Don't Expect Miracles

Will the introduction of the SNO be enough to bring down fixed line prices?

  • Yes

    Votes: 9 9.9%

  • No

    Votes: 67 73.6%

  • Unsure

    Votes: 15 16.5%
  • Total voters
    91
Gooku said:
M8
Wireless is the future, I think in SA we will have to leap pass the ADSL and straight into 2.5g, 3G or Wimax to look for affordability.
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I honestly hope that's not true. Wireless solutions are fine for applications that are just bandwidth heavy, but what about latency sensitivity? Not everyone just wants to use broadband for downloads-some of us want it for gaming and other latency-sensitive apps..
 
But will this be done? Look at the current environment, despite the lengthy installation delays and generally lousy service Telkom ADSL is still the broadband solution of choice for low latency applications-particularly because wireless solutions currently suffer from latency issues. If wireless providers are not bothering to work to keep latency low on their networks (whatever the cause), shaping and overloading of base stations seems to be the norm now, what drive would they have to change that in future?
 
Glad I have moved to Sentech. Now with the SNO saying this, Sentech seem to be the only company that wants to take Telkom on
 
Wireless can be awesome if implemented correctly by people who know what they're doing.

Same goes for wired networks. If it's rolled out and wasn't set up properly then it would be as bad as a wireless connection that wasn't set up properly.

For say an 8Mbps wireless connection one doesn't need 100% communications quality and 100% signal strength - if the bandwidth behind the access point is sufficient you will still get your 8Mbps speed.

I had a WAN set up in Blouberg last year and even with the wireless modem pointing in completely the wrong direction I was still able to pull 4-5MB/s from other clients on the network, even with 19% communications quality and 27% signal strength. The AP wasn't even set up properly, it was a SMC Barricade with its standard little stub antennae - inside a tiled roof.

If the SNO can pull off wireless using a decent technology (everyone is raving about WiMAX but thats the press for you) then the uptake would be tremendous.

So they have at their disposal BPL, WLL and LLU.. if I'm not forgetting anything.
 
Correct me if I am wrong here... But what do you guys think of this theory??

Whats the problem? Very High Telecoms costs!
Why? Completely Government controlled. From the last mile right to the Communications Act in Parliament!
So why all the fuss?? Why dont they just fix the problem?? Well the commonly known issues are: Incompetence, Greed, Gravy Train, Monoplies, etc..

Are they any solutions out there?? YES THERE ARE TONS OF SOLUTIONS OUT THERE THAT CAN BE INTRODUCED AND a TURN AROUND TIME IN A MATTER OF WEEKS AND NOT YEARS!! There's no shortage of money!

So Whats Problem??? [This is definately controversial so my apologies]
What is 1 of the biggest problems in this country? Un-Employment!
What are they doing to fix it? BEE & Affirmative Action!
Do these previously disadvantaged people have the skills? Not at the moment but in due course! <--- I stand to be corrected here!
So why not open up the market to liberisation and competition?
First of all?? Who will capitalise on this telecoms freedom?

So ask yourself this question? Hypothetically if the market were to be freed from monopolistic policies who would benefit from the Business side of Telecoms offerings?? (NOTE: I am not talking about consumer benefits)

Well I know how to start my own telecoms company. Most of the active forumites here have the skills and know how! How many previously disadvantage people in this country have the "SKILLS" to do what we all here can do??? And do you fall under the "previously disadvantaged" category??

Please Note: I am by no means a fan of BEE and AA. But thats another topic.
I am just looking at this from a different view point!

--------------So lets take a look at the bigger picture---------------
-> "Democratic" South Africa
-> 10 years of "Democracy"
-> Mass un-employment, Mass Poverty, Very Under-skilled!!

What is the number 1 element in fixing these issues?? BROADBAND AND THE INTERNET, i.e. DIGITAL DIVIDE!
Who provides these services? ISP's, Telecoms Companies (SNOT, Telkom)
Who controlls these services? GOVERNMENT!!!
Will Government allow so called [Open to debate] NON-PREVIOUSLY DISADVANTAGED People to successfully provide and inevitably dominate a OPEN AND FREE TELECOMS ENVIRONMENT??

If your answer is YES----->
Then i think you are dreaming because if this was the case then we all would not be sitting here debating about Telecoms reform?

If your answer is NO------>
First thing that comes to mind is that it is unfair and can be labelled re-verse apartheid. again this is open to debate and cant be covered here. Ok so its unfair but we cant do anything about it? Whats the next step??
Those in power [GOVERNMENT] should create an environment where the people of this country can actually gain the benefits from Broadband and the Internet?? Why dont they do this?? GREED, GRAVY TRAIN, ETC...!!!

------------- CONCLUSION -----------------
POINT 1:
Government wont allow those who are not previoulsy disadvantaged to benefit from Telecoms reform, as they think it would just
further "disadvantage" the "previously disadvantaged"...

POINT2:
Government wont allow the people of this country to enjoy the benefits of broadband and the internet because of elements like: greed, incompetence, gravy train, etc...

Conclusion:
By the looks of things government is retarding growth, And knowingly or unknowinlgy F*cking their own people over anyways!!!

SO NOW WHAT DO WE DO??????
 
ettubrute said:
Well, why not charge only 500% more, and attract 5 times the number of customers? Increases the bottom line substantially!
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Because a price war is just that, a price war --- if they charge only 500% more, Telkom has plenty of room to go down and match that, and then they won't gain 5 times the number of customers, because most people will just stick with Telkom anyway. It's a bit like Mutually Assured Destruction. Or rather, Mutually Assured Dramatic-lowering-of-profit-margins. (Although there is still room in this market for both companies to make a lot of money. Also, the market isn't zero-sum: if you lower the prices to international norms, you actually increase the overall size of the market - in SA, probably by a factor of several times. For example if we now have say 200K broadband users, lowering the prices could increase the market size to literally millions ... the "pie" gets bigger even though the slices get smaller, and there would be plenty of new customers to join the SNO. Likewise for ordinary fixed-line telephony, a pathetic 4.something million lines, our economy probably has room for over 10,000,000 lines *if* they were cheaper.)
 
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Cheers guys! I'd like to say it's been nice..... I can't hold out any longer for cheaper telecoms in this country. Going over to green pastures... where telecoms is nice and cheap.... caio.

Edit: In the meantime, I suggest we do what the one forumite suggested and boycott the SNO (and not switch over to them) to force them to drop prices and become competitive for us consumers.
 
Vice said:
Why did they apply for the license anyways? Didn't they understand terms and conditions that were attached? I think it should be revoked. The fundamental expectation is that prices MUST come down, why else would bother giving a 2nd license when we already have a tyrant running our digital/telecom prices to hell? This is an excuse motivated by greed.
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They understood the terms and conditions completely. They are suppose to provide services to previously disadvantaged communities first. They are doing exactly what they are suppose to do, unless you actually belief the government's lies.
 
It seems to me that the race is over before it has begun. If SNOt is not prepared to engage in a competive environment, then what was the point of licensing them. Excuse my ignorance, but isn't the point of introducing a second operator etc. to provide competition and therefore introduce choice.
The way I see it, is that consumers will make a choice to go with an alternative to Telkom because of affordibility! With the majority of this country being poor, does SNOt really think that "service" alone is going to win customers. Even corporates will surely look at price as a defining factor, whether or not they should jump ship and go with the SNO.

Money talks, (shouts even), service doesn't
 
The only statement that gives any glimmer of hope:

"SNO Telecom should begin offering its first services to the wholesale market Internet service providers and the like by midyear."

There is plenty of competition at a retail/ISP level. Maybe, just maybe, the SNO can kick the chair from under Telkom in the wholesale market. After all, that is were the greatest blockage to affordable broadband exists.
 
There is plenty of competition at a retail/ISP level. Maybe, just maybe, the SNO can kick the chair from under Telkom in the wholesale market. After all, that is were the greatest blockage to affordable broadband exists.
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Not while telkom continues to control SAT3 - and not before EASSy comes into existance (snot a major shareholder in this?)
 
- Unbelievable - (and welcome to the forums poisonelves)
 
kilo39 said:
Not while telkom continues to control SAT3 - and not before EASSy comes into existance (snot a major shareholder in this?)
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Yes they are. As are Vodacom and MTN. Probably Telkom *finger in throat* as well.
 
ic said:
Ummm could be my forgetory again, but I definitely don't remember [according to the licence T&Cs that !CASA cooked up] SNOT being required to service under-serviced areas before rolling anything out anywhere else...
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Can't say for sure that it is a requirement, but it's definitely an expectation. Which is just as good in my book with government being the control freaks that they are. It was however the general consenses when the first SNO was being constructed that they will only start rolling out to serviced areas after they have finished servicing under-serviced areas, which Telkom was suppose to have done already.
 
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The governments will screw up the Eassy cable. They will use it to line their own pockets at the expense of the people.

Affordable bandwidth in South Africa is an absolute pipe dream as long as the government remain financially entwined in the industry through majority shareholdings.
Moral compasses and social responsibilities are shuffled far to one side and forgotten when confronted with virtually limitless opportunities for self enrichment on the back of an essential service.
 
Sneeky said:
The governments will screw up the Eassy cable. They will use it to line their own pockets at the expense of the people.
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Not true. EASSy != government. EASSy is a multinational project not controlled by the government.
He pointed that EASSy will be an ‘open access at cost’ system and will be cost effective and competitively priced.

“The capacity pricing is probably the cheapest anywhere in the world with a comparable system,” Sihra said.

EASSy will enable any ISP (Internet Service Provider) or organization with an international service license to purchase bandwidth on the cable at reasonable rates.
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:D
 
Of particular interest to Pandey and his management team is the telecom infrastructure owned by shareholders Transnet and Eskom Enterprises, which together own 30% of SNO Telecom. Pandey says this infrastructure will form the basis of the company’s network backbone. “The intention is to transfer these assets to the SNO,” Pandey says. “They would hopefully give us a good presence right from the start.”
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Ok, I'm officially confused now. What telecom infrastructure is he talking about? I only know of power lines. Are they planning to use that for communications.
 
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