Whites in comfort zone

[Sinbad]

What up mate? It was pointed out a few times already that they are talking about a South Africa the is 'post- Apartheid and fixes the Apartheid issues...so it has to be mentioned.

Is there any South Africa now that is not post-apartheid? Nope.
So my point remains. Keep pointing to the past. Keep reminding people. Perpetuate the feelings of guilt and inadequacy on both sides. Awesome way to build social cohesion.

 

[TheHiveMind]

I was listening to SAFM now, and a black racist phoned in and was complaining about the whites, and how blacks and whites can not live together.. and I was just thinking... how similar a black racists sound to white racists. They hate each other so much but are actually brothers and kin in warped ideology. Racists are so retarded.

Nothing retarded about that, they are in agreement on their want of segregating from eachother, and in destroying your vision. Why wouldn't they say the same things?

 

[Freaksta]

Is there any South Africa now that is not post-apartheid? Nope.
So my point remains. Keep pointing to the past. Keep reminding people. Perpetuate the feelings of guilt and inadequacy on both sides. Awesome way to build social cohesion.

I must agree with you...

 

[ChocolateBadger]

As a white male, it's already so hard for me to get somewhere in this country. I have white friends that helped me get where I am today and I'm grateful for that, not to say I didn't work my a$$ of for it but I got my position because I worked for it and not because I'm black. The more the government punish the whites for actually keeping this country afloat the more the white are going to keep the money to themselves. I think the ANC should realize that there is more to South Africa than just Sandton. The sheer amount of open racism towards whites is astonishing, like I wanted to become a commercial pilot for SAA but I cannot afford the crazy costs for a pilots licence/getting flying hours/getting commercial licence but I know SAA has a "internship" program to help young people become commercial pilots, but theres a catch, you HAVE to be black. So to put this into prospective, there are 16-18 year olds that are riding on the previously disadvantaged wagon and have an "easy" way into something where a white person 16-18 has to have weathy parents that can fork out the cash, R600 000+, to get their child into that kind of position.

So really, just OPEN ACCEPTED RACISM. If I could I would take SAA to the constitutional court for that program as it disallows equal opportunity.

 

[w1z4rd]

Nothing retarded about that, they are in agreement on their want of segregating from eachother, and in destroying your vision. Why wouldn't they say the same things?

I didnt say they wouldnt say the same things, Im just highlighting how they share the same stupid beliefs (yet they whine about how different they are!). LOL! Such idiots. Racists really are the bottom scraps of humanity. Even whale turds feature higher up the evolutionary scale than they do.

 

[R13...]

I didnt say they wouldnt say the same things, Im just highlighting how they share the same stupid beliefs (yet they whine about how different they are!). LOL! Such idiots. Racists really are the bottom scraps of humanity.

Lol, they'd do great if they got together to swap notes and whine together a bit more

 

[Apache]

I didnt say they wouldnt say the same things, Im just highlighting how they share the same stupid beliefs (yet they whine about how different they are!). LOL! Such idiots. Racists really are the bottom scraps of humanity. Even whale turds feature higher up the evolutionary scale than they do.

How wonderfully tolerant and liberal you are

 

[STS]

As a white male, it's already so hard for me to get somewhere in this country. I have white friends that helped me get where I am today and I'm grateful for that, not to say I didn't work my a$$ of for it but I got my position because I worked for it and not because I'm black. The more the government punish the whites for actually keeping this country afloat the more the white are going to keep the money to themselves. I think the ANC should realize that there is more to South Africa than just Sandton. The sheer amount of open racism towards whites is astonishing, like I wanted to become a commercial pilot for SAA but I cannot afford the crazy costs for a pilots licence/getting flying hours/getting commercial licence but I know SAA has a "internship" program to help young people become commercial pilots, but theres a catch, you HAVE to be black. So to put this into prospective, there are 16-18 year olds that are riding on the previously disadvantaged wagon and have an "easy" way into something where a white person 16-18 has to have weathy parents that can fork out the cash, R600 000+, to get their child into that kind of position.

So really, just OPEN ACCEPTED RACISM. If I could I would take SAA to the constitutional court for that program as it disallows equal opportunity.

i think people have this misconception that if you're black, you get everything. even as a black man you have to work hard, and in majority white companies i can tell you that there are no black managers, my first company i worked at had no black people in managerial positions and when it came time for promotion, guess who got it? white people.

second company i joined, all white managers. so it differs in some places, i've seen companies that abuse it.

 

[Sherbang]

Is there any South Africa now that is not post-apartheid? Nope.
So my point remains. Keep pointing to the past. Keep reminding people. Perpetuate the feelings of guilt and inadequacy on both sides. Awesome way to build social cohesion.

No it's just terminology to differentiate between now and then apartheid vs post-apartheid. That's all.
It's like using BC and AD to differentiate between the time before christ and after.

Most of the problems current government has to deal with are a legacy of apartheid, you can't run away from that or ignore it.
The current leaders, themselves, are all products of apartheid as are the opposition and any adult over 30 years old. The current disparities we live with everyday are products of apartheid. I mean come on. You think by not talking about it we'll all suddenly be happy. Adults alive today will just forget the humiliation and abuse they suffered for years, the opportunities denied them, the loved one's they lost. All PTSD will just disappear. Economic disparities will suddenly sort themselves out? It's called post-apartheid because that is what it is. Our country is undergoing a transformation post-apartheid. The current government has not done a good job in fixing some problems caused by apartheid so we can blame the current government for that. In many areas, have done a terrible job fixing some problems caused by apartheid and have made things worse in some cases, we can blame them for that too. But all the issues they have to deal with since 1994 are apartheids legacy. It's not about blaming apartheid, it's about recognising we live in a post-apartheid society which brings with it problems and issues unique to our country

 

[xrapidx]

I also had to work my arse off, no matric (my own doing, sort of, but still) , and spent three months going to interviews I wasn't black enough for - then finally got a low paying job and had to work my arse off to get where I am.

My parents didn't have the means to help me.

I don't think I'd feel the same if everything I have now was given to me because of my race, and if the occasion arises that its taken away from me because of my race - I'm outta here.

 

[Freaksta]

i think people have this misconception that if you're black, you get everything. even as a black man you have to work hard, and in majority white companies i can tell you that there are no black managers, my first company i worked at had no black people in managerial positions and when it came time for promotion, guess who got it? white people.

second company i joined, all white managers. so it differs in some places, i've seen companies that abuse it.

See this is where I think it gets a bit muddled! There are a lot of BEE only jobs, but to replace a manager with a BEE candidate just because they are a BEE candidate is not in the best interest of the company. Unfortunatly white people get pissed off when someone is given a job based on purely the colour of your skin! To me bee is damaging relationships between black vs white. Why can a company simply not employ based on skills, qualifications and normal interview criteria? Forcing these policies do give some people free rides, and leaves a bad taste in other people's mouths!

I'm yet to actually enter the employement arena, but I do actually have a 3 year working/training contract to do my CA and the lady actually told me they often get a bit of flack because they sometimes don't for full their quota, but won't sign someone who won't cope!

The day we can all just get along 85% of the time will be happy days!

 

[Sinbad]

No it's just terminology to differentiate between now and then apartheid vs post-apartheid. That's all.
It's like using BC and AD to differentiate between the time before christ and after.

Most of the problems current government has to deal with are a legacy of apartheid, you can't run away from that or ignore it.
The current leaders, themselves, are all products of apartheid as are the opposition and any adult over 30 years old. The current disparities we live with everyday are products of apartheid. I mean come on. You think by not talking about it we'll all suddenly be happy. Adults alive today will just forget the humiliation and abuse they suffered for years, the opportunities denied them, the loved one's they lost. All PTSD will just disappear. Economic disparities will suddenly sort themselves out? It's called post-apartheid because that is what it is. Our country is undergoing a transformation post-apartheid. The current government has not done a good job in fixing some problems caused by apartheid so we can blame the current government for that. In many areas, have done a terrible job fixing some problems caused by apartheid and have made things worse in some cases, we can blame them for that too. But all the issues they have to deal with since 1994 are apartheids legacy. It's not about blaming apartheid, it's about recognising we live in a post-apartheid society which brings with it problems and issues unique to our country

I ask again - why do we have to differentiate between now and then by using the word "apartheid"? Does ANYONE still think it's 1980?

Why does apartheid have to feature in everything? I still think it gets used as an emotive term to lay blame, and to buy the ANC another vote (because we are the POST apartheid people, vote for us instead of the other guy who must be PRE apartheid). Recognising we live in a post-apartheid society? That's defining society as being stuck in the past. "We have wounds that we will never allow to heal because we keep poking at them"... still great for social cohesion eh?
I know we can't erase the past. We can't erase the hurt. What's done cannot be undone. But we sure as hell can stop living there and start looking to a future, can't we?

But all the issues they have to deal with since 1994 are apartheids legacy

Oh no, NOT all the issues the ANC has had to deal with are apartheid's legacy. Corruption? Greed? Nepotism? Incompetence? Not apartheid's legacy. ANC's legacy, thank you very much. They did that all on their own.

(no I'm not saying the apartheid government was any better - but that's no excuse at all)

 

[R13...]

See this is where I think it gets a bit muddled! There are a lot of BEE only jobs, but to replace a manager with a BEE candidate just because they are a BEE candidate is not in the best interest of the company. Unfortunatly white people get pissed off when someone is given a job based on purely the colour of your skin! To me bee is damaging relationships between black vs white. Why can a company simply not employ based on skills, qualifications and normal interview criteria? Forcing these policies do give some people free rides, and leaves a bad taste in other people's mouths!

See the problem is every black candidate gets labelled AA and the circle goes on forever. And to answer the criteria question - the legislation is there because there is still a significant number of people in management who think the colour of your skin is qualification enough, they will only hire a white person because they can "trust" such a person. The legislation if not abused works great. But is of course being abused by racists on the black & white side.

 

[grok]

I agree with Tutu.

Whites live in a world where they expect

1) value for their tax money at national and municipal level
2) elected politicians to be honest and make decisions that'll put the good of the country before their own interest
3) not to be discriminated against
4) criminal elements to be prosecuted instead of handled with kid gloves
5) the country as a whole to progress to be able to compete against the rest of the world
6) their culture to be respected as much as blacks want theirs to be respected
7) everyone to work towards their own wealth instead of leeching off the system or demanding to share someone else's

So yeah, it seems whites live in a comfort zone after all.

Another point ..

After the end of apartheid, "the focus was on building the country... and the people were left behind," Futhi Mtoba, the black chairperson of Business Unity South Africa, said at a social cohesion forum held last month.

Dunno but it seems to me the country was pretty much built before the ANC took over. All they had to do was to unite everyone with the focus to uplift the previously disatvantaged so they could have access to the same services in order to become productive citizens.

Who'se fault is it that they chose to keep apartheid wounds alive for political gain, ruin the economy with outdated ideologies and corrupt public service to the extend they have?

Do they honestly expect whites to voluntary give up privileges in the current political climate of discrimination, when it's obvious the ANC is heading towards yet another failed African state?

 

[Sherbang]

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

I ask again - why do we have to differentiate between now and then by using the word "apartheid"? Does ANYONE still think it's 1980?

Why does apartheid have to feature in everything

it's about recognising we live in a post-apartheid society which brings with it problems and issues unique to our country.
The problems this country faces are unique and are apartheids legacy. Hence post-apartheid.
It's like post-natal depression, yes, the birth has happened, but the depression is intimately linked to the birth, hence postnatal.
The problems in our country are intimately linked to apartheid, hence post-apartheid.

Oh no, NOT all the issues the ANC has had to deal with are apartheid's legacy. Corruption? Greed? Nepotism? Incompetence? Not apartheid's legacy. ANC's legacy, thank you very much. They did that all on their own.

All the corrupt, greedy, incompetent people you are talking about are products of apartheid. They were born, brought up and educated under apartheid, their ideologies were formed by apartheid, the ANC itself was a response to apartheid. Yes, the individuals themselves are responsible, we can't blame apartheid for their personal greed and corruption, but you must recognise that the whole political and social environment we live in, one which which makes greed and corruption easy, possible and attractive is apartheid's legacy.

 

[Fudzy]

Dunno but it seems to me the country was pretty much built before the ANC took over.

What do you mean by that?

 

[Sinbad]

All the corrupt, greedy, incompetent people you are talking about are products of apartheid. They were born, brought up and educated under apartheid, their ideologies were formed by apartheid, the ANC itself was a response to apartheid. Yes, the individuals themselves are responsible, we can't blame apartheid for their personal greed and corruption, but you must recognise that the whole political and social environment we live in, one which which makes greed and corruption easy, possible and attractive is apartheid's legacy.

Wow, so apartheid took away people's ability to know right from wrong? And it's completely not their fault?
Then don't you ever dare chastise ANY white person for being racist, as they were brought up that way, by your logic.

 

[seted]

There is a notion that accompanies these stories that somehow whites must give up what they have in order for blacks to be raised up; that blacks can only have a better life if whites give stuff to them. Why must black prosperity came at the expense of white prosperity? Surely the two can co-exist?

 

[Sherbang]

All the corrupt, greedy, incompetent people you are talking about are products of apartheid. They were born, brought up and educated under apartheid, their ideologies were formed by apartheid, the ANC itself was a response to apartheid. Yes, the individuals themselves are responsible, we can't blame apartheid for their personal greed and corruption, but you must recognise that the whole political and social environment we live in, one which which makes greed and corruption easy, possible and attractive is apartheid's legacy.

Wow, so apartheid took away people's ability to know right from wrong? And it's completely not their fault?
Then don't you ever dare chastise ANY white person for being racist, as they were brought up that way, by your logic.

Which part of the bolded bit did you not understand?

 

[Sinbad]

Which part of the bolded bit did you not understand?

This bit

All the corrupt, greedy, incompetent people you are talking about are products of apartheid.

In one breath you say it's the individual who is responsible, but you've just said that they're not, as they are products of apartheid.

You can't have it both ways.