ANC shrugs off warning on risks to SA mining

[BBSA]

http://www.fin24.com/Economy/ANC-told-ignore-ratings-advice-report-20121206

The ANC will ignore ratings company advice and will call for an increase in mining taxes, Business Day reported the party's economic policy head as saying.

In the report on Thursday, Enoch Godongwana said the party must ensure that the lives of poor black South Africans improve, or risk giving an opportunity for populist leaders to stir up social unrest and erode the ANC's dominance.

"Unless we do some radical transformation, we'll create fertile ground for an uncontrollable revolution," Godongwana said.

Moody's Investor Service and Standard & Poor's have downgraded South Africa's debt, citing slower economic growth, after the worst mining strikes since the end of apartheid and political pressure to raise spending.

"We're kind of in a Catch-22 situation because there are people who listen to Moody's, and when we go out there and raise money it becomes expensive," Godongwana said.

"We may take a hit. We've got to make a choice: do we please Standard and Poor's and Moody's, or do we deal with the kind of constituencies we are facing? We're walking that tightrope."

While Godongwana ruled out the ANC conference agreeing to any form of mine nationalisation, he said increased taxes on mining were possible.

These idiots is going to kill our mines

 

[DJ...]

"Unless we do some radical transformation, we'll create fertile ground for an uncontrollable revolution," Godongwana said.

And now we know why they instigated the recent violence.

But someone is going to have to explain to me how increasing taxation on mining companies will benefit the mining company workers in any tangible way. It simply won't...

"We're kind of in a Catch-22 situation because there are people who listen to Moody's, and when we go out there and raise money it becomes expensive," Godongwana said.

Oh shame. That's how the economy works, you fscking moron. You cannot simply dismiss it because you don't like it...

 

[DJ...]

These idiots is going to kill our mines

This has been their plan all along. To diminish value in the sector to the point that they take it over. There was no way for them to compete with the private sector so they have chosen instead to destroy it...

 

[AlphaBravo]

Sensitive subject, shareholder value vs. paying the miners great salaries to keep production going. Is this the tight rope he talks about?

Capitalism is great and works but feeds greed. Maybe tax the mine more and the miners less to balance things out?

 

[Sinbad]

tinfoilhat-wearing version of me says the ANC wants mining companies to collapse so they can "nashunalies" them with minimal compensation to shareholders.

 

[BBSA]

Sensitive subject, shareholder value vs. paying the miners great salaries to keep production going. Is this the tight rope he talks about?

Capitalism is great and works but feeds greed. Maybe tax the mine more and the miners less to balance things out?

I do not think the miners ears that badly, the problem is that government does not use the taxes it receives to uplift their living conditions.

Killing the mines is not going to help anybody, in fact it is just going to make the situation much worse.

 

[DJ...]

Sensitive subject, shareholder value vs. paying the miners great salaries to keep production going. Is this the tight rope he talks about?

Nothing about their plan to tax companies more will result in higher wages to workers. Quite the contrary, in fact. And BHP, Anglos, Goldfields etc are all slowly pulling out of SA because (largely) to this sabotage that the government is perpetuating...

 

[DJ...]

tinfoilhat-wearing version of me says the ANC wants mining companies to collapse so they can "nashunalies" them with minimal compensation to shareholders.

Nothing tin-foil-hat-wearing about it. They are blatantly sabotaging the industry at every move, from nationalization, to higher taxation, to mining rights and permits issues, to intentional environmental blocks, to attempting to control gold prices with the rand, to inducing violent worker revolts, to supporting factional union unrest etc.

There is nothing subtle about what this government is doing to this sector. Before the resources dry up and become too expensive to mine using conventional methods, they want their share of the pie and they will do whatever it takes to get it...

 

[LazyLion]

It's all part of the master plan. Make the mines unprofitable for now. Buy them up at a fraction of the cost. Profit for the future.

 

[BBSA]

It's all part of the master plan. Make the mines unprofitable for now. Buy them up at a fraction of the cost. Profit for the future.

The only problem is the they will run the mines at a loss and it is going to cost the tax payers billions to keep them operational.

 

[TelkomUseless]

It's all part of the master plan. Make the mines unprofitable for now. Buy them up at a fraction of the cost. Profit for the future.

On the dot!

The only problem is the they will run the mines a a loss and it is going to cost the tax payers billions to keep them operational.

Do you see gowament care about spending our tax money on useless stuff.. ? We'll just be taxed more (e-tolls, higher eletricity prices etc). Sad.. but true. And the masses are too stupid too see whats going on...

 

[DJ...]

The only problem is the they will run the mines a a loss and it is going to cost the tax payers billions to keep them operational.

They will make a profit at first, but they will be uncompetitive in the long run. This is the symptom of SOEs and communism...

 

[w1z4rd]

Capitalism is great and works but feeds greed. Maybe tax the mine more and the miners less to balance things out?

Countries like Austria and Botswana have successfully implemented such schemes and both their currencies are stronger than ours.

I love how people complain about the declining number of mines... as if mines magically spew constant gold to make them sustainable. lol. When the resource is gone its gone people.

 

[w1z4rd]

The only problem is the they will run the mines at a loss and it is going to cost the tax payers billions to keep them operational.

Why would the taxpayers pay to keep them operational I see a tax like australia has, not state capitalism.

 

[Mila]

I feel a lesson coming on.

 

[w1z4rd]

I feel a lesson coming on.

You mean like how gold costs in our expensive mines $900 an ounce to pull out the ground, but it sells for $1690 an ounce? I like that lesson.

 

[Sinbad]

You mean like how gold costs in our expensive mines $900 an ounce to pull out the ground, but it sells for $1690 an ounce? I like that lesson.

You think it will still cost $900 an ounce when every member of Showerhead's extended family gets a position on the board of directors of the company at a salary equivalent to the entire board's current remuneration?

 

[BBSA]

Why would the taxpayers pay to keep them operational I see a tax like australia has, not state capitalism.

You were not following the conversations, I was referring to Gary's comment.

 

[w1z4rd]

You were not following the conversations, I was referring to Gary's comment.

Mmmkay.

 

[w1z4rd]

You think it will still cost $900 an ounce when every member of Showerhead's extended family gets a position on the board of directors of the company at a salary equivalent to the entire board's current remuneration?

I agree, executives and shareholders are fleecing this. However, there is still a **** load of profit to be made even if workers are paid a more fair wage. If those London shareholders cant run a mine at profit with those types profits then perhaps they should make way for someone who can.