F1 2012 thread

MyDogHasNoNose said:
Shame... the poor team lol. Perhaps he would have remorse, but I'm thankful he made a decision to fight for his position, whatever the outcome. I don't get you guys, honestly - you aren't Lewis fans, yet you're unhappy that he died trying. Killa, I think you just whinge for the sake of it - because it's the Ham.
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Not at all i would be saying the same thing if vettel landed in the wall trying to defend like an idiot. If anything i am impressed by the new hamilton, the mature guy who isn't causing an accident every other race and seemingly using his brain. Pastor was equally stupid, he would have got hamilton the new few corners but hamilton is the one chasing a championship for mclaren and himself and he should know pastor is like the hamilton of last year so disaster was just around the corner. Two racers who have season's where all they do is crash, hamilton had his crash into everyone season last season now it's pastors turn :D

If i was so anti hamilton i would not have been routing for him to get his first win a while back.

Winning a championship is about points, trying to be a hero and racing when your car isn't capable won't win you championships, limping home to ensure you maximize your points how ever will.
 
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thestaggy said:
1 - Lewis was trailing Pastor into the right-hander. At that point, Lewis needs to yield position.
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Since when is it illegal to overtake if you're trailing going into the corner?
 
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Naks said:
Action (of the stupid kind that Lewis seems to like) does not win championships.
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That depends on whether you come out of it with more points or not. Action like that is what racing is about. Unfortunately, modern supporters prefer LA Law to real-in-your-face-racing.

[video=youtube;TsUD0yOEE7I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsUD0yOEE7I[/video]
 
Naks said:
In the same scenario, Vettel moved over very quickly to let Hamilton past - world championship points are vital if you want to be world champion. Someone should tell Lewis :)
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Nobody wants a boring world champion :p
 
http://totalf1.com/full_story/view/421101/Maldonado_hit_with_penalty_for_Hamilton_clash/
Pastor Maldonado has been handed a retrospective drive-through penalty for causing a collision with Lewis Hamilton in the European Grand Prix.

On the penultimate lap, Maldonado tried to pass Hamilton around the outside of turn 12 and on rejoining at turn 13 punted Hamilton in to the wall and out of the race. Hamilton refused to blame Maldonado for the incident after the race, but Maldonado claimed he had not been left enough room by the McLaren.

"He tried to put me out of the track and he didn't leave any room for us to do the corner side-by-side," Maldonado said. "I jumped over the kerb and couldn't avoid the accident."

The stewards, however, disagreed with Maldonado's view
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What was the final outcome? I thought his penalty involved 5 grid places at the next race (like Lewis' earlier on Maldonado).
 
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MyDogHasNoNose said:
Nope
1 - They were side by side going into the corner - Maldonado may have been marginally ahead before the corner, but they definitely went into the corner side by side with Lewis having the inside line.
2 - Pastor ran out of space to make his move, not Lewis' fault. Lewis took the most logical line from the inside of the corner to the outside and did not need to run him off the track. It would have been easy to raise that issue with the stewards if it was the case, instead Maldono was penalised for causing the incident.

Lol @ throwing stones. Lewis was penalised for that last year, we're not discussing last year, we're discussing yesterday's incident ;)
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Taken from FIA.com under the section ''Formula One Sporting Regulations'';

16) INCIDENTS

16.1 "Incident" means any occurrence or series of occurrences involving one or more drivers, or any
action by any driver, which is reported to the stewards by the race director (or noted by the
stewards and subsequently investigated) which :

a) Necessitated the suspension of a race under Article 41.
b) Constituted a breach of these Sporting Regulations or the Code.
c) Caused a false start by one or more cars.
d) Caused a collision.
e) Forced a driver off the track.
f) Illegitimately prevented a legitimate overtaking manoeuvre by a driver.
g) Illegitimately impeded another driver during overtaking.
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20) DRIVING

20.4 Manoeuvres liable to hinder other drivers, such as deliberate crowding of a car beyond the
edge of the track or any other abnormal change of direction, are not permitted.
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Two hotheaded drivers - oh yes, dear Hamilton was not innocent, where was he expecting Maldonado to go? - getting together will not end well.

From video footage Maldonado has pretty much a wheel length over Hamilton at the point of braking and technically that gives him the corner. We can debate that, but ignoring it, Hamilton transgressed other regulations by not giving Maldonado any room on the track.

And yes, Lewis was penalised for the Monaco punt on Pastor last year, but my point was Lewis is no stranger to uncompromising and often aggressive on-track tactics. I recall him running Webber off the road at Monza in 2010 on the high-speed approach to the Grande Curve as well. And goodness knows what he was trying to do at Canada last year. Can Pastor do silly things? Yes. Was this collision all his fault? No. Stewards disagree, but I can see at least one transgression committed by Hamilton - running another car off the track - that resulted in a collision. In my opinion it's a racing incident caused by two hot-headed drivers who both have reps for getting involved in silly business.
 
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Am I right in saying that Had Maldonado not tried to get back on track he would have hit the concrete speedbumps?
 
Haldex said:
Am I right in saying that Had Maldonado not tried to get back on track he would have hit the concrete speedbumps?
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You mean to say that his car does not have brakes?
 
All I can say.. KIMI BABY! :D

Sad to see to Vettel go out like that, but glad Mr Webber could grab us some points.

On the topic of Ham/Mal Incident, I believe Hamilton could of moved slightly over to the right. That concrete wall was fast approaching and even with saying Maldanado 'could' of braked, it wouldn't be of been such a hindrance to Hamilton's race if he did.
 
Armchair critics we all are lol.
@ the stag... your quote is irrelevant, you can't blame the driver on the outside for 'forcing you off track' if he's ahead. Maldonado was behind when he left the track. If you can't get your car alongside into the corner, you have to back off and try again later.
 
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MyDogHasNoNose said:
Armchair critics we all are lol.
@ the stag... your quote is irrelevant, you can't blame the driver on the outside for 'forcing you off track' if he's ahead. Maldono was behind when he left the track. If you can't get your car alongside into the corner, you have to back off and try again later.
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Right. On the approach to the right-hander Maldonado was at least a wheel's length ahead. Lewis knew he was there and probably saw him. Lewis would also be aware that there would be a good chance of Maldonado still being alongside him through the corner, which he was. Lewis drove like nobody was near him and afforded Maldonado no room on the outside. Where did he expect Maldonado to disappear to? We hear the term ''parking a driver'', which is when a driver gives his opponent just enough room to make the corner, but he has to brake to do so. Lewis never ''parked'' Maldonado, he gave him absolutely no room on the track to even ''park'' on.
 
Lewis had the line, he could do as he pleased. He expected Maldonado to back off like any normal driver would. Coulthard alluded to it a few times in the commentary - you have to get your car solidly up alongside your opponent to make an overtaking maneuver stick. Maldonado just pushed it too far. He was on the outside and was never going to be given that piece of track.
 
Pastor Maldonado © Gallo images
Maldonado punished as stewards kept busy
24 June 2012, 21:05

Pastor Maldonado was handed a 20-second penalty by race stewards late on Sunday for colliding with Lewis Hamilton during the European Grand Prix.

Maldonado of Williams was battling with McLaren driver Hamilton for third place before the two collided towards the end of the race, sending the Englishman into the barrier – the 2008 champion was forced to retire and Maldonado wound up sixth.

After the race the Venezuelan claimed that Hamilton, who was struggling for grip at that point, had been driving too aggressively.

"I don't know why he drove like that," Maldonado said. "He was struggling too much with the tyres. He was completely lost and at that moment I was getting very good pace. He tried a very aggressive move on me."

Maldonado's penalty moved him down to 12th place.

Toro Rosso driver Jean-Eric Vergne and Kamui Kobayashi of Sauber were also each handed grid penalties for the upcoming British Grand Prix after causing further collisions during Sunday's race.

Frenchman Vergne was given a 25 000-euro fine and a 10-place grid penalty for crashing into Caterham driver Heikki Kovalainen while Japanese Kobayashi will drop five places for his collision with Ferrari driver Felipe Massa.

Michael Schumacher was also under investigation for using his car's drag reduction system in a yellow flag zone.

However, the Mercedes driver was not penalised and will retain his third-placed finish.

http://www.supersport.com/motorsport/formula1/news/120624/Maldonado_punished_as_stewards_kept_busy

a Few drivers will start a normal race, Lots with penalties. As far as I can remember, this is the most penalties ever.
 
Well pastor is right, hamilton was driving like a chop for someone who had no grip left. The stewards got it spot on though although pastor should be stuck with a 5 place grid drop for being an idiot and hamilton well he will remember his stupidity and hopefully learn.
 
He was driving like someone who wasn't going to hand anything away pasella and did it fairly.
 
MyDogHasNoNose said:
Lewis had the line, he could do as he pleased. He expected Maldonado to back off like any normal driver would. Coulthard alluded to it a few times in the commentary - you have to get your car solidly up alongside your opponent to make an overtaking maneuver stick. Maldonado just pushed it too far. He was on the outside and was never going to be given that piece of track.
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At the braking point Maldonado was in front. It may have been by a wheel, but he was the lead car. I even recall Coulthard saying that at that point he had full right to hold station into the corner as he was now the lead car. The problem comes in when Hamilton has left the guy with nowhere to go and he is suddenly expected to go who the hell knows where. And if Hamilton, who was trailing heading into the right hander, has the right to fight for position, by the same token Maldonado, trailing into the left hander, has full right to fight for position. The only problem here was Lewis ran him off the track, which as I pointed out, is not exactly a legal move when one looks at the regulations.

I maintain my opinion; both drivers could have avoided that. Racing incident and both carry the blame for the outcome. If Hamilton had driven like there was another car there by giving him room to make the left-hander, both cars would have exited the left-hander in one piece. If Maldonado had ceded to Hamilton's aggressive move and just cut the chicane having been forced off track, both cars would have made the corner in one piece.
 
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Well, the stewards disagree, your opinion isn't going to change anything it seems lol.
 
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