexit Thread

[Spizz]

Says the guy who admits he is institutionally anti Tory , was or is a current SNP member and gets on every anti-Tory bandwagon. No self-reflection whatsoever.

Nazi website? Lol. As usual your ignorance is staggering. Stick to building stuff in random parts of the world, that is clearly where your expertise lies.

Oh, I'm multi skilled, I've got no problem building stuff and hating the Tories. But I'm not sure why I'd need self reflection on that, Tories are easy to hate.

 

[Vox Populi Vox Dei]

Depends on the the fire size, and the exit paths available. Depends on a lot of factors, actually. Which the fire department was aware of.

He was being a total dick. And you're defending him. Makes sense.

Um, the report has criticised the LFB for the "stay put" command - as it was the wrong command. Presumably, the official government looked at all the factors you mention and it didn't check out.

No, he's not being a total dick about it. Just because the people there were poor (and of course some were illegally there as it turned out...no surprises) does not prevent someone from criticizing them. Sure as hell I would get out any building on fire regardless of what some clown told me to do. It's an emergency!

It's impossible for you to divorce this outrage from the election. Because that's all you seem care about. Other people have bigger concerns.

The aspirant working class has been conned. The Tories have totally ****ed up the NHS on their own. Now they want to "fix" it?

The middle class is not posh, they are better informed. It's your heroes like Mogg and Boris that are posh.

Oh please, you know very well know that everything right now is about the election so trying to divorce it from that won't do it for me. When Labour orientated Twitter accounts, including Labour MPs, are pushing this hard then your statement that this isn't related to election is for the birds.

Have you seen the type of path many people in the arts industry have trodden, especially those from the BBC? The well-known private (public in the UK) school then off to Oxford/Cambridge. Their lives are as privileged as Rees-Mogg's yet they have the temerity to crticise his privileged upbringing. Just because you vote Labour doesn't inherently make you a good person despite what these virtue-signalling twats think. It's actually funny, I was roaming around Camden the other day (Keir Starmer's constituency) and all the properties I saw advertised in the estate agent's window were worth multi-million pounds. That's where the phrase "North London Liberal Elite" comes from... very easy to be pro-EU when your job isn't really threatened by freedom of movement (very hard to break into the arts industry, only foreigners I encountered were as usual in the low-paid services shop like Pret, Caffe Nero etc. A few weirdos with nose jobs and brightly coloured hair as well thrown in) and you care about is the ease of booking your next ski trip to Val-d'Isère.

 

[Spizz]

Self reflection. Chris, really? Do you even know what that means?

All you have to do is read the first paragraph, and you know this guy is full of schit. Did he do some sort of quantitive analysis on anger levels, or is he just decided that.

Of course it was Johnson who decimated the London fire Service in 2013, closing 10 stations and ditching 29 fire engines (obviously after he'd promised not to, gosh he lied again) and told a questioner to "get stuffed" when challenged on his insistence he was actually making things safer.

How did that turn out Boris?

 

[ToxicBunny]

Of course it was Johnson who decimated the London fire Service in 2013, closing 10 stations and ditching 29 fire engines (obviously after he'd promised not to, gosh he lied again) and told a questioner to "get stuffed" when challenged on his insistence he was actually making things safer.

How did that turn out Boris?

Even better then, by basic logic and such, Boris is responsible for every death in that fire.

 

[The Voice]

Don't agree with his delivery or the fact that he even brought it up (4Head) - he's a total twat - but being a London resident I can vouch for the fact that it's completely obsessed with fire regulations - it burnt down twice, after all. Which makes the Grenfell disaster even more depressing.

First rule that gets drilled into your head during fire safety is GTFO. Don't try gather your belongings, don't be a hero, just leave immediately. The fact that the LFB actually told people to stay in the building still defies comprehension.

 

[Spizz]

Um, the report has criticised the LFB for the "stay put" command - as it was the wrong command. Presumably, the official government looked at all the factors you mention and it didn't check out.

No, he's not being a total dick about it. Just because the people there were poor (and of course some were illegally there as it turned out...no surprises) does not prevent someone from criticizing them. Sure as hell I would get out any building on fire regardless of what some clown told me to do. It's an emergency!

I'd imagine most people would do what the authorities told them. Building like this are often built to contain fires, that's what heavy fire doors are for, and my first thought about leaving your apartment would be you might be in danger of being overcome by smoke in the corridors. That's what kills people, not being burnt.

He's being a total dick, and I bet you if it was Corbyn who'd said it, you'd have the exact opposite view.

 

[Spizz]

Even better then, by basic logic and such, Boris is responsible for every death in that fire.

There was no proper consultation and he was warned repeatedly that his cuts to stations, engines and personnel would lead to staff being stretched and ultimately disaster.

 

[ToxicBunny]

There was no proper consultation and he was warned repeatedly that his cuts to stations, engines and personnel would lead to staff being stretched and ultimately disaster.

Its pretty standard Boris stuff really from what I know...

 

[Spizz]

Its pretty standard Boris stuff really from what I know...

Yep. He promised he wouldn’t do it.

 

[ToxicBunny]

Yep. He promised he wouldn’t do it.

Its like the ANC, if Boris promises he won't do something, you KNOW he will do it exactly in the fashion he has promised he won't

 

[buka001]

Don't agree with his delivery or the fact that he even brought it up (4Head) - he's a total twat - but being a London resident I can vouch for the fact that it's completely obsessed with fire regulations - it burnt down twice, after all. Which makes the Grenfell disaster even more depressing.

First rule that gets drilled into your head during fire safety is GTFO. Don't try gather your belongings, don't be a hero, just leave immediately. The fact that the LFB actually told people to stay in the building still defies comprehension.

Hindsight.

If the cladding had performed the way it was supposed to the fire would not have spread like it did.

The fireman operated with the information it had and for this building the stay put command was the protocol and is standard policy for all high rise buildings, as each flat should be insulated from each other.

It was an unprecedented event and no one expected the fire to propagate up on the outside of the building.

There are specific reasons for this, mostly to allow easier access for fireman heading up to the affected areas, so they don't get caught up in the traffic and you don't want people running from a safe area to a dangerous area.

 

[Hamish McPanji]

Hindsight.

If the cladding had performed the way it was supposed to the fire would not have spread like it did.

The fireman operated with the information it had and for this building the stay put command was the protocol and is standard policy for all high rise buildings, as each flat should be insulated from each other.

It was an unprecedented event and no one expected the fire to propagate up on the outside of the building.

There are specific reasons for this, mostly to allow easier access for fireman heading up to the affected areas, so they don't get caught up in the traffic and you don't want people running from a safe area to a dangerous area.

Anyway the idiot residents listened to instructions, and were harbouring illegal aliens so it should have been torched anyway

 

[Dave]

Anyway the idiot residents listened to instructions, and were harbouring illegal aliens so it should have been torched anyway

The "truth" according to Chris...

 

[rietrot]

I'd imagine most people would do what the authorities told them. Building like this are often built to contain fires, that's what heavy fire doors are for, and my first thought about leaving your apartment would be you might be in danger of being overcome by smoke in the corridors. That's what kills people, not being burnt.

He's being a total dick, and I bet you if it was Corbyn who'd said it, you'd have the exact opposite view.

If the authorities tell you to stay put and wait for the sprinklers to extinguish the fire and you know the building is in a bad condition and the sprinklers probably don't even work will you still listen?

 

[Spizz]

If the authorities tell you to stay put and wait for the sprinklers to extinguish the fire and you know the building is in a bad condition and the sprinklers probably don't even work will you still listen?

Hindsight is truly a wonderful thing. But I imagine I’d listen to the advice of the fire brigade even if the first inclination is to bail. They are the ones that you have to trust.

Imagine if you left and you died of smoke inhalation. Rees-Mogg would be criticising you just the same for not listening.

 

[Hamish McPanji]

Hindsight is truly a wonderful thing. But I imagine I’d listen to the advice of the fire brigade even if the first inclination is to bail. They are the ones that you have to trust.

Imagine if you left and you died of smoke inhalation. Rees-Mogg would be criticising you just the same for not listening.

Smoke kills more than the fire itself in most cases.

Smoke inhalation - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

The killing fumes — smoke is more deadly than fire | Fireco

Fire and smoke are a deadly duo. However, smoke has more tricks up its sleeve. Most fire deaths are not caused by burns from flames, but by inhaling smoke.

fireco.uk

Toxic smoke inhalation kills more people than fire

Toxic smoke inhalation causes more fire-related deaths than do the fires themselves.

www.rockwoolgroup.com

(PDF) What Kills People in a Fire? Heat or Smoke?

PDF | This paper reviews the main causes of casualties in fires, investigates the composition of the smoke in typical compartment fire and assesses the... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate

www.researchgate.net

It is known. By some, that is.

Others will manage to get down15 floors of stairs, sliding on their own BS however. We are not referring to those particular heroes

 

[Dave]

Oops, looks like the Conservatives might not be in that comfortable a position.

Boris Johnson’s Conservatives are only eight points ahead of Labour, according to a poll for The Sunday Telegraph.

The ORB International survey for the newspaper puts the Tories on 36 per cent, with 28 for Labour, 14 per cent for the Liberal Democrats and 12 per cent for Nigel Farage’s Brexit Party.

Undertaken on Wednesday and Thursday, the new poll is likely to spark concern within the Conservative campaign.

Experts warned that Mr Johnson will need to significantly increase his lead to be sure of securing a majority.

Tory general election majority in doubt as Telegraph poll shows lead of just eight points

Boris Johnson’s Conservatives are only eight points ahead of Labour, according to a poll for The Sunday Telegraph.

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[Dave]

And another Tory scandal hits the headlines.

A UK cabinet minister has quit after claims he knew about a former aide's role in the "sabotage" of a rape trial.

Welsh Secretary Alun Cairns denied knowing Tory assembly candidate Ross England made claims about the victim's sexual history in the April 2018 trial.

But BBC Wales discovered Mr Cairns was emailed about it in August 2018 - four months before Mr England was chosen as Vale of Glamorgan candidate.

Mr Cairns had been a cabinet member since being appointed in 2016.

The Conservative Vale of Glamorgan MP said he only became aware of Mr England's role in the trial's collapse when the story broke last week.

In a letter to Prime Minister Boris Johnson, Mr Cairns - who was MP for Vale of Glamorgan - said: "You will be aware of allegations relating to the actions of a party employee and candidate for the Welsh assembly elections in the Vale of Glamorgan.

"This is a very sensitive matter, and in light of continued speculation, I write to tender my resignation as secretary of state for Wales.

"I will co-operate in full with the investigation under the Ministerial Code which will now take place and I am confident I will be cleared of any breach or wrong doing."

Alun Cairns resigns in Ross England rape trial 'sabotage' row

Welsh Secretary Alun Cairns quits over claims he knew about a former aide “sabotaging” a rape trial.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[ToxicBunny]

Polls don't matter @Dave . You should know this by now.

 

[noxibox]

Ah, the usual Leftie faux outrage machine in motion against someone they just love to target. Of course close examination of what he actually said was perfectly sensible. He was following on from the report. Sorry if common sense is in short supply these days amongst the Left.

Jacob Rees-Mogg is right about Grenfell

You do realise I presume that Spiked are lefties too.