Easy Equities good or bad?

acp said:
hahaha!
My thoughts exactly.
This analogy applies to a great deal of the EE frustrations voiced to date.
It simply was not designed to be a trading platform focussed on spreads etc.
There's a multitude of portals to do that, at a cost.

If one looks at the typical EE marketing angle, it certainly does not put itself forward as a progressive 'trading' platform with layers of trade functionality. If one is investing (per se) in a share, a percentage point or 2 in terms of spread should not be a major issue.
If the purchase is speculative and the day-to-day spread is a concern, vote with your feet and go where those requirements are met.
I myself had to accept this at some point last year when there was a massive spread difference on a large counter I wanted to add more from. I could get a better spread on my FNB platform, but after costs, the difference would be negligible and I was in the process of migrating to EE anyway.
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Yup, agree fully with your statements. I am not trying to say that EE is a bad platform, I have just become more aware of the differences of bid/offer spreads etc as I learn.

I probably shouldn't be too concerned with the price gaps seeing as I only invest, not trade. Still, sometimes the gap is surprisingly big.
 
Unpossible said:
Yup, agree fully with your statements. I am not trying to say that EE is a bad platform, I have just become more aware of the differences of bid/offer spreads etc as I learn.

I probably shouldn't be too concerned with the price gaps seeing as I only invest, not trade. Still, sometimes the gap is surprisingly big.
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Would this an appropriate time to say:
That's what he said
?
:whistle:
 
acp said:
hahaha!
My thoughts exactly.
This analogy applies to a great deal of the EE frustrations voiced to date.
It simply was not designed to be a trading platform focussed on spreads etc.
There's a multitude of portals to do that, at a cost.

If one looks at the typical EE marketing angle, it certainly does not put itself forward as a progressive 'trading' platform with layers of trade functionality. If one is investing (per se) in a share, a percentage point or 2 in terms of spread should not be a major issue.
If the purchase is speculative and the day-to-day spread is a concern, vote with your feet and go where those requirements are met.
I myself had to accept this at some point last year when there was a massive spread difference on a large counter I wanted to add more from. I could get a better spread on my FNB platform, but after costs, the difference would be negligible and I was in the process of migrating to EE anyway.
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What's the difference between trading and investing though? Everyone would have their own opinion on that from the guy saving for retirement to the one putting his extra money into shares for a nice Christmas bonus. The spreads really do make a difference even when investing and any proper platform should be able to give the correct prices. I understand which market EE is targeting but using the analogy if you want to paint a room you also want your brush to still paint straight and not splash even if it wasn't made for art.

What I'm saying is that even an investment platform should have some minimum functionality so a lot of the criticisms do apply here. It's not just traders that make use of stop loss and custom orders. Perhaps the real issue here is that you get what pay for and EE is neither a proper trading nor investment platform.
 
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Swa said:
What's the difference between trading and investing though? .
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In trading you can set your entry and exit prices... I trade shares, forex, ETF's using limit orders only because trading via a market order (at the spread) is a suckers game...

Easy Equities in my view is the most interesting vehicle for TAX FREE SAVINGS ACCOUNTS (TFSA) in the market currently as it allows you to choose from very cheap and well diversified ETF structures (including Offshore). Its actually quiet wonderful to behold for the more sophisticated investor, who wants to actively manage their own portfolio of ETF's and be able to overweight and underweight exposures in the account via a very cheap transaction mechanism...

My biggest gripe with EE is the fact that I can not use Limit Orders... So this makes my desire to "trade" the account a lot less digital and more of an analogue affair... But that's also alright as I set price alerts on my Standard Bank OST platform for the ETF's and when they trigger I go in and buy or sell those ETF's at Market - I am still able to get my price (almost) the sad thing is I have to physically do this rather than set a limit to buy GND at 780 and wait for the share to capitulate down to my level and enter me into the position automatically...

But hey I don't mind because so far as I can see EE offers the cheapest and most hassle free way to operate a TFSA...

Would i use EE as my goto share trading platform? Not on your life... But I'm not EE's target market, EE are looking unsophisticated investors who are cost conscious... Their costs are very competitive but the value of their platform in terms of added features leave much to be desired...

I would even go as far as to say that MOST of South African platforms fall horribly short in comparison to the feature rich, ease of access and information like platforms through large international brokerages... Sure you can't trade the JSE... but really who gives a ****? give me thinkorswim any day over the so-called "high tech" platforms we have here in South Africa - Add to this the fact that the JSE is a pure monopoly with Chinese walls that provide "inside info" to a hand full of brokers and cronies... The data should be free... That's why I would say that any serious investor and trader wouldn't be seen really spending much time on local platforms (unless there is some tax incentive, or real good companies trading at a massive discount...)

Just my 10c, I'm new here but I like the activity in this community and will hopefully stick around
 
FxJalarupa said:
In trading you can set your entry and exit prices... I trade shares, forex, ETF's using limit orders only because trading via a market order (at the spread) is a suckers game...

Easy Equities in my view is the most interesting vehicle for TAX FREE SAVINGS ACCOUNTS (TFSA) in the market currently as it allows you to choose from very cheap and well diversified ETF structures (including Offshore). Its actually quiet wonderful to behold for the more sophisticated investor, who wants to actively manage their own portfolio of ETF's and be able to overweight and underweight exposures in the account via a very cheap transaction mechanism...

My biggest gripe with EE is the fact that I can not use Limit Orders... So this makes my desire to "trade" the account a lot less digital and more of an analogue affair... But that's also alright as I set price alerts on my Standard Bank OST platform for the ETF's and when they trigger I go in and buy or sell those ETF's at Market - I am still able to get my price (almost) the sad thing is I have to physically do this rather than set a limit to buy GND at 780 and wait for the share to capitulate down to my level and enter me into the position automatically...

But hey I don't mind because so far as I can see EE offers the cheapest and most hassle free way to operate a TFSA...

Would i use EE as my goto share trading platform? Not on your life... But I'm not EE's target market, EE are looking unsophisticated investors who are cost conscious... Their costs are very competitive but the value of their platform in terms of added features leave much to be desired...

I would even go as far as to say that MOST of South African platforms fall horribly short in comparison to the feature rich, ease of access and information like platforms through large international brokerages... Sure you can't trade the JSE... but really who gives a ****? give me thinkorswim any day over the so-called "high tech" platforms we have here in South Africa - Add to this the fact that the JSE is a pure monopoly with Chinese walls that provide "inside info" to a hand full of brokers and cronies... The data should be free... That's why I would say that any serious investor and trader wouldn't be seen really spending much time on local platforms (unless there is some tax incentive, or real good companies trading at a massive discount...)

Just my 10c, I'm new here but I like the activity in this community and will hopefully stick around
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EE offers a specific trading platform as well. A sales man called me and asked if I was interested.
 
skinndeep said:
EE offers a specific trading platform as well. A sales man called me and asked if I was interested.
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What trading platform? GT247 offers a platform for forex and CFDs but no equities trading platform unless it's a new product.

Here's something for those saying EE is a low cost investment platform to ponder. It has some serious shortcomings in that regard as well. Shares being suspended, artificial limits, high/low prices when buying/selling some less liquid shares. All things that can ruin an investment and shouldn't be in any platform.

Capitec had the right idea, flexibly paying for what you use. While everyone else claimed that it would be a failure and packages are the only viable way. It turned out to be tremendously popular. Why doesn't EE investigate something similar?
 
Swa said:
Capitec had the right idea, flexibly paying for what you use. While everyone else claimed that it would be a failure and packages are the only viable way. It turned out to be tremendously popular. Why doesn't EE investigate something similar?
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:erm:

I would say EE is the closest thing to Capitec that has ever been developed. There are no monthly fees or packages, you only pay for what you use (i.e when you trade).

You need to elaborate a bit more.:confused:
 
konfab said:
:erm:

I would say EE is the closest thing to Capitec that has ever been developed. There are no monthly fees or packages, you only pay for what you use (i.e when you trade).

You need to elaborate a bit more.:confused:
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The difference is that EE tells you how you should be doing a lot of things. They decide what price you should pay/be paid for shares, what shares you can buy and how much, no ability to buy whole shares only or according to number of shares. It's an all or nothing approach rather than pay for what you use and they tend to lean towards the nothing.
 
konfab said:
:erm:

I would say EE is the closest thing to Capitec that has ever been developed. There are no monthly fees or packages, you only pay for what you use (i.e when you trade).

You need to elaborate a bit more.:confused:
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ABSA does the same thing to a certain degree. Just FYI.

I think what a lot of people don't get is how EE works in the background to keep your costs down. It is only speculating (from a dev on another stock broking platform) but they are mist likely doing bulk trades under one BDA account which probably affects the bid offer prices.

The answer is simple - if you can stand the UI and are in it for long term buy and forget, go EE

...else go somewhere else. I mean if they sucked that bad SATRIX wouldn't have partnered with them for SatrixNOW.
 
Hamster said:
ABSA does the same thing to a certain degree. Just FYI.

I think what a lot of people don't get is how EE works in the background to keep your costs down. It is only speculating (from a dev on another stock broking platform) but they are mist likely doing bulk trades under one BDA account which probably affects the bid offer prices.

The answer is simple - if you can stand the UI and are in it for long term buy and forget, go EE

...else go somewhere else. I mean if they sucked that bad SATRIX wouldn't have partnered with them for SatrixNOW.
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Exactly :)
 
Swa said:
The difference is that EE tells you how you should be doing a lot of things. They decide what price you should pay/be paid for shares, what shares you can buy and how much, no ability to buy whole shares only or according to number of shares. It's an all or nothing approach rather than pay for what you use and they tend to lean towards the nothing.
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It's called value trading and other platforms are looking at doing it too.

They also never suspend trading but safeguard you against low volatility investments. When that happens you phone the trading desk and they do it for you instantly at no extra charge.
 
Swa said:
What trading platform? GT247 offers a platform for forex and CFDs but no equities trading platform unless it's a new product.
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No offence guys, but anyone dumb enough to trade FX via a local brokerage deserves to get their eyeballs ripped out of their sockets... Seriously you guys should look into what is on offer (FOR FREE MOSTLY) in the international space...

These local bucket shops can't hold a candle to the might of the bigger players globally... Look at what happened to IG when the Swiss Central Bank abandoned its peg of the EUR/CHF - Clients got margined and the brokerage almost went under...

Whereas some brokerages actually paid their clients back for their losses on this massive move...

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Believe me if there was ever a bucket shop it is Global Trader... You do not want to be engaged in transactions on margin with most of these local players... if you trading CFD's and the like do it through a banks platform preferably...

That way you limit your risk...

Having said that.... no-one should also only trade exclusively via one platform... something about keeping ones eggs all in one basket... There's wonderful technology out there that allows one to copy trades across multiple platforms and brokerages instantly... So yeah its good to have this discussion around the counter party risk and I hope that you guys start looking at diversifying your risk away from just one provider...
 
I'm new here but I like the activity in this community and will hopefully stick around
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Maybe if you dial down your rhetoric a touch you will be welcomed.
 
Hamster said:
It's called value trading and other platforms are looking at doing it too.

They also never suspend trading but safeguard you against low volatility investments. When that happens you phone the trading desk and they do it for you instantly at no extra charge.
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Well I hope they do. Trading platforms are seriously overcharging. We need some value propositions and not just these all or nothing approaches we currently have.

They did suspend trading on a few occasions and not on volatile or non-liquid shares. As for the contention that bulk trading is somehow keeping costs down but preventing all features, that is a sham as well. It's seriously risky not to place live orders as prices can move up or down. From what I have gathered it's only the Strate fee that has a minimum of R10.92. EE's contention is that they charge a percentage fee for this to recover some of it but subsidise the rest. I don't think that is the case. I think it's built into the spreads they have where they charge more than what they buy them for and pay less than what they sell them for. I would much rather just pay the Strate fee and set my own orders.
 
Swa said:
Well I hope they do. Trading platforms are seriously overcharging. We need some value propositions and not just these all or nothing approaches we currently have.

They did suspend trading on a few occasions and not on volatile or non-liquid shares. As for the contention that bulk trading is somehow keeping costs down but preventing all features, that is a sham as well. It's seriously risky not to place live orders as prices can move up or down. From what I have gathered it's only the Strate fee that has a minimum of R10.92. EE's contention is that they charge a percentage fee for this to recover some of it but subsidise the rest. I don't think that is the case. I think it's built into the spreads they have where they charge more than what they buy them for and pay less than what they sell them for. I would much rather just pay the Strate fee and set my own orders.
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100% correct EE make their money on the spread, keeps costs low by not having to support platform, research and data feed licensing... They have a 15 minute lag by which to "manipulate" a profit out of you... You can not "trade" shares on EE only buy and hold and hope you pick the right 15 minute window to liquidate your positions... although you will still only get their price... not the true market price

I have it on good authority that their CFD platform didn't (don't know if it still applies) allow traders to short any counters that represented the holdings of its Emperor Strategy... I mean wtf?

Bucket Shop is a bucket shop... read reminiscence of a stock operator if you need clarity on what a bucket shop is... Or just if you want a really good read

Do yourself a favor have a look at some of the features these guys (https://www.stocktrader.com/online-stock-brokers/) offer and then ask yourself is there is "value" in their costs... Remember value doesn't necessarily mean cheap... In a South African context, sure cheap is value, because we are so used to getting ripped off by monopolies like Eskom and the Johannesburg Stock Exchange (JSE).... But the kind of value that these providers offer are in the form of research, analytical and quantitative tools and screeners, liquidity and order execution, hedging strategies and optionality (something just being introduced now by Standard Bank), pricing data and back-testing facility... and much much more...

I may have come across as a little strong, but I am just trying to help you realize the truth, that here in South Africa we are settling for less when there is such better alternatives abroad... Trading professionally in SA is expensive and the technology available is not nearly as good as what is available out there... Plus you get to keep your cash and profits in hard currency... Best move I ever made moving my entire trading and investing portfolio offshore in 2011.

There is a place for local providers but they still do not come close to the functionality and ability that I get afforded elsewhere... so give it a try and I'd be interested to hear what you have to say.
 
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