XSLT, XPath, JDOM, css, xhtml and Javascript

[Veroland]

Anybody with some good good skills in the above mentioned areas and looking for a job in the Johannesburg area?

We need some skills urgently. It's amazing how much can change if you take one day to go to the myBB conference.

Please PM me if you are interested.

Disclaimer: Sorry rpm, mods if I posted this in the wrong place.

 

[FarligOpptreden]

Man, I have extensive experience in all those areas and those acronyms are my passion, but unfortunately I am settled in a good job right now. Good luck in finding your candidate though!

 

[icyrus]

XHTML is dead. It would be better to use meaningful standards.

 

[FarligOpptreden]

XHTML is dead. It would be better to use meaningful standards.

*sigh* XHTML 2.0 is dead. XHTML 1.0 will live on for quite some time more, probably until around 2023 at least when HTML 5 is said to be matured. So XHTML is to be the preferred standard for most common browsers, taking into consideration backwards compatibility for the next few years.

 

[icyrus]

*sigh* XHTML 2.0 is dead. XHTML 1.0 will live on for quite some time more, probably until around 2023 at least when HTML 5 is said to be matured. So XHTML is to be the preferred standard for most common browsers, taking into consideration backwards compatibility for the next few years.

According to who? Tell me, do you serve your XHTML with the XHTML doctype or the HTML doctype? More importantly what real-world benefit does XHTML have over HTML4 strict? Can you provide any usage statistics of XHTML over HTML4 that backup your claims?

But hey, if you want to, use XHTML. I'll leave you with this gem from Mark Pilgrim:

This is the house
This is the house
The house of confusion
That Jeffrey built.

These are the tags
That live in the house
The house of confusion
That Jeffrey built.

These are the slashes
That we all ignore
That end the tags
That live in the house
The house of confusion
That Jeffrey built.

This is the namespace
That doesn’t do squat
When we parse the slashes
That end the tags
That live in the house
That Jeffrey built.

This is the header
That nobody sees
’Cause they see the namespace
That doesn’t do squat
When we parse the slashes
That end the tags
That live in the house
That Jeffrey built.

This is the spec
That nobody uses
’Cause we use the header
That nobody sees
’Cause they see the namespace
That doesn’t do squat
When we parse the slashes
That end the tags
That live in the house
That Jeffrey built.

Say goodbye to the spec
That no longer exists
And stick with the header
That nobody sees
And drop the namespace
That doesn’t do squat
And skip the slashes
That end the tags
That live in the house
That live in the house
The house of confusion
That Jeffrey built.

 

[FarligOpptreden]

According to who? Tell me, do you serve your XHTML with the XHTML doctype or the HTML doctype? More importantly what real-world benefit does XHTML have over HTML4 strict? Can you provide any usage statistics of XHTML over HTML4 that backup your claims?

Google a bit, I'm sure you're capable, Google a bit.

Seriously though, closing your tags is just good practice. You then know where a tag should start and end and parsing text through e.g. Regex is much easier. Ever tried parsing an HTML document that didn't close all its tag properly and didn't follow any strict standards? I have and it's a nightmare.

Just like 99% of all coding languages, you have to close code blocks that you opened, with the exception of some one-liners, i.e.:

if (test) DoSomething(); else DomeSomethingElse();

(I won't go out on a limb and say 100%, just because you might throw it back at me with some obscure language at me that DOES allow you to not close code blocks)

 

[icyrus]

Google a bit, I'm sure you're capable, Google a bit.

I am sure I could.

Seriously though, closing your tags is just good practice. You then know where a tag should start and end and parsing text through e.g. Regex is much easier. Ever tried parsing an HTML document that didn't close all its tag properly and didn't follow any strict standards? I have and it's a nightmare.

Sure, but what does that have to do with XHTML? HTML4 already covers that, but stops short of pointless closing tags that add nothing.

 

[FarligOpptreden]

I am sure I could.

Looks like you missed the sarcasm in that one...

Sure, but what does that have to do with XHTML? HTML4 already covers that, but stops short of pointless closing tags that add nothing.

Maybe you misread my reply... With XHTML you are forced to close every single tag, which aids in Regex matching, because you expect to find a closing tag to every single opening tag. With HTML4 you aren't forced to close certain tags, which might make Regex matching slightly trickier.

 

[FarligOpptreden]

You talking about Microsoft FxCop?

FxCop =

 

[Raithlin]

Gentlemen, if I may, please check this comic strip which deals with this exact issue (XHTML is dead?). Seriously. No laughs.

 

[Veroland]

Man, I have extensive experience in all those areas and those acronyms are my passion, but unfortunately I am settled in a good job right now. Good luck in finding your candidate though!

Do you have any idea how hard it is to find people with this kind of skills in this country?

XHTML is dead. It would be better to use meaningful standards.

Jees, I didn't want to start a flame war here. We have a requirement that we need to support almost all browsers and if you say xhtml is dead maybe you should go look what is actually happening in the real world

 

[FarligOpptreden]

Gentlemen, if I may, please check this comic strip which deals with this exact issue (XHTML is dead?). Seriously. No laughs.

Feels a bit "tract"able...

Do you have any idea how hard it is to find people with this kind of skills in this country?

Yes, sadly I do. We're also looking for a few skilled people (well, ONE, at least)! Maybe I should go out on a consulting basis and make tons of money...

:erm:

 

[Raithlin]

Do you have any idea how hard it is to find people with this kind of skills in this country?

Funny how there seem to be quite a few hanging around on this very same forum. Who would'a thunk. :0

I'm happy where I am, thanks - for the moment, anyway.

 

[icyrus]

Jees, I didn't want to start a flame war here.

Forgive me, I was unnecessarily glib.

We have a requirement that we need to support almost all browsers and if you say xhtml is dead maybe you should go look what is actually happening in the real world

I am quite sure that in the real world you are not serving your XHTML content with the XHTML doctype.

 

[Raithlin]

Sadly, I think it was the lack of (proper) browser support that made XHTML difficult to use properly. I use HTML4.01 strict simply because I know browsers handle it in a fashion I can code for - most similarly, anyhow. Yes, browsers support XHTML, but our dear friend IE doesn't handle it the way you'd expect, and Firefox goes off in the other direction (rightly so, but still...). I'm looking forward to using HTML5 though.

 

[FarligOpptreden]

I'm looking forward to using HTML5 though.

...and the sleepless nights trying to debug the display issues your markup will give in IE6.

 

[Raithlin]

...and the sleepless nights trying to debug the display issues your markup will give in IE6.

No, I'll just use the Universal Internet Explorer 6 CSS...

 

[Veroland]

I am quite sure that in the real world you are not serving your XHTML content with the XHTML doctype.

Don't ask me, I'm the backend services guy, if I can avoid any presentation logic I'm happy.

Sadly, I think it was the lack of (proper) browser support that made XHTML difficult to use properly. I use HTML4.01 strict simply because I know browsers handle it in a fashion I can code for - most similarly, anyhow. Yes, browsers support XHTML, but our dear friend IE doesn't handle it the way you'd expect, and Firefox goes off in the other direction (rightly so, but still...). I'm looking forward to using HTML5 though.

I read the "How should you read this specification" part of the HTML5 spec, it was very funny.


More seriously now, the technology we are using has got a nice JavaScript engine which tries to handle the cross browser support (client side) and in there is where some of the big css, tld etc. knowledge needs to come in.

The framework we are using converts xml to xhtml using xslt's if you want to know where the requirement comes from.

BTW, I saw some very funky things that has been done in jQuery today, looks like everything our chosen front end framework can do anyway, except maybe the portal and cross portlets/gadgets communication and event driven models.

 

[Veroland]

Funny how there seem to be quite a few hanging around on this very same forum. Who would'a thunk. :0

I'm happy where I am, thanks - for the moment, anyway.

But it seems they are all happy where they are

 

[FarligOpptreden]

The framework we are using converts xml to xhtml using xslt's if you want to know where the requirement comes from.

XML + XSLT => XHTML FTW!