Which would you pick?

zorro5614 said:
And will someone like Haval with a 7 year / 200 000km cover replacement of the DSG gearbox
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They don't use DSG (direct shift gearbox), they use DCT (dual-clutch transmission).

Warranty will cover gearbox issues.
 
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Lupus said:
Holiday reason? Cause I got my car in 2 days at the start of Dec
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It's just going to stand in the garage until next week anyway. I figure I save a few pennies in interest and insurance costs this way.
 
airborne said:
Those DSG gearboxes are literally like ticking time bombs, it’s typically not a case of if but rather when.
Nothing lasts for ever but those things often sht the bed under 100k km which is bs reliability and they can cost a mint to fix.
The VAG dealers will typically charge R50-80k to repair them
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DSG boxes are a lot better than the early 2000's when they self grenaded with minimal mileage. What many forget or are unaware of, they may be 'automatics' as they change gears but they still use clutches and need to be treated as such. I remind my wife often that when she is stopped in her Tiguan to put her foot fully on the brake to avoid clutch wear.

P.S. VAG dealers don't fix DSG gearboxes, they outsource the repairs.
 
I popped by Haval to obtain a printout of the service record (there's no manual record anymore). It's pretty surreal seeing the service plan and warranty continuing until 2032.
 
Neuk_ said:
DSG boxes are a lot better than the early 2000's when they self grenaded with minimal mileage. What many forget or are unaware of, they may be 'automatics' as they change gears but they still use clutches and need to be treated as such. I remind my wife often that when she is stopped in her Tiguan to put her foot fully on the brake to avoid clutch wear.

P.S. VAG dealers don't fix DSG gearboxes, they outsource the repairs.
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I feel that manufacturers and dealers are partially to blame here too as they don't make a point of educating buyers on the differences between a torque converted automatic and DCTs. They just sell it as "an automatic is an automatic" and then people sit and crawl with them in traffic.
 
GMAN03 said:
I feel that manufacturers and dealers are partially to blame here too as they don't make a point of educating buyers on the differences between a torque converted automatic and DCTs. They just sell it as "an automatic is an automatic" and then people sit and crawl with them in traffic.
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Sales staff are generally not very knowledgeable or interested in educating buyers. I drove my first auto a few weeks ago at a VW dealership (Polo Life and T-Cross DSG). The sales person even struggled to show me the DSG basics and had very little knowledge of the spec of the vehicles
 
zorro5614 said:
Sales staff are generally not very knowledgeable or interested in educating buyers. I drove my first auto a few weeks ago at a VW dealership (Polo Life and T-Cross DSG). The sales person even struggled to show me the DSG basics and had very little knowledge of the spec of the vehicles
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Its something that has always baffled me about car salespeople, especially those who have been doing it a manufacturer dealership for more than 6 months. They are generally clueless about the technical stuff on the vehicles they're selling.

If I had to do the car sales thing ever in my life, I'd make damn sure that I know the technical ins and outs of the product I'm selling.
 
ToxicBunny said:
Its something that has always baffled me about car salespeople, especially those who have been doing it a manufacturer dealership for more than 6 months. They are generally clueless about the technical stuff on the vehicles they're selling.

If I had to do the car sales thing ever in my life, I'd make damn sure that I know the technical ins and outs of the product I'm selling.
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Yes I was really disappointed. I had never driven a auto in my life. The T-Cross we drove was her commuter to home and work. She struggled for over 30 seconds to find drive. Making it clear I had never driven a auto, she gave zero advise or tips to get me comfortable

I had more time before driving the Polo and could quickly spot the basic spec and decided to test her a little. She had no clue what we were driving. Can't they even just put a basic spec in each car so they can give you clear correct answers

Was at Suzuki on the same day, completely different experience. Extremely well informed, did not have to ask everything myself. Was clear on the spec I was driving

Maybe I am being a bit harsh as Suzuki don't have any extra's you can add and VW has a endless list
 
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zorro5614 said:
Yes I was really disappointed. I had never driven a auto in my life. The T-Cross we drove was her commuter to home and work. She struggled for over 30 seconds to find drive. Making it clear I had never driven a auto, she gave zero advise or tips to get me comfortable

I had more time before driving the Polo and could quickly spot the basic spec and decided to test her a little. She had no clue what we were driving. Can't they even just put a basic spec in each car so they can give you clear correct answers

Was at Suzuki on the same day, completely different experience. Extremely well informed, did not have to ask everything myself. Was clear on the spec I was driving

Maybe I am being a bit harsh as Suzuki don't have any extra's you can add and VW has a endless list
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TBH, I don't really want to know about all the options etc, but basic things like Engine size, power output, transmission type (and the variations there-in), etc. If it gets to the point that I actually want to buy the car itself, then all the different options available and what they mean etc would be good.
 
ToxicBunny said:
TBH, I don't really want to know about all the options etc, but basic things like Engine size, power output, transmission type (and the variations there-in), etc. If it gets to the point that I actually want to buy the car itself, then all the different options available and what they mean etc would be good.
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I sort of get a second hand salesman not necessarily knowing all the specs of every vehicle on their floor, but if you're selling new surely you know every detail about every option you have available. And let's be honest - for most dealers that's 4 or 5 models with their various trim. It took me about 20 min to get my head around all 6 current Jolion models, it's really not complicated. And if its your job, you'd best do the legwork.
 
Speedster said:
I sort of get a second hand salesman not necessarily knowing all the specs of every vehicle on their floor, but if you're selling new surely you know every detail about every option you have available. And let's be honest - for most dealers that's 4 or 5 models with their various trim. It took me about 20 min to get my head around all 6 current Jolion models, it's really not complicated. And if its your job, you'd best do the legwork.
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100%, 2nd hand sales guys I'd want to have broad strokes knowledge, like its a manual/auto/dsg/dct/cvt and generally what that entails etc in broad strokes, not necessarily model specific.

But yeah new car sales people should know their product inside/out/upside down etc.
 
Speedster said:
They don't use DSG (direct shift gearbox), they use DCT (dual-clutch transmission).

Warranty will cover gearbox issues.
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Which is really the same thing.

However it’s only Audi/VW’s version that seems to **** itself the whole time.

Even Porsche who run the same setup somehow get it right.

Nice thing is the Haval gearbox is entirely their own, not a roll of the dice to see which of the three different OEM gearboxes you get in a VAG.
 
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zorro5614 said:
Sales staff are generally not very knowledgeable or interested in educating buyers. I drove my first auto a few weeks ago at a VW dealership (Polo Life and T-Cross DSG). The sales person even struggled to show me the DSG basics and had very little knowledge of the spec of the vehicles
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VAG dealers typically don't have to bother with any of that. If you don't buy it, someone else will. So you get the bottom of the barrel of salesmen.

Now go to a Subaru dealership, which is far more niche. Chances are their salesmen are far more knowledgeable about their product. They have to be, to turn every possible lead into a sale...
 
Neuk_ said:
P.S. VAG dealers don't fix DSG gearboxes, they outsource the repairs.
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Well they don’t even outsource it they just replace the entire thing that’s broken which is either the whole gearbox or the mechatronics depending on what died.
 
Mike Hoxbig said:
VAG dealers typically don't have to bother with any of that. If you don't buy it, someone else will. So you get the bottom of the barrel of salesmen.

Now go to a Subaru dealership, which is far more niche. Chances are their salesmen are far more knowledgeable about their product. They have to be, to turn every possible lead into a sale...
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My local Subaru dealership is even worse. The salespeople seem to be non-existent.

I was waiting on the parts department staff to get in one Saturday morning and a couple came in looking at a Forester. I could tell they were looking for someone to show them around the car but there wasn't a salesperson in sight so I took it upon myself to show them around it and they were fairly impressed with the car so I told them to go to another dealer for a test drive as this one was clearly not interested in their business.

I get the feeling that Subaru is so niche that they virtually sell themselves with people doing their own research and then only going to a dealership for a test drive or to negotiate a purchase. But that is limited to my experience with one dealer so I'd like to imagine that others are better.
 
SauRoNZA said:
Which is really the same thing.

However it’s only Audi/VW’s version that seems to **** itself the whole time.

Even Porsche who run the same setup somehow get it right.

Nice thing is the Haval gearbox is entirely their own, not a roll of the dice to see which of the three different OEM gearboxes you get in a VAG.
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My wife's ex Chery had a 7 speed dual clutch transmission, made by Getrag. DSG's were designed by BorgWarner and licenced to VAG, Amarok's use a ZF automatic and Touareg's depending on year either use ZF or Aisin. I presume you meant these OEM's as opposed to VW, Audi, Porsche, etc?
 
Neuk_ said:
My wife's ex Chery had a 7 speed dual clutch transmission, made by Getrag. DSG's were designed by BorgWarner and licenced to VAG, Amarok's use a ZF automatic and Touareg's depending on year either use ZF or Aisin. I presume you meant these OEM's as opposed to VW, Audi, Porsche, etc?
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I meant the OEM’s of the DSG gearboxes across the different models.

While BorgWarner did the original design there are others like LUK and Ricardo involved along the way with different models under the VAG umbrella and I believe different OEM manufacturers (including themselves) depending on the model and location etc.

The DQ200 dry clutch for instance is made by the Skoda side and the Chinese arm of VW.

Between the 4/5 different models of DSG over time they all come from different places and with different parts suppliers etc.
 
SauRoNZA said:
I guess for out of warranty jobs it would make sense yeah.
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Lots of dealerships farm out gearbox work whether it’s in or out of warranty work, they are just too complicated.
But for mechatronics and clutch replacements from what I understand those should largely be in house because it’s typically not an overly complicated job, it’s nothing like a full strip down that some gearbox repairs may necessitate.
 
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