Coffin assault trial

[konfab]

I've said repeatedly I think it's an appropriate sentence, Sherlock, great deduction there. I've also pointed out that the majority of SA citizens agree as do all the political parties here.

Can you point me to the referendum, or at least a statistically significant study where you proved this fact?

Fact is that South Africans are a violent lot of people. I would postulate that most South Africans would feel in a similar way towards someone if they were the ones being stolen from.

 

[Craig_]

For all those defending or attacking these guys, they are criminals. They acted wrong, they deserve no more sympathy than any other criminal out there. If it was up to me I would say give ALL criminals the maximum sentence allowed by law. Oscar for example should have gotten at least 25 years, plus many other.

The only thing wrong here I would say is that the Justice department is inconsistent. Those with money get away, others (like these poor sods) that can't afford the best lawyers, get screwed.

 

[Pitbull]

I've said repeatedly I think it's an appropriate sentence, Sherlock, great deduction there. I've also pointed out that the majority of SA citizens agree as do all the political parties here.

You are the one crying about how wrong our justice system is, so don't project that on to me.

You say you are not claiming anything while claiming explicitly that I lack basic understanding of punishment coupled with the law. Claiming that the only 'crime' they committed was hurting someone's feelings. You claimed the sentence was too extreme and condescendingly assert that anyone who disagrees is an idiot and a moron. So don't come now with your "I'm not claiming anything" BS.

See, you doing it again... jumping all over the place.

You want this to go to the SCA. So what if they reduce the sentence to 3 years or even suspend the sentence with community service?
Answer this. No jumping around like a cat on a hot tin roof. Just answer it because you said you want closure from the SCA. Now let's say they apply the law correctly and give the correct sentence which is way lower. What then?

 

[Saber_rider45]

Can you point me to the referendum, or at least a statistically significant study where you proved this fact?

Fact is that South Africans are a violent lot of people. I would postulate that most South Africans would feel in a similar way towards someone if they were the ones being stolen from.

You can only be accountable for your own actions, don't stoop to the level of others.
They made themselves criminals that's the simple fact.

 

[C4Cat]

See, you doing it again... jumping all over the place.

You want this to go to the SCA. So what if they reduce the sentence to 3 years or even suspend the sentence with community service?
Answer this. No jumping around like a cat on a hot tin roof. Just answer it because you said you want closure from the SCA. Now let's say they apply the law [-]correctly[/-] as did the Judge Mphahlele, and give [-]the correct sentence[/-] a different sentence which is way lower. What then?

The reason I want closure from the SCA is so one judge isn't seen as being only responsible for the sentence - if they decide a lower sentence is more appropriate then that's fine - the judges are the experts here (including Judge Mphahlele), and even though they don't always agree, they are in a far better position to judge that either you or me. It's irrelevant that you think the sentence too harsh and it's irrelevant that I think it's appropriate, we need to respect the judgements made by people far more qualified than we are in law, even if we disagree with it.

 

[Ninja'd]

How I imagined it all went down.

 

[ponder]

I've also pointed out that the majority of SA citizens agree as do all the political parties here.

That's irrelevant, courts are not swayed by public opinion and if they were I would be very worried.

 

[Cray]

That's irrelevant, courts are not swayed by public opinion and if they were I would be very worried.

Indeed, if public opinion was a factor gay marriage would still be illegal and the death penalty would be legal.

 

[C4Cat]

That's irrelevant, courts are not swayed by public opinion and if they were I would be very worried.

That wasn't my point though. I was responding to Pitbull who said that anyone who disagrees with him is an idiot and a moron. His words. I was just pointing out that most people disagree with him - I wasn't using that fact to justify the sentence or imply it influenced the judgement

 

[Vrotappel]

For all those defending or attacking these guys, they are criminals. They acted wrong, they deserve no more sympathy than any other criminal out there. If it was up to me I would say give ALL criminals the maximum sentence allowed by law. Oscar for example should have gotten at least 25 years, plus many other.

The only thing wrong here I would say is that the Justice department is inconsistent. Those with money get away, others (like these poor sods) that can't afford the best lawyers, get screwed.

These people got screwed because they are white. There is no running away from that.

 

[C4Cat]

These people got screwed because they are white men who assaulted and attempted to murder an innocent black man in a country with a history of oppression by white people. There is no running away from that.

Yep, people need to know that this despicable behaviour by white racists who think they are still living in the 1980's is not tolerated anymore

You're only giving them your support and complaints about the sentence because they are white. Can't run away from that either

 

[Adrianax]

Yep, people need to know that this despicable behaviour by white racists who think they are still living in the 1980's is not tolerated anymore

You're only giving them your support and complaints about the sentence because they are white. Can't run away from that either

Black racists are not treated the same and feel they cannot be racist because they were discriminated against - most of them probably not born or ever seen or experienced slavery or apartheid. That too is nonsense.

This case is a black oppressive move against white people. End of discussion.

If the SCA does not correct this judgment and sentence then South Africa is - once again - a very dangerous country.

 

[C4Cat]

Black racists are not treated the same and feel they cannot be racist because they were discriminated against - most of them probably not born or ever seen or experienced slavery or apartheid. That too is nonsense.

This case is a black oppressive move against white people. End of discussion.

If the SCA does not correct this judgment and sentence then South Africa is - once again - a very dangerous country.

End of discussion? Cute Adrianax, cute... The days of white Afrikaaners deciding what can and can't be discussed are also over, in case you hadn't noticed...

Most South Africans alive today lived during apartheid, unless they are below the age of 24 so wtf? And even those who are younger still live with the effects of apartheid, all races. Just because you are young and didn't experience it doesn't mean you can discount it or pretend you know what it was about.

 

[Adrianax]

End of discussion? Cute Adrianax, cute... The days of white Afrikaaners deciding what can and can't be discussed are also over, in case you hadn't noticed...

Most South Africans alive today lived during apartheid, unless they are below the age of 24 so wtf? And even those who are younger still live with the effects of apartheid, all races. Just because you are young and didn't experience it doesn't mean you can discount it or pretend you know what it was about.

Feel free to talk about it or live with it as much as you want. You will not find me to be involved in your discussion. If you feel it affected you so bad that you cannot move on, that slavery 300 years ago affected you so bad, then be my guest to go sit in a corner and pity yourself. Don't come crying that there is nothing for you to benefit from, because then I am not interested.

As for me, many of my family members were murdered by the British 118 years ago concentration camps. It affected my family and all generations thereafter badly. But, we got up, moved on and made the best of a bad situation. We are not saying it never happened, but we do not blame our problems on a small thing such as mass murder.

 

[rietrot]

Lol I see the trolls are out in full force defending this incompetent judge just because she is black.

 

[Kloofvreter]

The reason I want closure from the SCA is so one judge isn't seen as being only responsible for the sentence - if they decide a lower sentence is more appropriate then that's fine - the judges are the experts here (including Judge Mphahlele), and even though they don't always agree, they are in a far better position to judge that either you or me. It's irrelevant that you think the sentence too harsh and it's irrelevant that I think it's appropriate, we need to respect the judgements made by people far more qualified than we are in law, even if we disagree with it.

Would you be OK if they overturned the verdict and give them a suspended sentence?

 

[marine1]

This judge is going to get a hiding in the appeal.
At best this was assault common
At worst is was intimidation

 

[C4Cat]

Would you be OK if they overturned the verdict and give them a suspended sentence?

In my personal opinion, no, it would be too lenient and I think it's unlikely to happen. But if it did happen then fine, we move on. The judges are in a better position to make these judgements than me or anyone else her on mybb.

 

[ponder]

That wasn't my point though. I was responding to Pitbull who said that anyone who disagrees with him is an idiot and a moron. His words. I was just pointing out that most people disagree with him - I wasn't using that fact to justify the sentence or imply it influenced the judgement

If 10 people disagreed with me it does not mean they are right by virtue of being the majority, it's very possible for those ten to be wrong and me correct. It does happen.

 

[Kloofvreter]

In my personal opinion, no, it would be too lenient and I think it's unlikely to happen. But if it did happen then fine, we move on. The judges are in a better position to make these judgements than me or anyone else her on mybb.

:crylaugh: