Web Africa representatives better ANSWER!!!!

Ex Unitate Vires

bwana said:
IMO splitting just further intrenches the idea that it's ok to do so.

It's the world wide web - and everyone else seems to have it but us.
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Too true

Although this splitting thing is interesting ;):D

I agree

ONE Internet ONE price

What are all the rumours that the price of International and National bandwidth is similar now :confused:

I do not see ANY need for this price differentiation.


R20 -- GIG -- anywhere -- anytime


End of story


MW
 
Nod said:
We are getting double billed currently (triple if you factor in dsl line rental).
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So ae you saying that if they made it one line item instead of three then you would feel better? :confused: Remember that the total at the bottom of the invoice will still be about the same :rolleyes:
 
MidnightWizard said:
Too true

Although this splitting thing is interesting ;):D

I agree

ONE Internet ONE price

What are all the rumours that the price of International and National bandwidth is similar now :confused:

I do not see ANY need for this price differentiation.


R20 -- GIG -- anywhere -- anytime


End of story


MW
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Without putting into any real thought into it, I say, "Yes".

R20 a gig all round and they could use the profits from "local" to subsidize the international.

But then again - my notion of it still allows them to consider Local vs International :mad: :sick:

From The Matrix,

There is NO LOCAL!
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:rolleyes:
 
ambo said:
So ae you saying that if they made it one line item instead of three then you would feel better? :confused: Remember that the total at the bottom of the invoice will still be about the same :rolleyes:
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No, I'm saying we should only be paying for 1 of those items, not put combine it all.

If you pay for your data, why do they worry about how fast you are using it? Does it matter in the end?
 
Gekco said:
They started this.
As far as I understand they (ISP's) pay for available capacity (speed)
Yet they charge us for data (gigs)
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A line of a certain capacity has a certain number of gigs that you can put through it and they are charging you for your slice of that capacity. Thats how contention works.
 
ambo said:
A line of a certain capacity has a certain number of gigs that you can put through it and they are charging you for your slice of that capacity. Thats how contention works.
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I understand that.
But with Seacom now online that should not really be an issue any more. (Theoretically...)
 
AFAIK Cybersmart already offers this option to use local only or international only.
 
AcidRaZor said:
Okay great, now that I have your attention ;)

With your new network up and (almost) running, would you say that you would be able to define between local and international traffic, giving us, for example:

30 gig local and 10 gig international, but ONLY deduct international off of the international portion and local off of the local portion without having to go through the international cap first to get to the local?

I seen many a thread pop up splitting local vs international with 2 accounts and everyone jumping on that bandwagon etc, so if you could offer a true split in traffic and account for local being on the local portion and international on the international portion you would certainly be my hero!
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Lol @ Title.

Technically it is possible although a bit tricky. Commercials are the sticking point though.
 
Let me followup. Firstly we have looked at this before, and it technically wasn't ever possible. Now it will be possible, however this needs to be factored.

Fact:
All ISP's in SA employ overselling on capped packages in order to be price competitive.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overselling

Commited rate bandwidth such as WA Prepaid is different to oversold bandwith, that's why its more expensive.

Secondly when we sell you a 10GB package at R490 we assume two things:
1) Average utilisation won't be 100% across the board (although its really close). If it were we'd lose money. You need a least a 30% GP margin and even that is fine. International ISP's GP's are 45% and the bigger you are as well.

2) That about 50% of that bandwidth will be local. Hence you only paying for 5gb of international (across the userbase). So if we go an split it, suddenly we have doubled our international costs. Currently this is the largest cost component in the ISP model.

So bottom line is yes it can be done, but you will cry at the price.
 
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Gekco said:
Guess the spelling Nazis have not been around for a while.
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:) Bad speling is uncesstable.

I've also seen this MyBB gem do the rounds: "Shapped / Trail accounts"
 
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Any solution that offers one-price local and international combined will always be "blended". There will always be a market for "local only", because no matter how many undersea cables are laid, the international leg will always be an additional charge to the cost of the local portion. I don't see the distinction between blended and local only disappearing any time soon.

Once LLU becomes a reality, local only accounts could become virtually free, because the cost of installing and maintaining fibre to a few DSLAMs (and, I assume, as usual the top 10% of DSLAMs account for 90% of the traffic) and key peering points is tiny, compared to the cost of running multiple cables half way around the globe, and having to maintain those cables.

Buy yourself a RouterBoard, follow the how-to, and split the traffic yourself. This way, you pay R 4.33 per gig for some (most ;)) of your traffic, otherwise you're going to be waiting a long time before blended gigs drop to that price.
 
wamatt said:
Let me followup. Firstly we have looked at this before, and it technically wasn't ever possible. Now it will be possible, however this needs to be factored.

Fact:
All ISP's in SA employ overselling on capped packages in order to be price competitive.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overselling

Commited rate bandwidth such as WA Prepaid is different to oversold bandwith, that's why its more expensive.

Secondly when we sell you a 10GB package at R490 we assume two things:
1) Average utilisation won't be 100% across the board (although its really close). If it were we'd lose money. You need a least a 30% GP margin and even that is fine. International ISP's GP's are 45% and the bigger you are as well.

2) That about 50% of that bandwidth will be local. Hence you only paying for 5gb of international (across the userbase). So if we go an split it, suddenly we have doubled our international costs. Currently this is the largest cost component in the ISP model.

So bottom line is yes it can be done, but you will cry at the price.
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Thanks for the response. I understand ISP's pricing models perfectly. All I was saying is that if you sell me bandwidth, I don't want to be capped internationally for locally used bandwidth and only then be able to surf locally on the "local cap"

Basically give me what Telkom Do package has, 10 gig international and 30 gig local (or whatever) and then be able to distinguish both types of traffic and (as an example) use from both of these caps depending on where I surf or download from. (If you need to adjust the type of cap offering to make it more competitive but still turn a profit, why not, maybe get some new pricing model maths out)

Allowing me not to worry about international cap first and local cap later. I do understand they win some on the international portion as not all traffic is international, but if you tell a heroin addict the only drug he'll get is cocaine and if he buys x amount from you only then you'll supply heroin, he'll sure as hell make sure he uses all the cocaine he gets before you'll give heroin so he can get his "high"

Meaning. If you tell him international access and then after you're capped local only (but that local traffic counts towards the international access portion) the user would most likely use as much international traffic as possible:

And I give you "Splitting International And local" threads on my bb (I'll supply a stone, you can throw it, and find 5 threads about doing that)

So all I'm saying is, make it less technical for the end user so that they don't have to go to length's just to get something you're technically able to give them and carve out an innovative path for Web Africa.

I'm sure you guys can make it happen! Even if you can't match Telkom's price for the international/local, at least make the caps lower but give us the ability to be rest assured that when I visit mybroadband I'm using my "local" cap already and when I youtube I use my international one.

It really is up to you to carve the way seeing as though IS is the leading supplier of local only accounts (and I assume you sell many of those!) so why not follow suit? Innovative out of the box thinking is required here. ;)
 
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AcidRaZor said:
Thanks for the response. I understand ISP's pricing models perfectly. All I was saying is that if you sell me bandwidth, I don't want to be capped internationally for locally used bandwidth and only then be able to surf locally on the "local cap"

Basically give me what Telkom Do package has, 10 gig international and 30 gig local (or whatever) and then be able to distinguish both types of traffic and (as an example) use from both of these caps depending on where I surf or download from.
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You sure you following?. Check what you wrote again. Unless I'm misunderstanding you, you've just described discreet caps. Hence you've gotten yourself 10GB of pure international. For this account you'd pay a grand. Still happy? :D
 
Another way to think of it is like cutting a kilo of coke with a kilo of bicarb. You can sell it for half the price ;) Telkom's DO is blended for a reason. The pure is what you guys crave, but it costs.

Disclaimer: Hookers not included.
 
wamatt - so web africa won't be looking into this at all even to cut costs while keeping prices the same for consumers? come on now.. :)
 
AcidRaZor, local only gigs are cross subsidised. It costs WA more in just IPC charges to provide those 30 gigs than the R 130 they charge. Similarly, blended gigs are cross subsidised by forfeited gigs, local gigs and cached gigs. In other words, any high-end-user product (like the one you're taking about) will only attract leaches like myself, thereby reducing the amount of forfeited gigs, local gigs and cached gigs. Thereby reducing the level of cross-subsidising by low-end-users. The best product for leaches like myself is one where I'm in the top 10% of users (which are actually loss making for the ISP) and the other 90% of users subsidise me.

If local and international were split by the ISP, then more gigs would be used overall (mostly by low-end users), and the cost to everyone would go up. For example: I spilt my own data, and download 35 gigs a month for R 239 . If everyone had their caps spilt (by their ISP), then everyone could download 35 gigs a month, and all of a sudden R 239 pm is not profitable any more. Price goes up. It's in my interest for things to stay the way they are.
 
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