Conservatives and Genetic Fear

some things are left to genes, but what ice cream i am going to eat or what sexual partner i am going to choose has **** all to do with my genes :p
if we're going to say certain people with inferior views have inferior genes, we might as well go back to the whole "my race is superior" stories as it's the same thing

Genes are important and its best you understand them. What you believe about them is irrelevant. Theyre a massive part of who you are.
 
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Genes are important and its best you understand them. What you believe about them is irrelevant. Theyre a massive part of who you are.

no **** :p i understand genes, i just have a different view on them. i can tell you now political affiliations have nothing to do with mental disorders or genes
 
It is simple, Liberalism means 'of freedom', it is a movement that vows for freedom. from this we should devise what freedom would entitle and how we should get it to everybody too. I don't think that it should be considered freedom for someone to be forced to pay for somebody elses bad judgments in life(ala Socialism), freedom simply means that each person is due their own property in life, no body else's, else it means complete anarchy, and if not so well then it is not freedom as you would be forced to care about somebody you don't even know, this would in fact be removing your own property rights and as such could not be considered as anything near what the concept of freedom would employ. The government should respect fully that yours is yours and yet only when it is not objectively arguably feasible to take care of your own when you may stand in danger of those around you(ie. with narcotics), they may take from you.

liberalism and conservatism in themselves are perfect on paper, it's how they're put into practice. to me liberalism is more for minority groups and looking after people, when i feel being conservative is believing in an individual and giving them the ability to look after themselves. at least that is how i always understood it :p
 
If anyone wishes to slot me into a box then the Kennedy quote above, provided by Wizard is spot on for me. I was brought up that way and that's the way I have always approached life, so there's no point in trying to talk me out of it at my age, thank you very much. :p

but i feel that conservatives could fit that label too. Randians and fans of Ayn Rand are conservatives who believe in the power of the individual, and how society tries to make us all alike and hamper us. i'm conservative and i believe the exact same things
 
It is simple, Liberalism means 'of freedom', it is a movement that vows for freedom. from this we should devise what freedom would entitle and how we should get it to everybody too. I don't think that it should be considered freedom for someone to be forced to pay for somebody elses bad judgments in life(ala Socialism), freedom simply means that each person is due their own property in life, no body elses, else it means complete anarchy, and if not so well then it is not freedom as you would be forced to care about somebody you don't even know, this would in fact be removing your own property rights and as such could not be considered as anything near what the concept of freedom would employ. The government should respect fully that yours is yours and yet only when it is not objectively arguably feasible to take care of your own when you may stand in danger of those around you(ie. with narcotics), they may take from you.

Oddly enough, thats what "conservative fox news" is pushing.
 
"There are two kinds of people in the world: Those who believe there are two kinds of people in the world and those who don't."
Robert Benchley, American Humorist (1888-1946)

Conservatives naturally rejected the study, since they don’t believe in science. Says one, this is just “another fraud up there with … Global Warming”.
If my conservative they mean retard then they need to first clarify what conservatism is :), I am sure there are many people who claim to be conservative who have no issue with science, hell I even taught physics at a time.

I found the third variable on wikipedia though
The amygdala appears to play a role in binge drinking, being damaged by repeated episodes of intoxication and withdrawal.[34] Alcoholism is associated with dampened activation in brain networks responsible for emotional processing, including the amygdala.[35] Protein kinase C-epsilon in the amygdala appears to be critical for the development of high ethanol intake.
Long story short is that these students at London college who are more conservative tend to be party animals as well.
 
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I also like the freedom to help others if I want. Its not all about greed, money and property for everyone. Some of us have higher ideals.
 
I also like the freedom to help others if I want. Its not all about greed, money and property for everyone. Some of us have higher ideals.

I don't really feel that your Kennedy quote is limited to liberals only.
 
Yeah... um, no...

The new phrenology - PZ Myers

Morphological variation is important, it's interesting…and it's also common. It's one of my major scientific interests — I'm actually beginning a new research project this spring with a student and I doing some pilot experiments to evaluate variation in wild populations here in western Minnesota, so I'm even putting my research time where my mouth is in this case. There has been some wonderful prior work in this area: I'll just mention a paper by Shubin, Wake, and Crawford from 1995 that examined limb skeletal morphology in a population of newts, and found notable variation in the wrist elements — only about 70% had the canonical organization of limb bones.

I've also mentioned the fascinating variation in the morphology of the human aorta. Anatomy textbooks lay out the most common patterns, but anyone who has taught the subject knows that once you start dissecting, you always find surprises, and that's OK: variation is the raw material of evolution, so it's what we expect.

The interesting part is trying to figure out what causes these differences in populations. We can sort explanations into three major categories.


1. Genetic variation. It may be the the reason different morphs are found is that they carry different alleles for traits that influence the developmental processes that build features of the organism. Consider family resemblances, for instance: your nose or chin might be a recognizable family trait that you've inherited from one of your parents, and may pass on to your children.

2. Environmental variation. The specific pattern of expression of some features may be modified by environmental factors. In larval zebrafish, for instance, the final number of somites varies to a small degree, and can be biased by the temperature at which they are raised. They're also susceptible to heat shock, which can generate segmentation abnormalities.

3. Developmental noise. Sometimes, maybe often, the specific details of formation of a structure may not be precisely determined — they wobble a bit. The limb variation Shubin and others saw, for example, was almost entirely asymmetric, so it's not likely to have been either genetic or environmental. They were just a consequence of common micro-accidents that almost certainly had no significant effect on limb function.

When I see variation, the first question that pops into my head is which of the above three categories it falls into. The second question is usually whether the variation does anything — while some may have consequences on physiology or movement or sexual attractiveness, for instance, others may really be entirely neutral, representing equivalent functional alternatives. Those are the interesting questions that begin inquiry; observing variation is just a starting point for asking good questions about causes and effects, if any.

I bring up this subject as a roundabout introduction to why I find myself extremely peeved by a recent bit of nonsense in the press: the claim that liberal and conservative brains have a different organization, with conservatives having larger amygdalas ("associated with anxiety and emotions") and liberals having a larger anterior cingulate ("associated with courage and looking on the bright side of life").

Gag.

I don't deny the existence of anatomical variation in the brain — I expect it (see above). I don't question the ability of the technique, using MRI, to measure the dimensions of internal structures. I even think these kinds of structural variations warrant more investigation — I think there are great opportunities for future research to use these tools to look for potential effects of these differences.

What offends me are a number of things. One is that the interesting questions are ignored. Is this variation genetic, environmental, or simply a product of slop in the system? Does it actually have behavioral consequences? The authors babble about some correlation with political preferences, but they have no theoretical basis for drawing that conclusion, and they can't even address the direction of causality (which they assume is there) — does having a larger amygdala make you conservative, or does exercising conservative views enlarge the amygdala?

I really resent the foolish categorization of the functions of these brain regions. Courage is an awfully complex aspect of personality and emotion and cognition to simply assign to one part of the brain; I don't even know how to define "courage" neurologically. Are we still playing the magical game of phrenology here? This is not how the brain works!

Furthermore, they're picking on a complex phenomenon and making it binary. Aren't there more than one way each to be a conservative or a liberal? Aren't these complicated human beings who vary in an incredibly large number of dimensions, too many to be simply lumped into one of two types on the basis of a simple survey?

This is bad science in a number of other ways. It was done at the request of a British radio channel; they essentially wanted some easily digestible fluff for their audience. The investigator, Geraint Rees, has published quite a few papers in credible journals — is this really the kind of dubious pop-culture crap he wants to be known for? The data is also feeble, based on scans of two politicians, followed by digging through scans and questionnaires filled out by 90 students. This is blatant statistical fishing, dredging a complex data set for correlations after the fact. I really, really, really detest studies like that.

And here's a remarkable thing: I haven't seen the actual data yet. I don't know how much variation there is, or how weak or strong their correlations are. It's because I can't. This work was done as a radio stunt, is now being touted in various other media, and the paper hasn't been published yet. It'll be out sometime this year, in an unnamed journal.

We were just discussing the so-called "decline effect", to which my answer was that science is hard, it takes rigor and discipline to overcome errors in analysis and interpretation, and sometimes marginal effects take a great deal of time to be resolved one way or the other…and in particular, sometimes these marginal results get over-inflated into undeserved significance, and it takes years to clear up the record.

This study is a perfect example of the kind of inept methodology and lazy fishing for data instead of information that is the root of the real problem. Science is fine, but sometimes gets obscured by the kind of noise this paper is promoting.

I have to acknowledge that I ran across this tripe via Blue Girl, who dismisses it as "sweeping proclamations about the neurophysiological superiority of the liberal brain", and Amanda Marcotte, who rejects it because "This kind of thing is inexcusable, both from a fact-based perspective and because the implication is that people who are conservative can't help themselves." Exactly right. This kind of story is complete crap from the premise to the data to the interpretations.
 
Jak3 has already asserted this "study" is BS. More proof of that fact is the military. Overwhelmingly conservative yet fearful, anxious and emotional people don't join the military but courageous people do. Who had the most faith in the Iraqi people to put things right in Iraq? Conservatives. Liberals riddled with fear, anxiety, emotion and defeatism tried to cut and run abandoning them. So much for looking on the bright side of life :erm:

Look at the austerity cuts in Europe. Who's fearful, anxious and in an emotional rage rampaging through the streets torching cars, assaulting people and sending bombs to embassies? Liberals of course. Where's the courage and looking on the bright side of life in that.
 
but i feel that conservatives could fit that label too. Randians and fans of Ayn Rand are conservatives who believe in the power of the individual, and how society tries to make us all alike and hamper us. i'm conservative and i believe the exact same things

Randians are technically regarded as libertarians not conservatives. Pro-market and pro-individual choice/rights in social spheres.
 
It is simple, Liberalism means 'of freedom', it is a movement that vows for freedom. from this we should devise what freedom would entitle and how we should get it to everybody too. I don't think that it should be considered freedom for someone to be forced to pay for somebody elses bad judgments in life(ala Socialism), freedom simply means that each person is due their own property in life, no body elses, else it means complete anarchy,

mon -archy - 1 ruler
olig - archy - many rulers
demo -archy - rule by the people (Majority rule)
an -archy - Without rule, means you are not ruled by someone, implying you rule yourself. Which is what freedom is.

So freedom = anarchy... technically speaking.

If we are going to be talking about political philsophy then we have to reference people correctly, as such, anarchy is not chaos, it is self rule.

As a self-confessed anarcho-capitalist, I do not like the implication that I am pro-chaos, because I'm not.
 
Liberal (n): Someone who believes in freedom from responsibility and freedom from consequences; the perpetual child.
 
Liberal (n): Someone who believes in freedom from responsibility and freedom from consequences; the perpetual child.

You can see your conservative education based on your inability to define liberal :)

lib·er·al   
[lib-er-uhl, lib-ruhl] Show IPA
–adjective
1.
favorable to progress or reform, as in political or religious affairs.
( often initial capital letter ) noting or pertaining to a political party advocating measures of progressive political reform.
3.
of, pertaining to, based on, or advocating liberalism.
4.
favorable to or in accord with concepts of maximum individual freedom possible, esp. as guaranteed by law and secured by governmental protection of civil liberties.
5.
favoring or permitting freedom of action, esp. with respect to matters of personal belief or expression: a liberal policy toward dissident artists and writers.
6.
of or pertaining to representational forms of government rather than aristocracies and monarchies.
7.
free from prejudice or bigotry; tolerant: a liberal attitude toward foreigners.
8.
open-minded or tolerant, esp. free of or not bound by traditional or conventional ideas, values, etc.
9.
characterized by generosity and willingness to give in large amounts: a liberal donor.
10.
given freely or abundantly; generous: a liberal donation.
11.
not strict or rigorous; free; not literal: a liberal interpretation of a rule.
12.
of, pertaining to, or based on the liberal arts.
13.
of, pertaining to, or befitting a freeman.
 
liberal (n): Someone who believes in freedom from thought. Further reading: argument from authority, ad-hominum.
 
What modern liberals claim to believe and what they actually do are two very different things.

For example

1) Claim they're pro personal liberty yet support centralised government with extensive regulation and high taxation.

2) Claim they're pro non discrimination yet advocate Affirmative Action and "representation" which is essentially judging people on the basis of their race

3) Claim they're pro freedom of speech yet advocate political correct censorship

4) Claim they're tolerant of differing views yet constantly smear opponents with baseless accusations and fearmongering with the race card being a favourite tactic

5) Claim they advocate Democratic governance yet routinely resort to mass protests involving intimidation, insults and violence when they don't get their way. Not to mention support for various socialist tyrants over the years like Robert Mugabe, Hugo Chavez, Fidel Castro, Ho Chi Minh and even the Ayatollahs in Iran back in the 70s

and lastly put the rights of criminals ahead of their innocent law abiding citizen victims by stripping them of their rights to defend themselves and sentencing criminals to ludicrously lenient sentences.
 
lol, the conservatives in this thread are so living up to their..."brain" matter :D Theyre like kids throwing their toys out the cot and crying to get someones attention. Well at least people can get a clearer idea of what kinda characters they have. Loved this thread.
 
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