Emergency Power

P

Packer

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We have an incompetent and corrupt government and a monopolistic and failing power utility (Eskom). I contend that with a beefy lithium/iron phosphate battery chemistry, plus Elon Musk’s influence in China (Gigafactory Shanghai) plus the ANC government’s buddy/buddy relationship with China plus Tesla’s incorporation of the vehicle-to-grid option in his cars, a cheaper Chinese version (neither Musk nor China are supporters of IP) could be deployed in SA., A cheap stainless steel, flat planed car (hatchback?) using Cybertruck tech with a beefy and cheaper lithium/iron phosphate battery chemistry with Tesla power management options designed for SA, will mitigate power problems and give a finger to Eskom.

SAn’s are not wealthy and a Tesla would be expensive but consider Musk’s influence in Chinese Shanghai. I can see cheaper-than-Tesla Chinese vehicles being a hit in SA. The buddy/buddy relationship of our country with China will smooth the way. If you go into analeptic shock at the thought of dealing with China (looking at you America and ‘rooi gevaar’ retreads) the point is Chinese cheapo Tesla EV’s could be an SA Cybercar. It doesn’t look too bad and could be the means of breaking loose from the dead and useless hand of Eskom.


NOTE: Ignore the $ price. Cost will be tailored for different countries. The $ price is intended for USA.

SA is fortunate to have Musk as a birth product. His formative years (until 17) were in SA in a medieval area (Pretoria) under apartheid dominated by people of a different language refighting the Anglo Boer war and victimising those who spoke English because they were raised on stories of British concentration camps. The shitty crucible of childhood life in SA as an English speaking geek among Afrikaner jocks, moulded and warped him to what he is. SA under apartheid didn’t have the environment for a ‘donderse rooinek’ nerd to thrive. As his formative years were spent in SA, it becomes like family - like that arsehole relative you find repugnant but you feel duty-bound to interact with at family gatherings. Frugal power use will keep fridges, lights and recharging running for over a week. It’s a mobile power supply that can be charged wherever there’s power. Tesla could mitigate the Eskom ****up.
 
Ummm how could Tesla mitigate the Eskom Fsckup when you need Eskom to charge the Tesla?
 
Actually disappointed..this could have been a great Friday thread.
 
Packer said:
SA is fortunate to have Musk as a birth product. His formative years (until 17) were in SA in a medieval area (Pretoria) under apartheid dominated by people of a different language refighting the Anglo Boer war and victimising those who spoke English because they were raised on stories of British concentration camps. The shitty crucible of childhood life in SA as an English speaking geek among Afrikaner jocks, moulded and warped him to what he is. SA under apartheid didn’t have the environment for a ‘donderse rooinek’ nerd to thrive. As his formative years were spent in SA, it becomes like family - like that arsehole relative you find repugnant but you feel duty-bound to interact with at family gatherings. Frugal power use will keep fridges, lights and recharging running for over a week. It’s a mobile power supply that can be charged wherever there’s power. Tesla could mitigate the Eskom ****up.
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Elon Musk hates everything about SA, he isnt going to be doing anything for this country.
He has been pretty vocal about his feelings in the past.
 
ToxicBunny said:
Ummm how could Tesla mitigate the Eskom Fsckup when you need Eskom to charge the Tesla?
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We have a lot of deserts (Karoo, Kalahari, Namib) and marginal land (Cape West coast) so a solar solution is not unrealistic for Eskom (if the wankers could be swayed). It’s a lot safer and cheaper than nuclear with a skill set more forgiving of oopsies. It is less polluting than coal with less opportunities for corruption. EV’s should charge during the day (solar). The way the electrical grid would fail (IMO) whether through civil war or incompetence, is incrementally. Vast areas would suffer power failure but there would be areas with power and (ideally) a load shedding schedule would go into effect. With an EV you can drive to where you need to charge or charge at home if it’s your turn for limited power. This would allow entrepreneurs to put together solar farms dedicated to EV charging. These wouldn’t be attacked in a civil war as it would alienate the population.
 
Packer said:
We have a lot of deserts (Karoo, Kalahari, Namib) and marginal land (Cape West coast) so a solar solution is not unrealistic for Eskom (if the wankers could be swayed). It’s a lot safer and cheaper than nuclear with a skill set more forgiving of oopsies. It is less polluting than coal with less opportunities for corruption. EV’s should charge during the day (solar). The way the electrical grid would fail (IMO) whether through civil war or incompetence, is incrementally. Vast areas would suffer power failure but there would be areas with power and (ideally) a load shedding schedule would go into effect. With an EV you can drive to where you need to charge or charge at home if it’s your turn for limited power. This would allow entrepreneurs to put together solar farms dedicated to EV charging. These wouldn’t be attacked in a civil war as it would alienate the population.
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Ummm, guys..where do we start with this?
 
Rocket-Boy said:
Elon Musk hates everything about SA, he isnt going to be doing anything for this country.
He has been pretty vocal about his feelings in the past.
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It’s a business decision. China will pressure Musk (for their own reasons) as a whole country is a captive market for their product (cheap EV’s). Musk need not do SA any favours.

I would be interested in seeing anti SA rants. I don’t doubt you but I would like details.

Note: There may be projection on my side. I went through this at boarding school and that was in KZN. It must have been an order of magnitude worse in Pretoria.
 
Packer said:
It’s a business decision. China will pressure Musk (for their own reasons) as a whole country is a captive market for their product (cheap EV’s). Musk need not do SA any favours.

I would be interested in seeing anti SA rants. I don’t doubt you but I would like details.

Note: There may be projection on my side. I went through this at boarding school and that was in KZN. It must have been an order of magnitude worse in Pretoria.
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Why would China pressure Musk to create a budget EV for a tiny back water market like ours?
 
What's going on with this forum? We need a basic iq test on the registration form.
 
lsheed_cn said:
China already has budget EV's.

The best selling EV now is the Wuling EV with 10KW of power. I've been tempted to grab one for Shanghai use, although I'm still stuck in SA.

https://cleantechnica.com/2020/11/0...tember-tesla-model-3-still-far-ahead-in-2020/

65k rands in China. Price here would be + EV duties + Vat so closer to R120k, but would still be a good buy if they made a RHD model.
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That would be a good little city runabout even here at around R100k... might need a bit of work on the safety features.

But thats not something you could use as a replacement daily driver if you do any sort of freeway driving though from what I can see.
 
Packer said:
We have a lot of deserts (Karoo, Kalahari, Namib) and marginal land (Cape West coast) so a solar solution is not unrealistic for Eskom (if the wankers could be swayed). It’s a lot safer and cheaper than nuclear with a skill set more forgiving of oopsies. It is less polluting than coal with less opportunities for corruption. EV’s should charge during the day (solar). The way the electrical grid would fail (IMO) whether through civil war or incompetence, is incrementally. Vast areas would suffer power failure but there would be areas with power and (ideally) a load shedding schedule would go into effect. With an EV you can drive to where you need to charge or charge at home if it’s your turn for limited power. This would allow entrepreneurs to put together solar farms dedicated to EV charging. These wouldn’t be attacked in a civil war as it would alienate the population.
Click to expand...

Well since you've asked me to start.

You've gone from Tesla being a solution to the Eskom fsckup, to proposing a fundamental shift in the power generation landscape in SA (which is actually underway in many aspects) that has nothing to do with EVs what so ever.

As for the the rest of it, you make many assumptions about how and when people will use and charge EVs and such like things, many of which may apply in small pockets of the country (Eastern Cape/Karoo/etc) but not everywhere. And you also assume that during a civil war that somehow certain infrastructure would be safe because it would "alienate" the population if it was damaged. I think you fundamentally don't understand the dynamics at play when civil war breaks out, nothing is sacred and everything will get destroyed by one side or the other to achieve their goals.
 
ToxicBunny said:
Why would China pressure Musk to create a budget EV for a tiny back water market like ours?
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Where to start. Detente with China seems like a way forward to turn SA into a place where you want to stay and raise your family. You want to avoid civil war, improve leadership, discipline the ANC morons and yet at the same time give them [ANC] what they want (Chinese socialist policies). They have an unemployed and unemployable electorate and the pressure is mounting to pull finger and do something. They will never in a million years function under capitalism.

Dangle the bait of Richard’s Bay to the Chinese. A portal into Africa and a huge, undeveloped harbour to exploit with rapid loading infrastructure already in place (RBC) Presently devoted to coal, it would be a simple technical tweak to load Chinese ships with minerals for them to sail through Chinese dominated waters to China. As a bonus they can implement the maritime dimension of their ‘New Silk Road’ megaproject. https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/building-new-silk-road.

The Chinese cannot be guilted with colonialism, have a super strong work ethic and consider themselves a superior people who have a superior culture to the rest of the world. Do you think the Chinese won’t go insane with ANC corruption and laziness? Do you think they won’t remonstrate strongly with the ANC? (It’s already happening in other parts of Africa). The Chinese can lend money, trade goodies and aid to SA and can leverage the ANC twats into rational behaviour because the chances of them getting loans elsewhere are zero. SA (IMO) can offer China the maritime dimension for their New Silk Road together with the mineral wealth of Africa using Richards Bay harbour as a Chinese controlled, rapid loading venue and port and SA (and African) minerals as bait. We need a ‘protector’ to guard against international predators because it would be trivial for anyone else to suborn corrupt and venal ANC leadership. We need to look after ourselves – no one will come riding to the rescue. We’ve being pawns for decades, bleeding for the West “keeping Africa free of communism”. **** them. The tired ‘rooi gevaar’ bullshit can’t be retreaded for the 21st century just because it was invoked for decades in the 20th. The ‘rooi gevaar’ scare tactics were used to motivate the SADF against Cuba and Russia. All the dead bodies are against the ‘red menace’ and we bled for America keeping Africa free of communism only with the Soviets and Cubans. There are no dead bodies between SA and China. That will help with Chinese detente.

China reneging will not be much of a danger ). This is Chinese self-interest and not rosy spectacled opinion. China will be spread very thin and, if black and white cooperated, they would be a formidable guerrilla force harrying every Chinese action. Sun Tzu (a revered Chinese strategist) would advise against it and the Chinese aren’t stupid. Even if they wanted to act like total dicks to other countries in Africa (doubtful), we have them by the balls. Their major exit port to China is Richard’s Bay surrounded by Zululand (the Zulu is not known for timidity). They HAVE to be sweet to South Africa. I also suspect they want to prove that they are better than the US in the 21st century than the Americans were in the 20th century (a low bar).

A relevant aside: Bamboo appears a miracle wood and I am concerned about SA deforestation (locals burning indigenous wood). Along with Chinese indisputable rural, farming expertise, one word - Bamboo. Not indigenous to SA but not an alien invader which is going to overwhelm local flora. Introduced to rural areas it is fast growing and can be used as a sustainable fuel and if it’s not burnt, has good carbon sequestration properties. Furniture? Scaffolding? Building material? Strong, light and flexible – ideal for construction. Bamboo geometry is such that it lends itself to pipes (water) and can be made into sieves, furniture, etc. It can be worked with simple tools. The Chinese have more than 4000 years of design knowledge which can be passed on. It will identify individuals (children?) who have an engineering or design flair for scholastic nurturing (no matter the poverty level). Bamboo – a versatile, light, hardy and fast growing wood. SA needs it. Along with the gross practicalities, China can contribute abstract elements China are also expert farmers. For 1000’s of years China was an agrarian economy.

In addition – the future looks socialist and technical. China is both.
 
ToxicBunny said:
That would be a good little city runabout even here at around R100k... might need a bit of work on the safety features.

But thats not something you could use as a replacement daily driver if you do any sort of freeway driving though from what I can see.
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Definitely a runaround. I could do a town and back in it (i.e. Noordhoek to CPT) but wouldn't be good for more than that at 10kw.

120KM range (so lets say 80km to be safe including freeway driving @ 100km/hr).
Good enough for town and back with extra driving, then a charge overnight.
 
lsheed_cn said:
Definitely a runaround. I could do a town and back in it (i.e. Noordhoek to CPT) but wouldn't be good for more than that at 10kw.

120KM range (so lets say 80km to be safe including freeway driving @ 100km/hr).
Good enough for town and back with extra driving, then a charge overnight.
Click to expand...

Yeah at a pinch it could do a town trip, but its not a vehicle you'd want to do that sort of drive in every day to go to and from work in as an example.
 
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