Unlimited bandwidth idea

loosecannon

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Joined
Jul 27, 2004
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731
there are frame relay type connections on some intelsat satalites but mostly in C band not KU band the frame relay type connections are brilliant [used it for a number of years] but not suited for home use/dynamic IP ...

you get the SP in the states to broadcast your IP via his BGP session to his peers and route it down the satalite ...

this is a beautifully simplistic solution and results in most your internaitional downloads coming in via satalite as your SP will be a shorter path to most international sites ... almost all local traffic will come in via say your MWEB dialup with fixed ip ...

this is not a fool proof plan but works bloody well we prepended our AS to all local peers via JINX to ensure more traffic came via SAT ...

it certainaly was not cheap but 1Mb uncontested uncapped international BW was a very nice to have at a fraction of the cost of hellkom ... all very legal :)
 

ajax

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Oct 29, 2003
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<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Not really. Most of the satellites used by European ISPs are the same satellites used by our own favourite co-monopolists, Telkom and Sentech. The companies operating the satellites sell "satellite time" through individual rental packages for each beam. Thus, an ISP which wants to serve Europe would buy time on the PAS7 and PAS10 "North" beams, while somebody wishing to serve Central Africa would buy time on the "equatorial" beam, and somebody wishing to serve South Africa or Australia, would buy time on the "South" beam.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but I remember years ago there were people in SA with some 5 meter dishes picking up satellite tv from Europe. The beams were not aimed at Africa, but with enough gain (dish size) it was possible to pick up a sidelobe of the beam. Theoretically then it should be possible to pick up the Northern beams? It just becomes very difficult to aim the dish properly and keep it steady. I'm reaching I suppose...
 

Nickste

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Aug 6, 2003
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So pointing a big dish in the direction of London, and getting a mate in London to point a big dish in the direction of my house wouldn't work...?

Nick Smit
broadband@nicksmit dot za dot net
 

martin

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Jul 25, 2003
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<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Nickste</i>
<br />So pointing a big dish in the direction of London, and getting a mate in London to point a big dish in the direction of my house wouldn't work...?

Nick Smit
broadband@nicksmit dot za dot net
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lol, nah that Big Ben clock thing would probably get into you line of sight. [:)]
 

plug

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Jul 24, 2003
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<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I remember years ago there were people in SA with some 5 meter dishes picking up satellite tv from Europe<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

I remember that too.
 

Karnaugh

Banned
Joined
Jul 23, 2003
Messages
1,575
And you want 50000ms latency internet? I sure as hell dont.

- Colin Alston
colin at alston dot za dot org

"Getting traffic shaping right is easy and can be summed up in one word: Dont." -- George Barnett
 

Nickste

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Aug 6, 2003
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Hmmm...

*Nickste crosses the "Big Dish" off his list and phones his nigerian friend to see if he has some REALLY long Telkom cables.

Chow, Nick

Nick Smit
broadband@nicksmit dot za dot net
 

podo

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Joined
Apr 16, 2004
Messages
288
ajax,

I'm afraid that won't really work for bidirectional internet access via satellite. The beams from satellites are actually directed at the intended location, not for business and licensing reasons, although those who like to impose restrictive licensing are happy with the status quo, but because sending data anywhere it doesn't need to go is wasting energy, which is rather valuable for orbital space craft which rely on solar induction panels as their only source of electrical power.

Since the beams are tight and directed, it isn't really possible to pick up a "side lobe" from this kind of beam, however, it could be possible to receive some signal, with a very high gain antenna, in ideal conditions. For instance, a powerful radio wave from a satellite may be reflected off parts of the Earth's surface, crust or upper mantle that contain large concentrations of metal. These signals, if they are reflected at an ideal angle, could then be reflected again by the two natural phenomena. The first is the Earth's Ionisphere, a high region of the atmosphere where intense ionization takes place in Helium particles. As the Earth rotates and day becomes night, changes occur in the Ionisphere that sometimes causes it to become "electromagnetically reflective." This is due to ionization and charge on particles in the atmosphere. In such a state, the Ionisphere could, feasibly, reflect a radio wave, which was reflected at a low angle from the surface in Europe or North Africa, back down to our part of the world. The signal could also be reflected back down to us, or refracted directly from the satellite, if it were somehow bounced off the Earth's geomagnetic field. Don't hold your breath for either though, as the Ionisphere is rarely in the electromagnetic state required, and the geomagnetic field is weak here, due to an as yet unexplained geomagnetic anomaly over Southern African and most of the South Atlantic. The geomagnetic field is also prone to frequent storming, caused by solar flares and interactions with neighbouring celestial bodies, which cause all kinds of problems for radio signals of any kind.

Getting back to bouncing a signal off either natural phenomenon, the problem is that after all of this reflection, the signal becomes pretty weak, due to the extreme distances traveled, and because of multi-path attenuation. If one were to point a high gain antenna, such as a very large dish, in the correct direction, it might be possible to receive a weak signal from beams targeted at Europe in this way, however, this isn't really viable for internet access use, as it would only work at night and in perfect weather, and because you would still only have downstream access.

To send a signal back to the satellite, you would need to bounce it off the Ionisphere or the geomagnetic field, and the surface in Europe or North Africa, in such a way that it reaches the correct receiver on the satellite. That isn't really possible, as it would be impractical to attempt to calculate where to point your transmitting antenna, and because no consumer grade surface to satellite transmitter would be able to generate a signal powerful enough to bounce back to the satellite in this way. Also, since the signal would be traveling an enormous distance, even if this could work, the latency would be too high for any real time application to work correctly.

Willie Viljoen
Web Developer

Adaptive Web Development
 
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