Valr Profit and Loss Statement

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Krypt0n1te

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Hi Guys and Girls

Please advise if this is in the wrong section.

Can anyone shed some light on determining my trading profits for the 2024 Tax Year?
I see that Valr does not give tax statements.
There seems to be 3rd party software that can generate a PnL statement, but these come at a cost.

Do you have any idea if there's Open Source software for this?

I appreciate any help you can provide.
 
You are expected to create it yourself.

Hopefully something that will soon change with the FSCA and regulations being put in place for crypto.
 
Snyper564 said:
1 btc 65 000 buy

1 btc 67 000 sell

67000-65000 = 2000 profit...

rinse repeat

if you have no idea how to calculate profit/loss maybe dont dabble with crypto
Click to expand...

It really is not that easy :p

I buy 1 Ethereum for R30 000 and withdraw to my wallet.

After a year, I withdraw that Ethereum and pay a fee of R50 in Eth gas, which is now a taxable event because the price of Ethereum is now R60 000 per, so my TX of R50, involves a disposal and technically a profit of R25 .

I then stake that Ethereum at Lido and pay another fee of R150, which is again a taxable event, and then after this I use my staked Eth to provide as collateral on Aave(another tax event) to take a USDT loan of 500 USDT to long WIF on some DEX (another tax event)

Not many people will know how to calculate the profit and loss of their crypto transactions to any accurate degree considering the use of crypto can be deemed a taxable event. (of course these events are "costs", which can be recorded as such, but they are also disposals, which is why it's hard to apply normal tax rules to "using" crypto)

This is why I do not use crypto to buy anything like groceries or regular shopping-it's all a taxable event under current tax regs.
 
Pansyfaust said:
It really is not that easy :p

I buy 1 Ethereum for R30 000 and withdraw to my wallet.

After a year, I withdraw that Ethereum and pay a fee of R50 in Eth gas, which is now a taxable event because the price of Ethereum is now R60 000 per, so my TX of R50, involves a disposal and technically a profit of R25 .

I then stake that Ethereum at Lido and pay another fee of R150, which is again a taxable event, and then after this I use my staked Eth to provide as collateral on Aave(another tax event) to take a USDT loan of 500 USDT to long WIF on some DEX (another tax event)

Not many people will know how to calculate the profit and loss of their crypto transactions to any accurate degree considering the use of crypto can be deemed a taxable event. (of course these events are "costs", which can be recorded as such, but they are also disposals, which is why it's hard to apply normal tax rules to "using" crypto)

This is why I do not use crypto to buy anything like groceries or regular shopping-it's all a taxable event under current tax regs.
Click to expand...
Hey this seemed like a basic crypto question not the enth degree. But in your instance it is more complex.
 
Snyper564 said:
Hey this seemed like a basic crypto question not the enth degree. But in your instance it is more complex.
Click to expand...
I know, I was showing my irritation having just done my taxes including my crypto.

Such a spiel for any other transaction other than buying/selling etc
 
Pansyfaust said:
It really is not that easy :p

I buy 1 Ethereum for R30 000 and withdraw to my wallet.

After a year, I withdraw that Ethereum and pay a fee of R50 in Eth gas, which is now a taxable event because the price of Ethereum is now R60 000 per, so my TX of R50, involves a disposal and technically a profit of R25 .

I then stake that Ethereum at Lido and pay another fee of R150, which is again a taxable event, and then after this I use my staked Eth to provide as collateral on Aave(another tax event) to take a USDT loan of 500 USDT to long WIF on some DEX (another tax event)

Not many people will know how to calculate the profit and loss of their crypto transactions to any accurate degree considering the use of crypto can be deemed a taxable event. (of course these events are "costs", which can be recorded as such, but they are also disposals, which is why it's hard to apply normal tax rules to "using" crypto)

This is why I do not use crypto to buy anything like groceries or regular shopping-it's all a taxable event under current tax regs.
Click to expand...
It's doable although not elegant. WIthdrawing is not a tax event. You are right you have lost due to ETH gas but not at R50 but at the original price of that ETH. This can be taken as a fee or as other buying or selling fees or as a loss, effect is the same.

Same as staking and the fee it incurs is not a tax event but again a write-off. Borrowing USDT is not a taxable event but you can write-off the cost of interest as the original cost of whichever method you use to pay. Usually it's incorporated into the result of the transaction you use it for, so say you borrow 1000 USDT but make 1500 USDT and have to pay back 1001 USDT you made 499 USDT.

Whichever method you use to calculate the cost of what you disposed of is up to you. A lot of people use an average buying cost. Some use first in first out. But you can even sell specific portions that you can justify like say you purchased 0.84641 ETH, 0.5493 ETH and 4.962 ETH, you can sell the 0.5493 ETH and use its cost minus fees.

Also remember you can calculate transactions in fractions but when declaring you declare full cents as a profit or loss. Be sure to keep detailed records of this and your transactions to carry the discrepancy over into the next financial year, this is not the same as a carry over on your tax return. My advice is that in the absence of a proper framework for crypto just keep a daily log (or whenever you do a transaction) of your transactions and standings and when the tax year ends download a statement for your records, you don't need to submit this. This way it doesn't become a big chore when you do your returns.
 
Swa said:
It's doable although not elegant. WIthdrawing is not a tax event. You are right you have lost due to ETH gas but not at R50 but at the original price of that ETH. This can be taken as a fee or as other buying or selling fees or as a loss, effect is the same.

Same as staking and the fee it incurs is not a tax event but again a write-off. Borrowing USDT is not a taxable event but you can write-off the cost of interest as the original cost of whichever method you use to pay. Usually it's incorporated into the result of the transaction you use it for, so say you borrow 1000 USDT but make 1500 USDT and have to pay back 1001 USDT you made 499 USDT.

Whichever method you use to calculate the cost of what you disposed of is up to you. A lot of people use an average buying cost. Some use first in first out. But you can even sell specific portions that you can justify like say you purchased 0.84641 ETH, 0.5493 ETH and 4.962 ETH, you can sell the 0.5493 ETH and use its cost minus fees.

Also remember you can calculate transactions in fractions but when declaring you declare full cents as a profit or loss. Be sure to keep detailed records of this and your transactions to carry the discrepancy over into the next financial year, this is not the same as a carry over on your tax return. My advice is that in the absence of a proper framework for crypto just keep a daily log (or whenever you do a transaction) of your transactions and standings and when the tax year ends download a statement for your records, you don't need to submit this. This way it doesn't become a big chore when you do your returns.
Click to expand...
I do realise it is a cost and is not a "disposal" in the way you might consider a normal asset disposal.

Here the asset is being used for the cost, and not another item. For example, if you use or "move" an asset like stocks or gold, there is a distinction between the gold/stock and fiat. The fee is not paid "in stock" but is seperate to the item.

Crypto, obviously is not as easy to do this seperation. You use the asset to "do" anything on the network. The cost of something I did in early 2024 is not the same "value" it is today. Which means, at the time you did the transaction, you need to record the cost then, in fiat, compared to what the cost might be today, making it more complex to a degree.
 
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