The "Is Windows 8 a Flop?" Thread

Touch has its place. If your ultrabook has a detachable screen that you can hold like a tablet.
Or Lenovo's new Touch Mobile Monitors.
There is actually a market for a 7 inch touchscreen remote for a htpc. Thin form factor, with a epaper display under a resistive screen. (Epaper for the battery life)

Rightly or wrongly, some big industry players dont seem to think so, check out Intel's CES 2013 press conference ... http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/28313772 (middle section). They're going absolutely gaga about touch, making it mandatory in their next Ultrabook spec.
 
Rightly or wrongly, some big industry players dont seem to think so, check out Intel's CES 2013 press conference ... http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/28313772 (middle section). They're going absolutely gaga about touch, making it mandatory in their next Ultrabook spec.

CES and OEM's will sell you their mothers if they could.

It has nothing to do about what you actually need or what works, more like how can they get you to buy anything. The last thing they would want is for your current set-up to just work. If you only bought PC"s to replace old/broken ones half of them would go belly up.
 
CES and OEM's will sell you their mothers if they could.

It has nothing to do about what you actually need or what works, more like how can they get you to buy anything. The last thing they would want is for your current set-up to just work. If you only bought PC"s to replace old/broken ones half of them would go belly up.

Yep. They have to sell you something new all the time. They will make a turd sound like the "must-have next best thing" if that is all they have to add to the existing specs. That is why Apple never gives all they can give you with a new device ... the hold things back (always something in reserve). As Jobs said: vertical touch screens don't work. My own experience confirmed it to me. Touch is great for horizontal use. Vertical only works well when you stand (kiosk type application).
 
So took the plunge yesterday and did a fresh install of Windows 8 System Builder.

Install process was super easy and fast compared to past versions.

Metro is indeed very very annoying and not what you're used to, with no tour or guide of where to find basic things, like how to restart or find the control panel.

The next thing I did was install Classic Shell which is free. This gives you a good start menu and will also automatically skip Metro at startup and take you straight to desktop. The next step was to go to Default Programs in Control Panel and move all file type associations away from the Metro apps and to the desktop programs e.g. all videos to VLC, images to MS Image Viewer etc.

Those were the only two steps it took to get back to using Windows 8 in the EXACT same way I used Windows 7. So not a huge trainsmash at all and most forum members being semi-intelligent can easily do this.

However EPIC EPIC fail from Microsoft for being such a bully when it comes to Metro and not giving me the option of how I want to primarily interact with my OS. So completely unnecessary and pointless because people with circumvent them anyway as I have done.

Regarding Metro I can see the benefit over time because apps can be so very very good at doing a small, specific task just like on a smartphone and it could be very useful and convenient to have that functionality on your pc. I never could have had this in previous Windows editions. E.g. the Bing Weather app is quite amazing and beautiful and convenient. Same with the finance app ect.

With regards to look and feel, well I've never liked any standard Windows theme and have always tinkered and customized. Nothing has changed.

So after reading this entire thread I would say that both sides of the arguement have equal merit. On one hand they have introduced some very very poor design choices but on the other these are uber easy to circumvent (even though you shouldn't have to of course). Overall I'm pretty happy with it and am enjoying the fresh new experience.

P.S. This is so utterly terrible for enterprise that MS have totes fscked themselves :twisted:
 
Windows 8 isnt a total failure in my opinion. The addition of hyper-v (the exact onw from server 2012) makes it attractive to devs and IT admins a like (those that use virtual machines)

ive been using it since the Beta was first out and just gotten use to it. yeah sure its not what we are use to but things are always going to move forward.

Im sure Microsoft have a reason for not making a seperate desktop and touch screen version. I think its got to do with training: if a company has to train its employees to work on a tablet running a touch screen version of windows 8 as well as a normal desktop version then it could cost the company a fair amount. where as training the employees to use windows 8 (which is the same on tablet and desktop) then the costs are reduced a fair amount. not that many companies use tablets and pcs but hay!
 
A good example would the blackboard at school. How much text did the teacher actually write, but it was punishment to write out lines on the blackboard -- Bart Simpson.
It was also punishment to write out lines on paper. It's the repetition and tedium that was the punishment.

It's moot though really since the Windows 8 interface works perfectly with a combination of keyboard, mouse and, if you have it, touch. There's really no need to do everything with only one.

What is needed though is laptops with good pen support. Now that's a really handy additional feature to add to the other three.
 
It was also punishment to write out lines on paper. It's the repetition and tedium that was the punishment.

Yeah, but the blackboard had an extra bit of evil to add to that, the fatigue associated pain generated in your shoulder and arm muscles. I don't know about you but I recall teachers and lecturers using blackboards very sparingly, most writing occurred on overhead projectors.
 
I just had the honor of remote desktop into a Windows 8 PC.

My word the horror - to painful for words, and I thought using it on a Dekstop PC was bad, wait till you have to do remote support it with hotspots on corners that keeps on telling you "up yours" if you move to fast. Clearly someone, somewhere was not thinking properly.

Look the idea/Modern UI works on a touch device like a tablet, so much so we even developed mobi.jobcard for it targeting mostly tablet users, but the OS really does not work so well on Desktop PC's.
 
'Not even Santa could save Microsoft's Windows 8'

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/01/08/open_and_shut/

Didn't buyers know it was Christmas time at all?

Open ... and Shut Once upon a time any problem at Microsoft could be magically resolved with a new Windows release. Since Windows Vista, however, that formula hasn't worked. In fact, according to new sales data from NPD Group, it may be getting worse.

In late 2012, departing Microsoft board member Reed Hastings called Microsoft's Surface tablet "a tactic to spur people on, to get Windows 8 really successful." I derided that strategy, but it looks like I may not have gone far enough.

It's not just that the Surface isn't spurring Windows 8 sales. It's that nothing is. Not even Santa Claus, as NPD Group's holiday report reveals:

Despite the hype, and hope, around the launch of Windows 8, the new operating system did little to boost holiday sales or improve the year-long Windows notebook sales decline. Windows notebook holiday unit sales dropped 11 percent, on par with Black Friday, and similar to the yearly trend, but revenue trends weakened since Black Friday to end the holiday period down 10.5 percent. ASPs rose only $2 to $420. Touchscreen notebooks were 4.5 percent of Windows 8 sales with ASPs around $700. Sales of Windows notebooks under $500 fell by 16 percent while notebooks priced above $500 increased 4 percent. Macbook sales dropped 6 percent while the ASPs rose almost $100 to $1419.

There are a few ways to look at this data. One is to suggest that Windows no longer drives hardware sales. That seems to be a given. Mobile is the category with serious volume, and Windows is still a non-factor in mobile.

Long-time Windows watcher Paul Thurrott, however, sees a different picture in NPD's data. Thurrott argues that Microsoft looked to the lowly netbook to prop up its sagging Windows franchise, back with Windows 7, and is paying the price now:

It’s not pat to say that the Windows PC market went for volume over quality, because it did: Many of those 20 million Windows 7 licenses each month—too many, I think—went to machines that are basically throwaway, plastic crap. Netbooks didn’t just rejuvenate the market just as Windows 7 appeared, they also destroyed it from within: Now consumers expect to pay next to nothing for a Windows PC. Most of them simply refuse to pay for more expensive Windows PCs.

So, not only did Microsoft look to a market savior without the potency to drive real revenue, it also bet on a dying market. The iPad and the rising tablet market have rendered the netbook obsolete, as Kevin Tofel has argued. Microsoft, now planning to end discounts on Windows 8, is unlikely to find a full-freight price tag to be workable in a market that is struggling to care about Windows machines.

What to do?

Hard to say. Microsoft remains strong in enterprise IT and gaming, but it desperately needs to a mobile future, as mobile looks set to eviscerate its Windows and Office monopolies. It also needs to think very differently about Windows, which is why I think the appointment of Craig Mundie to Microsoft CEO Steve Ballmer's inner circle reflects a step backward.

No, I'm not talking about Mundie's history of antipathy to open source. Some of his accusations were correct. But it is Mundie who thinks tablets are something of a fad, among other things. Microsoft has tremendous turf to protect in its Windows franchise, yes. But no, it has no hope of owning the future if it remains so rigidly attached to existing businesses.

I would have hoped to see Microsoft broadly license Office to run on different platforms, including iOS and Android tablets and, why not? Linux desktops, all as a way to milk that monopoly. I'd like to see Microsoft open up development of Windows in important ways as a way to revive interest in the venerable platform.

But the reality is that I can't see much of a future for Windows outside core enterprise infrastructure. Granted, this is a huge market, and things like Azure have a great deal of upside. But I can't see Microsoft giving up on being a visible, omnipresence on the client devices we use at work and play.

Unfortunately for Microsoft, given the sales data for the last few Windows releases, it seems the world is happy to give up on it. ®

Slightly different take on the subject.
 
I've been a Linux user since 2004. I played around with it since the 90's, but completely ditched Windows back in 2004. Linux has been my dedicated OS on my home PC's...I only used Windows at work as I had no choice. I thought I would give Windows 8 a shot - just to see what the hype is all about. I dont know what you guys complaining about. The OS is smooth, fast, stable, works well (ok, Metro is iffy, but you dont have to use it). So, without Metro, you basically have a version of Windows 7 on super-speed....I think the speed upgrade is worth the $39....Its like it just breathed life into my almost 2 year old Sandby Bridge system.

PS : I noticed a lot of stuff "borrowed" from the Linux world..... from unity and cinnamon specifically
 
I've been a Linux user since 2004. I played around with it since the 90's, but completely ditched Windows back in 2004. Linux has been my dedicated OS on my home PC's...I only used Windows at work as I had no choice. I thought I would give Windows 8 a shot - just to see what the hype is all about. I dont know what you guys complaining about. The OS is smooth, fast, stable, works well (ok, Metro is iffy, but you dont have to use it). So, without Metro, you basically have a version of Windows 7 on super-speed....I think the speed upgrade is worth the $39....Its like it just breathed life into my almost 2 year old Sandby Bridge system.

PS : I noticed a lot of stuff "borrowed" from the Linux world..... from unity and cinnamon specifically

But they don't seem to like it, and it appears the poor sales figures are their bible, so just deal with it :p

I think the biggest reason Windows 8 just isn't selling, above all other reasons out there, is that there is just simply no need for it.

I have no issues with Windows 8 myself, its darn easy to use as far as I'm concerned, but anyone out there sitting with Windows 7 just has no reason whatsoever to go with Windows 8. And with many people seeming to dislike the new layout and start menu there is even less reason.

So in that sense I won't say Windows 8 is an outright flop. It is a perfectly capable OS in its own right and would sit well on a brand new PC, permitting the consent of the user of course as people generally don't like change. It just has no place in the market that makes it any better than Windows 7.

Which then makes Windows 8 the perfect candidate for tablets only. This is their strategy but they sadly have no hardware good enough to support this vision. If MS nails this part right they may finally have something going for them.

I would take this thought further and emphasize the importance superior, stand-out hardware and functionality will have in the coming years, and less so for the OS and software front.
 
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I've been a Linux user since 2004. I played around with it since the 90's, but completely ditched Windows back in 2004. Linux has been my dedicated OS on my home PC's...I only used Windows at work as I had no choice. I thought I would give Windows 8 a shot - just to see what the hype is all about. I dont know what you guys complaining about. The OS is smooth, fast, stable, works well (ok, Metro is iffy, but you dont have to use it). So, without Metro, you basically have a version of Windows 7 on super-speed....I think the speed upgrade is worth the $39....Its like it just breathed life into my almost 2 year old Sandby Bridge system.

PS : I noticed a lot of stuff "borrowed" from the Linux world..... from unity and cinnamon specifically

You are basically using Windows 7 Basic, if you ditch Metro. ;-)
 
Ditching Metro?

You are basically using Windows 7 Basic, if you ditch Metro. ;-)

Ditching Metro? I'd love to do this.

Only it is't Windows 7. Windows 7 had back support for applications that were design for older systems. Such as MS Active Sync, to sync my collection of PDAs-turned-touchpads/remote-controls. Windows 8 doesn't. No more sync for me.



Windows 8: Like DOS, only worse.
 
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