2009 Belgian Formula One Grand Prix

[Willie Trombone]

OMW Fisi is rocking right now. On the harder compound I wonder if he can pwn kimi? Kimi is driving a blinder too although i would have guessed ferrari could hold off force india

Vettel is going to be thrilled with the results so far. He is on a charge now - if he can catch the front runners before it's all over we will see fireworks of note!

 

[.Matthew]

Good race

 

[Stokstert]

Hehe, Kimi enjoyed that bottle of champagne!

 

[BigAl-sa]

Hehe, Kimi enjoyed that bottle of champagne!

Relief for him I reckon - if it wasn't for KERS, I doubt whether he'd have made 3rd!

 

[Willie Trombone]

What are the rules re: overtaking while off the track? Am I mistaken or did Kimi make up some places off the track today?

 

[BigAl-sa]

What are the rules re: overtaking while off the track? Am I mistaken or did Kimi make up some places off the track today?

I also thought that when I saw the replay of the 1st corner.

 

[Willie Trombone]

I also thought that when I saw the replay of the 1st corner.

Ironically he was gifted points courtesy of the FIA at this track for a similar move by Hamilton in the past. Then for the rest of the year everyone was freaking out about tyres over curbs. I wonder if the FIA have changed the rules or just turned a blind eye in the interest of racing.

 

[milomak]

in previous season's the run off area has been part of the track. has this changed?

 

[Willie Trombone]

in previous season's the run off area has been part of the track. has this changed?

Yeah, not sure... I don't recall that being the case but I also don't recall it not being...

 

[killadoob]

Ironically he was gifted points courtesy of the FIA at this track for a similar move by Hamilton in the past. Then for the rest of the year everyone was freaking out about tyres over curbs. I wonder if the FIA have changed the rules or just turned a blind eye in the interest of racing.

Sorry are you saying hamilton's corner cutting incident and this are the same?

There is a run off area there for a reason guess you do not realize why? MBP did you not used to be a sport writer for F! or something you said, how can you not know why there is a run off area there then?

 

[Willie Trombone]

Sorry are you saying hamilton's corner cutting incident and this are the same?

There is a run off area there for a reason guess you do not realize why? MBP did you not used to be a sport writer for F! or something you said, how can you not know why there is a run off area there then?

The run off area is afaik there for safety and does not constitute part of the race track and is not legal overtaking space (!)
When you think run-off area, think those big polestyrene markers the guys have to weave around if they cut the chicane on a steep corner... The rules are the same. It's not racing line / track.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Run-off_area#Definition

Definition

In motorsports racing there is a concept called the racing line which is defined in lay terms as the optimal path around a race course that will allow the racer to complete a lap in the least possible time with the highest possible average speed. The racing line is a function of the track's layout and the combination of a particular type of racing vehicle's (such as a car versus a motorcycle) capabilities and the physics of motorsports racing.

Because the physics involved in a motorsports event generally propels the racing vehicles along a certain path, and since the racers tend to work with the forces acting on the vehicle and make course changes while not suddenly confronting the forces in play on the vehicle, their locations at certain points along the track can be predicted and their course of travel extrapolated. As a result, in areas where a vehicle is more likely to depart the course (i.e., immediately after a corner as opposed to alongside a straight-away), course designers will place a run-off area.

Design

Run-off areas generally consist of four things:

1. A large, open space.
2. A surface material that acts to rapidly bleed off energy from an out-of-control vehicle that has been forced into the run-off area. Gravel traps are the most commonly used run-off area surface material as they do a good job in slowing off-course vehicles to recoverable speeds, they do minimum damage to the race vehicles, and they act to "soften" the surface of the ground in that area, similar to sand on a beach. Their use during motorcycle races is less frequent because of the risk of gravel ending up on the race course itself, which could be tolerated by cars but could be catastrophic for bikes.
3. A safety device, such as a tire wall or an air fence that safely prevents the vehicle from going beyond the run-off area and into another area or a hard barrier. If a run-off area is sufficiently large, there sometimes will not be a safety barrier as the racer and vehicle will come to a complete stop before they run out of run-off room.
4. The conspicuous absence of any obstructions or dangerous objects in the run-off area, such as an abutment for a nearby bridge, spectator grandstands, billboards, etc., which an out-of-control vehicle might impact.

 

[Stokstert]

Relief for him I reckon - if it wasn't for KERS, I doubt whether he'd have made 3rd!

Yes and Kimi confirmed, that if it wasn't for Kers he wouldn't have won, at the after race interview.

 

[[OUPA]MrNutz]

@ ^^

2008 - 4 cars went that route in first corner...nothing happend from fia.
2009 - 3 cars took that same area - nothing happened so far.

special location , start of race...2 big of an admin job i'd say.

problem lies with fia to sort this one.

 

[Willie Trombone]

I don't think there is a problem with going off the track, it's overtaking while off the track that is illegal.

 

[AirWolf]

Well done to Kimi .

I see Ferrari got first place on both ends of the finishers for the race.

 

[Willie Trombone]

I don't think there is a problem with going off the track, it's overtaking while off the track that is illegal.

It was marginal - seems Kimi went off in fourth and came back on in third by a nose. I for one am glad the FIA has changed its stance on these issues. Last year or the year before there would have been an investigation. Especially if McLaren has gained a place.

 

[killadoob]

No the difference is hamilton cut a corner and there is a vast difference from what happened if you ask me.

You still need to go wide and you do not have that much of an advantage doing what kimi did, where as what hamilton did was different not to mention mclaren knew if you cut a corner you must not over take, yet they did. So they got caught out because sometimes mclaren do not seem to understand the laws of f1, then bitch how there is a witch hunt. Pretty much the same as mclaren thinking the FIA were out to get them when they stole ferrari's info.

 

[Willie Trombone]

No the difference is hamilton cut a corner and there is a vast difference from what happened if you ask me.

If you are going by feel there is, if you are using the rules there is no difference.

You still need to go wide and you do not have that much of an advantage doing what kimi did, where as what hamilton did was different not to mention mclaren knew if you cut a corner you must not over take, yet they did. So they got caught out because sometimes mclaren do not seem to understand the laws of f1, then bitch how there is a witch hunt. Pretty much the same as mclaren thinking the FIA were out to get them when they stole ferrari's info.

Kimi had no traffic in the runoff area and could put foot, the others couldn't. Don't think you can say he had no advantage. Ferrari fanbois need to get over Macca doing the dirty on them, it's history Sour grapes is what keeps bringing it back.

 

[killadoob]

Yea but then the macca boys should stop going on about how the rules are different for them, if you bend the rules and get nailed you cannot complain.

Kimi is not the only person to do that, i have seen many people go wide and use that route with no penalty so i am not sure why it is suddenly an issue, i could say if hamilton did it the macca boys would be saying it is just fine but that leads nowhere.

 

[milomak]

Kimi is not the only person to do that, i have seen many people go wide and use that route with no penalty so i am not sure why it is suddenly an issue, i could say if hamilton did it the macca boys would be saying it is just fine but that leads nowhere.

I looked at some youtube footage of Spa (I think in 2006) and the run-off area is part of the track. In 2009 the run-off area is [n]NOT[/b] part of the track. Now I have no idea when this changed so it is important to keep that in mind when using past races as a reference.

Stolen word for word from another forum:

If you look at this picture - what position is Kimi in here as he leaves the race track?

I would go as far to say he's fifth, yet rejoins in third?

And for reference, the sporting code:

c) The race track alone shall be used by the drivers during the race. Drivers must use the track at all times. For the avoidance of doubt:
- the white lines defining the track edges are considered to be part of the track but the kerbs are not, and ;
- a driver will be judged to have left the track if no part of the car remains in contact with the track.

Should a car leave the track for any reason, and without prejudice to 2(d) below, the driver may rejoin.

However, this may only be done when it is safe to do so and without gaining any advantage.