Farm Attacks

[My_King]

Always kept the grass cut around the entrance and usually if people were home, we would call home and ask to open the gate for us

 

[rambo919]

I know this is MyBB, so logic goes over most peoples heads.
But I would like to start the discussion.

I really do not want to start a fight on this topic. But how do people living on rural areas not start protecting themselves?
Is it money? They dont have R5K for a handgun? Or is it the stigma of owning one?

As with another thread here I even confirmed we were told in Pietersburg by the security guard protecting the Garlic store people dont attack us was due to the amount of dogs we had.
But we also never left the children alone when we left the plot.

We did however have 1 incident where the outer wires were cut and some chickens might have been stolen, but we never left the safety of the house when we heard something outside. Even when the dogs went mad in the early morning hours.

The biggest problem is the other costs of protecting yourself, no one has the lawyers fees even IF they can afford a weapon and compliance costs. Then there is the fear of jailtime that everyone other than habitual criminals have.

 

[My_King]

The biggest problem is the other costs of protecting yourself, no one has the lawyers fees even IF they can afford a weapon and compliance costs. Then there is the fear of jailtime that everyone other than habitual criminals have.

Ok if that is the case, can't we start a trust fund for these people?

YesI know, kak idea, but better than being raped/murdered.

I can start with R100, its not much but a start?

 

[OCP]

Protection should not start or end with firearms but should be a combination of layers (fences / alarms / dogs / etc) and risk management.

In addition, firearms are only useful if you:
1. carry them on you all the time (ie. handguns as they are easy to carry and conceal)
2. are proficient with them + train regularly
3. have a "fighting" mindset
4. you get the opportunity to use them; when the proverbial hits the big spinny thing there is no guarantee a firearm is going to prevent an attack or save your life.... it merely increases your chances and acts as an equalizer against multiple aggressors.

 

[rambo919]

Ok if that is the case, can't we start a trust fund for these people?

YesI know, kak idea, but better than being raped/murdered.

I can start with R100, its not much but a start?

Just having a lawyer LOOK at a case is already a few thousand..... no the only thing that will turn the tide is if something happens that causes people to confidently start ignoring the police. The police themselves atm are the biggest problem, and it's not even their fault it's their bosses.

 

[rietrot]

The biggest problem is the other costs of protecting yourself, no one has the lawyers fees even IF they can afford a weapon and compliance costs. Then there is the fear of jailtime that everyone other than habitual criminals have.

That's nonsense.

Most people who were attacked has weapons but it is locked in a safe or something.

 

[rambo919]

That's nonsense.

Most people who were attacked has weapons but it is locked in a safe or something.

Because of further compliance costs. No one is allowed to carry all the time. They are not allowed to be their own security and no one has the money for "proper" security.

An alternative would be to alleviate unemployment by starting unofficial security but that would be called "the white racist right threat" even if it was security for everyone. And there would be bellows for training and certification and other compliance nonsense.

 

[etienne_marais]

I know this is MyBB, so logic goes over most peoples heads.
But I would like to start the discussion.

I really do not want to start a fight on this topic. But how do people living on rural areas not start protecting themselves?
Is it money? They dont have R5K for a handgun? Or is it the stigma of owning one?

As with another thread here I even confirmed we were told in Pietersburg by the security guard protecting the Garlic store people dont attack us was due to the amount of dogs we had.
But we also never left the children alone when we left the plot.

We did however have 1 incident where the outer wires were cut and some chickens might have been stolen, but we never left the safety of the house when we heard something outside. Even when the dogs went mad in the early morning hours.

While it is easy for me to say I also feel people should show more gumption and 'paraatheid'.

In the large the issue is however ideologic, the New South Africa is an utter failure and we need to examine the dynamics of why this is so and the forces working at destroying it.

 

[rietrot]

Because of further compliance costs. No one is allowed to carry all the time. They are not allowed to be their own security and no one has the money for "proper" security.

An alternative would be to alleviate unemployment by starting unofficial security but that would be called "the white racist right threat" even if it was security for everyone. And there would be bellows for training and certification and other compliance nonsense.

Dude stop talking nonsense. It doesn't help.

 

[rambo919]

Dude stop talking nonsense. It doesn't help.

Point out the nonsense directly instead of sweeping statements?

 

[The_Mowgs]

Because of further compliance costs. No one is allowed to carry all the time. They are not allowed to be their own security and no one has the money for "proper" security.

An alternative would be to alleviate unemployment by starting unofficial security but that would be called "the white racist right threat" even if it was security for everyone. And there would be bellows for training and certification and other compliance nonsense.

What do you mean by "not allowed to carry all the time"?

 

[OCP]

Because of further compliance costs. No one is allowed to carry all the time. They are not allowed to be their own security and no one has the money for "proper" security.

An alternative would be to alleviate unemployment by starting unofficial security but that would be called "the white racist right threat" even if it was security for everyone. And there would be bellows for training and certification and other compliance nonsense.

Section 13 firearm can be carried concealed anywhere except national keypoints and places where the owner prevents or denies access.

 

[rambo919]

 

[rambo919]

What do you mean by "not allowed to carry all the time"?

It has to be locked in a safe unless there is a clear present threat?

By the time you get the gun out and loaded you are already dead.

Section 13 firearm can be carried concealed anywhere except national keypoints and places where the owner prevents or denies access.

These are not places where most attacks happen, they already have security.

 

[OCP]

It has to be locked in a safe unless there is a clear present threat?

These are not places where most attacks happen, they already have security.

Firearm only needs to be in a safe when it is not under your direct control.

Section 13 (selfdefence) can be carried concealed virtually anywhere.

Nothing stops you from strapping a long gun to your back while you move around on your farm/property.
You just cant put it down or leave it in your car/lying around ... must always be under your direct control.

 

[The_Mowgs]

It has to be locked in a safe unless there is a clear present threat?

No, that's incorrect. Carry one up, all the time.

 

[My_King]

Just having a lawyer LOOK at a case is already a few thousand..... no the only thing that will turn the tide is if something happens that causes people to confidently start ignoring the police. The police themselves atm are the biggest problem, and it's not even their fault it's their bosses.

While it is easy for me to say I also feel people should show more gumption and 'paraatheid'.

In the large the issue is however ideologic, the New South Africa is an utter failure and we need to examine the dynamics of why this is so and the forces working at destroying it.

Yes the popo is the problem and that is part of an equation we can't fix.
So I'm trying to see what else can be done.

Farmers have now started to stand together and TALK. They are just talking.
Again not trying to start a fight, trying to get a solution - A working solution.

Thats why I'm asking if money is a problem.

 

[rietrot]

n uur se kak praat.

What's the point you are trying to make?

 

[My_King]

Firearm only needs to be in a safe when it is not under your direct control.

Section 13 (selfdefence) can be carried concealed virtually anywhere.

Agreed, the problem I have is the gun free zones. Maybe this needs to change.

If a farmer can carry 24/7 but when he goes to PnP he needs to leave the weapon at home as the building has a no gun sign on it.

This is 1 thing I can think of that needs to change

 

[rambo919]

Yes the popo is the problem and that is part of an equation we can't fix.
So I'm trying to see what else can be done.

Farmers have now started to stand together and TALK. They are just talking.
Again not trying to start a fight, trying to get a solution - A working solution.

Thats why I'm asking if money is a problem.

A combination of money and decades of indoctrinated fear..... interestingly the fear seems to be disapating at about the same rate as the money is. An approaching point of nothing left to loose probably.