So you're a raiding rogue ...

V

Voicysaurous

Expert Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2008
Messages
1,204
Reaction score
0
Location
Slummies
So you're lvl 80 and enjoying the raiding scene in Naxx + heroics...

Question 1:

  • Do you still stick to the old classic Combat Swords or have you tried out the mutilate daggers route yet?

I'm combat daggers atm which is performing dismally on the DPS charts. Only 1600dps atm >.< which is awful considering I have enchanted all 6 epics that I currently have.

Question 2:

  • For the new mutilate build, do you prefer 2 fast weapons for poison procs or slower ones for top end damage?
I'm currently sitting with Titansteel Shanker (1.6) in my MH & Librarian's Paper Cutter 1.3) in my OH.

Some say having two paper cutters (1.3) is actually better than using my epic (1.6) in my MH simply due to the procs. What do you guys reckon?

Question 3:
  • I've never specced Assassination before, so which rotation would you mostly use in boss fights?

Apparently it's better to spam mutilate for CP's instead of backstab, while obviously having rupture and S&D on as much as possible.
 
Hi Voicy,

I can't help you with level 80 stuff, I only have level 70 knowledge and the is worth nothing in WoTLK :o I do know that Shiv and Evinom(SP) will be your best friend.

Wish I could have been of more help
 
After reading up on wowhead forums (dont have a couple hours to spend soaking up EJ maths),

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Eonar&n=Aziros (for the build)

The build can be tampered a bit, Naxx is undead, Murder doesn't work, and can be replaced with Quick Recovery/Fleet footed, whereas for the Dragons, murder can be handy.

The common conception with Muti gearing is, fast/fast = more crits = more Focused Attacks (talent that gives 2 energy when you crit) = more poison = more envenom, while slowly moving up to 1.8/1.8 speed weaps as your haste rating improves and your weap dps gets higher.

~there appears to be a Assassination bug where you offhand procs twice, so instant is whats being used on the OH~
 
Last edited:
Optioncarduser said:
70 Muti rogue here, slower daggers the better, as they do more Muti damage. Faster poison procs arent really an issue, since haste comes into play for rogues.

As Pitbull said, shiv is great, instant poison proc to refresh the stack and Envenom instead of Evis can be better in certain fights (its nature damage instead of physical) . Hunger for blood is interesting, I've seen some rogues stack it 3 times before a fight, and others than keep it up during the fight

I'm not too sure about the 80 stuff though, I might be wrong.
Click to expand...

Ye the 70 build differs quite a bit from the 80 according to wowhead / shadowpanther forums.

Most open up with hunger stacked 3 times then spam mutilate etc. According to them, poisons scaling with AP etc. have become so potent lately that it's more viable using fast daggers now.

I'll have to do a lot more reading though, but I'm keen to try out assassination. I'll miss killing spree, but it'll be nice to try a different tree. I know I thoroughly enjoyed subtlety after I hit 70.
 
Voicysaurous said:
Ye the 70 build differs quite a bit from the 80 according to wowhead / shadowpanther forums.

Most open up with hunger stacked 3 times then spam mutilate etc. According to them, poisons scaling with AP etc. have become so potent lately that it's more viable using fast daggers now.

I'll have to do a lot more reading though, but I'm keen to try out assassination. I'll miss killing spree, but it'll be nice to try a different tree. I know I thoroughly enjoyed subtlety after I hit 70.
Click to expand...

/pees on voicy, redid my post :p
 
Pitbull said:
Hi Voicy,

I can't help you with level 80 stuff, I only have level 70 knowledge and the is worth nothing in WoTLK :o I do know that Shiv and Evinom(SP) will be your best friend.

Wish I could have been of more help
Click to expand...

Actually thats a hug misconception. Shiv/Envenom spam only worked at low gear levels at 70.
At 80 it's complete rubbish.
 
Optioncarduser said:
After reading up on wowhead forums (dont have a couple hours to spend soaking up EJ maths),

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-talents.xml?r=Eonar&n=Aziros (for the build)

The build can be tampered a bit, Naxx is undead, Murder doesn't work, and can be replaced with Quick Recovery/Fleet footed, whereas for the Dragons, murder can be handy.

The common conception with Muti gearing is, fast/fast = more crits = more Focused Attacks (talent that gives 2 energy when you crit) = more poison = more envenom, while slowly moving up to 1.8/1.8 speed weaps as your haste rating improves and your weap dps gets higher.

~there appears to be a Assassination bug where you offhand procs twice, so instant is whats being used on the OH~
Click to expand...

ORSM!

Now the thing with poisons ... My titansteel shanker is a 1.6 speed and although the paper cutter has haste in the 40s, the shanker has 15dps more and 106 Attack power stats to its advantage.

I've pulled some spreadsheets last night to see which works better, but since i was offline I couldnt really get all the stats info correct.

The cool thing is, performance spreadsheets is the new boss key. When u're busy with an excel sheet and your boss walks in - he loves that you're hard at work. (improving your char to pwn other bosses :D)
 
TheShogun said:
Actually thats a hug misconception. Shiv/Envenom spam only worked at low gear levels at 70.
At 80 it's complete rubbish.
Click to expand...

So applying poisons at a rapid pase with massive Envenom crits dissapeared between level 70 and 80 ? :confused: The same was said at level 70 that those suck in relation to SS and Evi. But I did the numbers myself and it was pretty massive :)

I recall a thread about the in here somewhere...
 
Voicysaurous said:
The cool thing is, performance spreadsheets is the new boss key. When u're busy with an excel sheet and your boss walks in - he loves that you're hard at work. (improving your char to pwn other bosses :D)
Click to expand...

Rogues are the only 1s with proper spreadsheets that ive seen :p
 
Voicy, have you hit your hit cap yet?

my combat sword rogue friend only did 1,2k dps in heroics, he then hit capped and started 1,8k
 
Optioncarduser said:
Voicy, have you hit your hit cap yet?

my combat sword rogue friend only did 1,2k dps in heroics, he then hit capped and started 1,8k
Click to expand...

My hit rating is absolutely pathetic.

With my lvl 70 gear my hit rating was on 150 or so ... I'm back down to 90 now :/

My low dps is due to using sinister strike with daggers, which is a one way ticket on the failtrain.

I'll have a look at the builds in the sites i mentioned and let you guys know if I see an unbuffed improvement.
 
Here is an awesome video for you voicy, and it shows my Envenom argument a little. There is still not clear indication even at level 80 which is better. It's all dependant on your play style and rotations.

http://roguerogue.com/?p=78

This is a great Mutilate cycle video and even this guy says Envenom > Eviscerate

Envenom vs Eviscerate is still something that isn’t defnite. I personally feel envenom is superior but if you are adamant about using eviscerate, the guide still applies in the same way. Simply sub out envenom for eviscerate. As well, if you are forced to refresh slice and dice and don’t have many deadly stacks, you should be eviscerating. This should occur rarely.
Click to expand...

Hope it helps
 
Voicysaurous said:
My hit rating is absolutely pathetic.

With my lvl 70 gear my hit rating was on 150 or so ... I'm back down to 90 now :/

My low dps is due to using sinister strike with daggers, which is a one way ticket on the failtrain.

I'll have a look at the builds in the sites i mentioned and let you guys know if I see an unbuffed improvement.
Click to expand...

As a rogue I noticed that this was the most important stat. It pushed my DPS way up there once I stacked on +hit instead of more agillity. Getting the right balance is the key.
 
Last edited:
Voicysaurous said:
My hit rating is absolutely pathetic.

With my lvl 70 gear my hit rating was on 150 or so ... I'm back down to 90 now :/

My low dps is due to using sinister strike with daggers, which is a one way ticket on the failtrain.

I'll have a look at the builds in the sites i mentioned and let you guys know if I see an unbuffed improvement.
Click to expand...

Slacker, get more +hit or TBO will hunt you in your sleep :mad: at least 300
 
Optioncarduser said:
Slacker, get more +hit or TBO will hunt you in your sleep :mad: at least 300
Click to expand...

Dude, I've only been 80 for a few days.

This is what my gear & stats looks like atm ... I've tried to socket as much hit rating gems as possible, but blue slots suck for that. I wish I had more yellow ones.

I know hit cap is very important, since a missed shot with all the attack power in the world still does 0 damage.
 
Voicysaurous said:
I've tried to socket as much hit rating gems as possible, but blue slots suck for that. I wish I had more yellow ones.
Click to expand...

So ignore a few blue sockets, you only need 2 blue gems for the +agi meta gem, I put a +16hit in the same necklace you've got
 
Pitbull said:
So applying poisons at a rapid pase with massive Envenom crits dissapeared between level 70 and 80 ? :confused: The same was said at level 70 that those suck in relation to SS and Evi. But I did the numbers myself and it was pretty massive :)

I recall a thread about the in here somewhere...
Click to expand...

It died at 70 already. By the higher gear levels Combat Swords fast outpaced any other Raiding Rogue spec, especially after Hemo got nerfed.

The DPS increase from Instant Poison procs wasn't very high and once you've got a 5x Stack of Deadly applying it again does basically nothing.

Also, poisons did not scale at all so a 70 in greens might find that the spam Shiv/Envenom does better dps but as your gear scaled Rupture become a much better finishing move.

*Edit* Any Rogue finishing with Evicerate at 70 is a nub. Evic gets mitigated by Armour and Rupture doesn't. SnD > Rupture > *
 
Last edited:
Voicysaurous said:
explain ?
Click to expand...

Any color gem can go in any socket, you dont always need to have a blue gem in a blue socket, least not if the socket bonus is worth it

Edit, didnt see you've already socketed your gems.

Try aim at upgrading your chest for a http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37165 in the mean time,
Get http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=44488 on your gloves asap, or save up badges for the t7 gloves,
and another heroic item with HR worth acquiring : http://www.wowhead.com/?item=37685
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top
Sign up to the MyBroadband newsletter
X