Different shocks on same model a myth or not ?

[barneythedinosaur]

As i recently have taken the time to delve deep into getting the right contacts and parts to get my vehicle fixed as to try not to get ripped off, i came across something not many people know anything concrete about and thought it would make for a good discussion

my vehicle model is a peugeot 407 coupe 2.7 hdi 2006.

I found 2 "types" of shocks available as replacement

One is for the 2.0 liter HDI version (a 120kw engine version)
And the other for the 2.7 liter HDI version (a 150kw version)

And here they are clearly showing one as the 120kw version and the other as the 150kw version:

https://www.ebay.ie/itm/Bilstein-B6...eot-407-Coupe-6C-2-0-HDi-120-kW-/311750756811

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bilstein...h=item4893ca98f2:g:qZ4AAOSwLF1X~L71:rk:3:pf:0

Now speaking to various people, they cannot pinpoint that there is actually different shocks for different engine size versions of the same model.

So is it truth or is it a myth that you get 2 different types of shocks for the same model and different engine size ?
Is the ebay listings just a marketing gimmick ? Or is it the truth that the actual shocks differ from each other ?
For instance, a mechanic also told me:

That the KYB shock that one gets for my car is for 120 & 150kw engines. There is not a different shock for the 120kw engine and there is not a different shock for the 150kw engine.

Now is that the same for the stock shock that one orders from Peugeot ? Or does the Original peugeot shock come in 2 versions, one for 120kw engines, and one for 150kw engines ?
Or do you get an aftermarket shock that is "universal" for both engines ?

Another example from the mechanic i met, he said the 2,2 & 3,2lt Ford Rangers uses the same shocks on the same model range (2x4 & 4x4)

 

[EADC]

The OEM vs aftermarket the manufacturer might have requested different specs for each one where as the aftermarket manufacturer might consolidate them to one.

 

[HAL 9000]

The different Rover 75 / 75 Tourer / MG ZT / MG Z-TT models all had different OEM shock and coil spring codes, depending on the vehicle's suspension setup (firm / normal / soft) & VIN codes as at date of manufacture, as indicated below:

"The Spring and Damper Identification Label is located under the rear seat squab and contains identification codes (CI codes) for the springs and dampers fitted to that specific vehicle, when manufactured."

For example, here are their OEM parts codes listings for dampers & springs:

Rover 75/MG ZT Rear Damper - Saloon - https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-GRID001548
Rover 75/MG ZT Front Damper - Saloon - https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-GRID001542
Rover 75/MG ZT Rear Road Spring - Saloon - https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-GRID001551

Rover 75/MG ZT Rear Damper - Tourer - https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-GRID001549
Rover 75/MG ZT Front Damper - Tourer - https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-GRID001543
Rover 75/MG ZT Rear Road Spring - Tourer - https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-GRID001552

So it is entirely possible that, depending on the year of manufacture & model, Peugeot may have implemented a similar policy with regard to their OEM shock strut units on specific vehicle models as well.

 

[TheChamp]

We will never know until we see proof that they are different or the same thing, however getting interchangeable parts is a very common thing, plenty of brake pads are common even between different brands, cv joints, shocks too since the inner working of a shock are similar, except for those high performance luxury parts. Obviously no dealer would give out this information easily therefore all you have to go with is word of mouth from mechanics and owners.

 

[barneythedinosaur]

Thank you that is interesting to see.

So i guess what i am asking, if i fit the 2.2 liter hdi shocks onto the car with the 2.7 liter engine, would i notice a major difference ?

Or would it be better to get aftermarket shock that was "universably" made.
The reason i as is because i can get second hand 2.2 liter HDI shocks for half the price of new aftermarket shocks.

What would be the best choice if the used shocks is still in an acceptable condition.

 

[TheChamp]

Thank you that is interesting to see.

So i guess what i am asking, if i fit the 2.2 liter hdi shocks onto the car with the 2.7 liter engine, would i notice a major difference ?

Or would it be better to get aftermarket shock that was "universably" made.
The reason i as is because i can get second hand 2.2 liter HDI shocks for half the price of new aftermarket shocks.

What would be the best choice if the used shocks is still in an acceptable condition.

If they are similar and they fit, they will work. How many kilometres on these used shocks? It is a gamble, unless there is a way of testing these shocks?

 

[Frequent visitor]

If they are similar and they fit, they will work. How many kilometres on these used shocks? It is a gamble, unless there is a way of testing these shocks?

It is just possible that if you drive on the limit, you just might notice a small difference. But if you drive older cars (OK, 2006 is not that old!) at their original design limits you will come a cropper sooner or later. Anyway those original design limits are almost always illegal anyway.
The usual test in the UK where we have annual tests is for the mechanic to bounce each corner in turn. It the car stops bouncing after a bounce or two - fine! Believe me you will soon know if they are bad enough to be a risk - you will be all over the place!

 

[barneythedinosaur]

Thanks, that helped me decide to very much consider them, i guess i will have to decide whether to take the chance and get those used shocks or go with the newer "universal" one's. The tire has worn badly due to the bad shock so i need to replace 2 tyres now as well, no good replacing 1 rear. So it's going to be quite a bill, so i am strongly considering getting the used shocks from the scrapyard

 

[EADC]

With shocks being a safety aspect would advise not to go the second hand route.

 

[TheChamp]

Thanks, that helped me decide to very much consider them, i guess i will have to decide whether to take the chance and get those used shocks or go with the newer "universal" one's. The tire has worn badly due to the bad shock so i need to replace 2 tyres now as well, no good replacing 1 rear. So it's going to be quite a bill, so i am strongly considering getting the used shocks from the scrapyard

Who sells the used ones? rear shocks aren't as safety critical as the front, If you are that desperate you can take a chance however it would make a very big difference if you knew the history of the shocks.

 

[SykomantiS]

Is the engine weight (and vehicle weight) the same for the 2L and the 2.7L? It could be an indication as to why the shocks would have different oem part numbers- the damping rates and springs might differ. It's possible that aftermarket uses the same damping rates for both (and lightly sportier/stiffer in nature) which is why they would be the same then. All of this is speculation though.

I'm not sure if a shock is a part I would consider 2nd hand.

 

[barneythedinosaur]

I cannot seem to get concrete info it varies from site to site
One site says
1650kg for the coupe 2.0 hdi
For the hdi 2.7 coupe:
Kerb Weight 1712 kg
and another says:

Weight (EU)‎: ‎1852 kg for the coupe 2.7 hdi

 

[brianj74]

Different spec shocks for different models, but can be interchangeable from a fit perspective, will have different handling and ride characteristics. Eg different loads and ride heights. If you check appropriateness, you can get a suitable shock much cheaper by getting a variant from another model

 

[barneythedinosaur]

Ok i think i'm going to take a chance on the shocks at the scrapyard, holding thumbs they not doing me in but will hopefully see.
i got more figures the 2.2 diesel 1525 kg and the 2.7HDI 1612kg and the 2.0 liter 1650kg

Here's the culprit shock, it does not seem to be electric ?

 

[TheChamp]

Something looks broken in the third picture, what is it?

 

[barneythedinosaur]

not sure can't see what you see, the plastic covering ?
left bottom of 3rd picture? think its the plastic shield ?

 

[HAL 9000]

The offset rubber boots (no proper seal onto the lower strut) and the wet oil stains at the bottom of the boots are an immediate indication that the strut seals are definitely FUBAR.

 

[barneythedinosaur]

Does a new shock come with the seals?
This is the rear end.

 

[EADC]

Does a new shock come with those ?

No the protection kit has to be bought seperate.

 

[barneythedinosaur]

Yesterday i went to 4 scrapyards, 2 of them told me they had shocks for the coupe, when i arrived they had lied, the following shocks were taken out of 407 station wagon's. they tell me it should work with the coupe, i hesitated and did not know if i should take the chance so i did not, there are different numbers on the shock though the one pair read: 8665 and the other pair: 8767

Now i wonder if these shocks would fit my coupe ?

I measured one of the 407 shocks at the scrapyard with the shock mountings connected as shown in the pictures, and it measures 59.5 cm's long