Legal warning for anti-vaxxers in South Africa

I know one anti-vaxer who took a flight with a sick kid.... guess what the kid had? Measles. Flying germ cesspool and you do that.

Regarding school addmisssion, AFAIK , KZN schools require proof of vacination to attend public schools. KZN also has pretty decent free clinics for vacs ( in particular because we used to be major TB I think ) so they would likely offer remediation to the parents if needed get up to date.

Private schools I'm aware of locally ask for the same.
 
Im almost all cases, would be really, really, tricky to prove who actually infected someone.

We live in an ocean of germs. "So-and-so infected me" is almost impossible to back up with evidence. Are we claiming feelings and proximity suffice as evidence?

For the record - I have no issue with vaccination. Before the reee kicks in
 
Progenix Oj101 said:
I see no logical reason to refuse a vaccine with multiple generations of prior use behind them. The only one I took issue with was the Covid vaccine, due to how rushed it was. Each of the normal testing phases for a vaccine normally takes much longer than the Covid vaccine took from inception to public use.
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Yep, most so called anti-vaxers are just anti-the new abuses that have surfaced with the industry.. and plenty of other abuses.

But when it comes to ordinary vaxing now, have to admit there's some doubts about authority itself these days - half the world seems to have gone crooked.
Will take under advisement (fortunately don't have kids).

@neoprema , would be interested to hear the take on this from the other side of the fence....
 
Progenix Oj101 said:
I see no logical reason to refuse a vaccine with multiple generations of prior use behind them. The only one I took issue with was the Covid vaccine, due to how rushed it was. Each of the normal testing phases for a vaccine normally takes much longer than the Covid vaccine took from inception to public use.
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Technically it wasn't rushed either, SARs had been around a long time already, so they just continued from that
 
Progenix Oj101 said:
I see no logical reason to refuse a vaccine with multiple generations of prior use behind them. The only one I took issue with was the Covid vaccine, due to how rushed it was. Each of the normal testing phases for a vaccine normally takes much longer than the Covid vaccine took from inception to public use.
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Same. Some of the vaccines on the government provided list I would say is almost non-negotiable. Meningitis ( specifically pneumococcal) I would consider one of those, along with mumps, chicken pox and measles (although mumps and chicken pox are not government provided / subsidized which I find strange)
 
I would say go with whatever was vaccinated before 2020, but under more careful licensing. Anything new needs examining by a new order of civil group monitoring.
 
rustypup said:
Nobody mentions tetanus. Something which should be kept up to date. Post exposure is far less effecitve than pre-

...and tetanus is an absolute bastich
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It's actually the first injection given at 6 weeks but I do agree that people don't tend to keep up with the boosters, I know I havent
 
Brian_G said:
Yep, most so called anti-vaxers are just anti-the new abuses that have surfaced with the industry.. and plenty of other abuses.

But when it comes to ordinary vaxing now, have to admit there's some doubts about authority itself these days - half the world seems to have gone crooked.
Will take under advisement (fortunately don't have kids).

@neoprema , would be interested to hear the take on this from the other side of the fence....
Click to expand...
I don't deny the vaccine was rushed - i mean it definitely did not have anywhere near the research that something like Polio or Smallpox had. But it was written-off to the fact of trying to stop people dying from COVID. Which now also is more of a 60% truth than a 100% one. There's people who survived COVID-19 with no vaccine, there's people who survived it with the vaccine and there's people who died without the vaccine.

I think the problem was less to do with viruses and vaccines and more to do with government interference, corporate greed and people's agendas. Because that blurred the line a lot between what COVID was, and what it landed up becoming. I still am a firm believe that mRNA vaccines have a lot of value, but we made a LOT of mistakes with how COVID-19 was handled. What I would NOT do , is use that to reason refuse the critical vaccines like Polio and Smallpox because those clearly did their jobs. As for the flu vaccine - i've had mixed results. Last year i didn't do much for me. This year i've had it and people around me have have everything from swine flu to flu to colds and i've picked-up nothing so far...
 
rustypup said:
Im almost all cases, would be really, really, tricky to prove who actually infected someone.

We live in an ocean of germs. "So-and-so infected me" is almost impossible to back up with evidence. Are we claiming feelings and proximity suffice as evidence?

For the record - I have no issue with vaccination. Before the reee kicks in
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Well yes and no. We had a couple who are acquaintances. We were over for a braai one day and thier one child was sick. We paid it no mind because , you now that was pretty normal with our kids. Fast forward a week and the wife is unwell with swelling, goes to the doc and lo! She got mumps...at over 40.

Now I won' lie that this freaked me out a bit as mumps at adult age for men is quite dangerous. She recovered fine and we isolated for a week but our boys and I never caught it. She was also coming off a severe bout of flu from before so we reckon her system was pretty.

We mentioned to the other couple how strange it was to catch a child disease as a adult and wondered where she picked it up. They then told us that their sick child actually had mumps and didn't believe in vaccines but "Oh no, you could have never got it from him".
 
neoprema said:
I still am a firm believe that mRNA vaccines have a lot of value, but we made a LOT of mistakes with how COVID-19 was handled.
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About as safe / dangerous as AI, I guess we have to live with the times.

neoprema said:
As for the flu vaccine - i've had mixed results. Last year i didn't do much for me. This year i've had it and people around me have have everything from swine flu to flu to colds and i've picked-up nothing so far...
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I'm a firm believer in natural immunity here, where individually possible. Some need the boost though, and some flu's are quite bad. Maybe as I get older...
 
Kosmik said:
We were over for a braai one day and thier one child was sick.
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Problem remains. Being symptomatic does not guarantee anything.

Most infected persons will not present as symptomatic whilst at the same time being perfectly capable of infecting others.
 
Progenix Oj101 said:
I see no logical reason to refuse a vaccine with multiple generations of prior use behind them. The only one I took issue with was the Covid vaccine, due to how rushed it was. Each of the normal testing phases for a vaccine normally takes much longer than the Covid vaccine took from inception to public use.
Click to expand...
It sucked, kinda was forced to take it due to travel. Wtf spend R30/40k locked in a hotel or get the jab. Some serious dodgy questions why and how covid was handled. Anyway
 
Brian_G said:
I'm a firm believer in natural immunity here
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The point is to prime the immune system to respond to invaders that you haven't enountered for a while, if ever.

When you had a small number of pathogens in a small community, this worked. You enjoyed regular exposure and, aside from other influences, the immune system did its job. Our immune system is a generalist and is easily defeated by evolving just fast enough to present a different protein profile.

Given how connected our world is, the "rely on natural immunity" thing has not been a viable solution for some time now.
 
neoprema said:
I don't deny the vaccine was rushed - i mean it definitely did not have anywhere near the research that something like Polio or Smallpox had.
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To be fair Polio's clinical trials were the largest ever performed for a vaccine. 2 millions kids. It's unlikely that a vaccine study on that scale will ever be undertaken again.

Nobody can reasonably expect any vaccine to have research on the scale Polio had.
 
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