Why a ISP

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kilps

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This question has properly been asked before but what is the point in a ISP with Telkom ADSL (if Telkopm provides the bandwith)?

And if Telkom provides the bandwith why is a ADSL ISP so expensive?

Sorry if this has been asked before!
 
It's not the ADSL ISP that's expensive (well, it is, but..), it's the line rental, which can only be obtained from Telkom regardless of what ISP you choose.

Many people choose Telkom as thier ISP because then you get everything on one bill - Line rental and ISP charges = easier.
 
An ADSL wholesale account is around 170 beans so thats what Telkom charges for 3GB. Anything above the 170 beans is money the ISP makes, although most likely to cover their other Telkom charges like hefty phone bills..
 
Who is actually applying the 3Gb limit. I at first thought it was on the ADSL line through Telkom, but if I understood it correctly, from what I have seen and read in the forum, I can have 2 ISP accounts which will basically give me 6Gb per month. Does that imply that it is actually the ISP that applies the 3Gb limit.
 
The DSLAM connects you to Tekloms fibre network.
The fibre network takes you into Tekloms core ADSL router for that region (Sometimes SAIX).

Now - UUNet seem to be able to route directly to them from this point, and can therefore offer a proper uncapped package,

Then you are routed to a RADIUS type server. This is the bugger that is applying the Cap against your UserId.

After this point is where most ISP's come in. UUNet seem to be an exception.
 
Ok this all looks pretty complicated - can anyone give me a 'dummies' breakdown. I mean with dialup you connect to the ISP and they trafic all your internet. But have seen Telkoms argument that ADSL is so expensive because of the bandwith. So Telkom must handle the traffic....anyone see what I am saying? Or am I missing something?
 
The answer is infact simple, Telkom cross-subsidise. They charge you, the consumer an exorbitant amount for line rental, apparently for the expensive international bandwidth. Then they take it a step further and charge the ISP for the international bandwidth that you used.

The way it should be is that Telkom charges its phone number rental and installation and then charge the !ISP! for the bandwidth! This also opens up the oppurtunity for ISPs to enter into competition for lower prices, however, Telkom will most probably charge the ISP a wopping price as they wont make as much mula.
 
GimmeMore said:
Who is actually applying the 3Gb limit. I at first thought it was on the ADSL line through Telkom, but if I understood it correctly, from what I have seen and read in the forum, I can have 2 ISP accounts which will basically give me 6Gb per month. Does that imply that it is actually the ISP that applies the 3Gb limit.
Click to expand...
There is 3 types of people here.
The bulk of ADSL resellers with the 3Gb cap comes from Telkom.

The second type, these are normally people who offer mulitples of 3Gb (Mweb, Tiscali etc...) all they are doing is selling you multiple ADSL accounts under one username (sometimes under multiple usernames). Once again cap controlled by Telkom.

The third type are companies that run an end point. These are rare, in fact in my mind there are two UUNet and Datapro (or DiData, I always confuse them). They control the cap themselves.

An end point means the point you connect to the internet.
ie: When you connect with ADSL you connect to an ADSL network with all other ADSL users, some special servers and routers. One of these routers then connects to the internet. That point of connecting the ADSL network to the internet is known as the endpoint.
 
1. Datapro uses a "hack", then put you on a 3GB DSL until you go over then they switch you to their network. UUNet is speculated not to do this, will report back once we test it later this week.

2. Wholesale DSL is R190 for under 2000 users.
 
Is it possible to setup a wireless network with your neighbours and share Uncapped ADSL from UUNET.

Is something like that a pipe-dream or possible but with a lot of ****.
 
GimmeMore said:
Is it possible to setup a wireless network with your neighbours and share Uncapped ADSL from UUNET.

Is something like that a pipe-dream or possible but with a lot of ****.
Click to expand...

Possible with a lot of **** - first you have to find neighbours that actually want to have 24/7 internet access - and you'd be surpised how few give a damn. Then you'd have to convince them to fork out around R2000 in setup costs each and then you'd have to figure out how to charge them. Then you'd have to explain to them why they can't get online when Telkom borks your line out *which happens a LOT* and finally, you'd have to make sure nobody abuses the cap.

A better idea would be a mesh network where everyone has ADSL and each person could regulate how they shared thier connection - for instance, one month Joe Soap uses up his cap, but Fred Bloggs still has 1gig left on the 20th, so he allows Joe Soap to proxy through him at a slower speed.

That kinda idea is more viable, because it puts like minded people together.
 
kilps said:
I now get what is happening with Telkom charging the ISP - but does the ISP actually provide you with anything?
Click to expand...
Yes, access to bandwidth, followed by a cap on bandwidth, followed by no international bandwidth...
 
kilps said:
I now get what is happening with Telkom charging the ISP - but does the ISP actually provide you with anything?
Click to expand...
Additional services like email address, hosting, support desk etc...
 
If I had a choice, I would go without the email adress(freely available, some even with POP3 access, google mai for instance), hosting and the support desk. The only thing I need is a connection to the end point, and for that I have to fork out R250+!
 
well a large % of that R250 goes to telkom as well for your end point connection. why that is not bundled into the initial fee is beyond me.
 
kilps said:
What I am seeing is beside the extra service the ISP does nothing - so does anyone know of a way to bypass having a ISP? :-)
Click to expand...
Actually the ISP cost is the reasonable part of the service. The problem is Telscum's line rental.
 
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