2004 ICASA complaint

lewstherin · Mar 17, 2004

The Telkom reply is typical arrogance...I just hope ICASA can cut them down to size [B)]

As far as Telkom's motto...grr don't even get me started on that...everytime I see "Touch Tomorrow" my blood starts to boil at the sheer ignorance of that [

!]

Telkom needs a leash, ICASA needs some guts, and the SA consumer needs to make it happen

reech · Mar 17, 2004

Would it be worth mentioning that if a ZA adsl user used the service at full download speed for 24 hours they would be capped (and thats no even using upstream bandwidth)- so telkom is essentially overcharging customers for on a monthly basis for a days' worth of connectivity at full speed?

512kbps x 60secs x 60 mins x 24 h = 44236800 bits = 5.1498GB

Mux · Mar 17, 2004

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by reech
 Would it be worth mentioning that if a ZA adsl user used the service at full download speed for 24 hours they would be capped (and thats no even using upstream bandwidth)- so telkom is essentially overcharging customers for on a monthly basis for a days' worth of connectivity at full speed?

512kbps x 60secs x 60 mins x 24 h = 44236800 bits = 5.1498GB
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Very good way of looking at it. You get 512kbs, you are just not allowed to use it to it full potential for even 1 day of the month?

I also have a problem with the mixed-up way Telkom references line rental and bandwidth costs. Surely the bandwidth (3GB) should be an ISP issue and the line rental of R680 has nothing to do with it as additional 3GB can be bought by getting another ISP account. Why is it that the same line that is used for ADSL is shared with your normal telephone line AND charged for rental again?

You don't know what you don't know.
Mux

BTTB · Mar 17, 2004

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Why is it that the same line that is used for ADSL is shared with your normal telephone line AND charged for rental again?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Good point.
Double Rental? To think that my ISDN connection used the exact same line that my ADSL uses and that cost under R200. And then I paid MWeb R179, my ISP. Now I pay MWeb R300 odd plus R680.00 for rental of the same line I used for ISDN. Plus I am limited to download 3 gigs on ADSL whereas I could get 1 gig over a weekend on 64Kb ISDN alone. You do the maths. Ok there are also call charges on ISDN. But the total bill was about R500 to R700 for ISDN per month.
Hence taking my account in perspective if Telkom used it as a example. It would be hardly a inspiration for someone on ISDN or 56K to migrate to ADSL. It’s too expensive for one and when capped becomes completely useless for International browsing.
While Telkom embraces ISDN, the rest of the world has forgotten what it is or even knew it existed. ISDN is a lovely way to exploit someone on a dial up for metered billing. The buggers know it, but do nothing.
And I’m shocked that the average user in SA can’t see it either. What’s the point of flogging old technology? It’s just holding the country back.

<hr noshade size="1">You can take Telkom out of the Post Office but you can't take the Post Office out of Telkom.

doekvoet · Mar 18, 2004

Well - on the last day of the month I have proved that running at full capacity I can download 3Gig in around 16 - 17 hours - good point - I can reach my limit in less than 1/30 of the time the bandwidth is supposed to last, and after that the service is rendered useless for international traffic.

VQuest · Mar 18, 2004

My thought exactly. What is the point in having the speed if you're ultimately not allowed to use it? Doesn't make much sense.

----------------
United we stand!
----------------

microfast · Mar 18, 2004

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by VQuest
 My thought exactly...<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

In essence :

Telkom justify the Telkom adsl line rental due to "increased frequency",
but Telkom does not provide any increased frequency,
in fact 3GB Telkom adsl provides a decreased frequency.

Over a one month period 3GB Telkom adsl cannot achieve the frequency of ISDN or even 56K dial-up.

Further, 3GB/month telkom adsl costs Telkom less than 3GB 56K dial-up.

When one looks at ADSL costs elsewhere, it is cheap not because of cheaper international bandwidth,
it is cheap because ADSL is a much cheaper technology for telcos to operate.

Not a single Telco in the world uses Telkom's argument to charge a fixed line rental to cover "increased frequency".

Telkom has taken full advantage of cheap ADSL technology,
crippled it into Telkom adsl and pulled the wool over ICASA eyes.

Something tells me that ICASA has seen the light.

VQuest · Mar 18, 2004

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Something tells me that ICASA has seen the light.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

Oh boy, I certainly hope so. Although I'm not holding my breath.

----------------
United we stand!
----------------

BTTB · Mar 18, 2004

What RPM could do to prove this point to ICASA is the following.
Get someone on ISDN with R7 call plan to do 1 week or 1 month Usage Statistics. Perhaps people within different ISP's have usage statistics for ISDN or even 56k clients. Now see what someone on ISDN can download in a month and the cost of that service. You will quickly be able to prove to ICASA that a mere 56k or ISDN customer not only can get his service cheaper, but also can download non-stop during his on line time and during this period the usage level will outstrip 3 gigs by far.

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Telkom has taken full advantage of cheap ADSL technology,
crippled it into Telkom adsl and pulled the wool over ICASA eyes.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
And the rest of South Africa.
"Always On". My service at the moment is basically just this. I don’t browse local websites, so I’m just left now to send and receive mail. And ooops, yes I can play CS still which is the single reason I reached the cap in the first place. *scratches head*
It might be 8 times faster than ISDN, but when the cap kicks in, it’s 8 times slower.
Telkom, you guys suck. Thumbs down to you people!

Addendum: Ok guys it’s the 19th and 12 more days to go to the end of the month and my connection has just been capped. Anyone need any typing done? Anyone want me to go run out and buy some milk for them perhaps? You need any help RPM? Unless you give me something to do, I’m going to spend the rest of the month writing letters on MyADSL... [

][

]

<hr noshade size="1">You can take Telkom out of the Post Office but you can't take the Post Office out of Telkom.

lewstherin · Mar 19, 2004

I've just had a thought about the whole capping thing - maybe it could be used for the complaint.
Capping is essentially not Telkom's right to impose. It should be imposed by ISPs where they deem necessary, since its their bandwidth being used right?
I mean I could spend the whole day talking on the phone, and I wouldn't be capped.
Whats the difference between that and ADSL usage as far as Telkom's infrastructure goes? Both ways I'm utilising the copper lines continuously...
Telkom's stated reason of keeping abuse under control is no justification for the cap, since abuse will not break their copper network - it will chow the ISPs bandwidth.
Anyhow maybe I'm wrong here, but thought I'd add my thoughts [8D]

By the way what is happening with the complaint RPM?

Telkom needs a leash, ICASA needs some guts, and the SA consumer needs to make it happen

BTTB · Mar 19, 2004

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">By the way what is happening with the complaint RPM?<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

When is the hearing again?

<hr noshade size="1">You can take Telkom out of the Post Office but you can't take the Post Office out of Telkom.

Mean_Monster · Mar 19, 2004

good argument lewstherin and BTTB [

]

I have seen that a lot o people back this thing with regards to the line cost and the cap. The capping (if any) should really be on the ISP side as that is where your traffic starts going International.[V]

neobyte · Mar 19, 2004

It is the good point to raise about the fact that Telkom is imposes the 3GB cap yet it is the ISPs domain... Surely if an ISP is making enough money there is no need for the cap. Or even charge a surpluss to cover such additional costs.

Perdition · Mar 19, 2004

It isn't the ISPs' bandwidth being used, it is Telkom's. The ISPs merely resell Telkom ADSL accounts, this is why Telkom are able to enforce the 3 gig cap and the ISPs aren't able to do much about it.

Decembermaloy · Mar 21, 2004

Telkom cannot afford to make adsl unlimited bandwidth because they depend on revenue from their diginet networks. If Telkom had made adsl unlimited then they would go bankrupt as users would use their adsl to make calls (voice over IP/voice over network). Most of their revenue comes from the hiring of their diginet services and when you make a call or connect to the internet that too brings in money for them. So it will be a while still before Telkom changes their ways. Looks like they cooked up new scheme : overcharging for local calls. It's such a pity that they take us users for granted, and that will be their downfall...

antowan · Mar 21, 2004

I couldn’t agree more. As soon as a new operator comes in, Telkom will have to shed its current management and change its name because people will still connect the name and the people behind it with the communication rape that took place in this country over the years. Just because it is a monopoly, doesn’t mean it should behave like one! It is managed by people after all and in my limited experience of corporate functioning I dare say that those people at the top are the ones who decide the culture and dynamics of the company. Thus Telkom is what the management is as a tiny group of people toying with the lives of millions in this country…

Thus I agree with the administrative clerk at Telkom’s office when she says “don’t blame me, I only work here” and with the technical guy who comes to fix the line when he says, “I have nothing to do with the policies”. BLAME TELKOM’S MANAGEMENT!

I as a member of the public demand their heads on a proverbial platter when the new operator comes in! I will not invest in any company where they might sit as management after the coming Telkom fallout. There WILL be fallout, which is the main reason the government is stalling. It is such a bad situation that when the new operator comes in, Telkom will have to be protected all over again or we will sit with a new monopoly (the new operator) because people will be switching over by the thousands leaving Telkom in the cold.

These people in Telkom’s management have shown what they think of us, the consumers and ordinary people of South Africa and with or without ICASA should be held accountable for the rest of their natural lives. They should never be allowed to hold management positions in any company ever again! They should be named and appropriately shamed…

Cheers
Antowan

He who does not understand the value of war at the right time, cannot comprehend the value of life at any time - Anonymous

BTTB · Mar 21, 2004

Well said and ditto to that.

<hr noshade size="1">You can take Telkom out of the Post Office but you can't take the Post Office out of Telkom.

SK33T · Mar 21, 2004

Well anyways I printed a logo ironed it on a T-shirt and proudly wearing it.
http://www.myadsl.co.za/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1709

I think many more of us should do it.

Myke · Mar 21, 2004

Thanks BTTB for telling me about this forum. As I'm new here, I'm not sure if anyone has bitched yet about bandwidth being stolen but last month my account capped out on the 9th after someone stole more than 1 GB - supposedly uploaded by myself on two days! Needless to say, SAIX was unable to give me details of these uploads for the particular days I moaned about and I had wiped out the logs not realizing how important they were but thinking that my slowdown was a problem with my PC and therefore clearing out temp and junk files! Why they don't warn a subscriber that he is reaching his limit or has reached it is so utterly shoddy and disgraceful!
The slow bandwidth afterwards is disgusting to say the least! If I hadn't had a friend with a load of spare bandwidth, I would have been totally screwed for the month!
What are the catches, if any, with Sentech's satellite service? I can't wait to move over. (I'm in Kaapstad so it's still about to be launched here).

Myke Ashley-Cooper
eCartoonist

Perdition · Mar 21, 2004

Myke, everything has been bitched about when it comes to Telkom [

] however this should not prevent one voicing their experience. Telkom keep saying there are only "a disgruntled few" when it comes to ADSL, the more who publicly voice their bad experience the more it disproves Telkom's stance.

Oh and welcome to the forum [

]

Join the MyBroadband community

Get started

2004 ICASA complaint

Senior Member

Expert Member

Senior Member

Executive Member

Well-Known Member

Expert Member

Well-Known Member

Expert Member

Executive Member

Senior Member

Executive Member

Senior Member

Well-Known Member

Expert Member

Active Member

Honorary Master

Executive Member

Well-Known Member

New Member

Expert Member