Goodbye iMac

[Bryn]

All true… but it still only matters if you want to play games on it, doesn't it and there are still plenty of options besides PCs if you do. After all 56% of gamers still use consoles.

It's a bit ridiculous to say that if someone likes Macs and gaming they should stick to console gaming. The games someone prefers might only be available on PC, or they might simply want to play their games with higher framerates and at least at 1080p.

Also, someone used to a 5K display might not appreciate upscaled console resolutions at 30 fps.

 

[PostmanPot]

It's a bit ridiculous to say that if someone likes Macs and gaming they should stick to console gaming. The games someone prefers might only be available on PC, or they might simply want to play their games with higher framerates and at least at 1080p.

Also, someone used to a 5K display might not appreciate upscaled console resolutions at 30 fps.

No, they can game on their Macs as well as their consoles.

It ensures Windows isn't in the picture, that's not ridiculous at all.

 

[Bryn]

No, they can game on their Macs as well as their consoles.

It ensures Windows isn't in the picture, that's not ridiculous at all.

Did you even read what I wrote? For someone looking for a high fidelity gaming experience, and I'm guessing many 5K iMac owners are, consoles aren't a great option. And the majority of PC games don't support Mac, so you most certainly can't access all games with a console and Mac.

 

[backstreetboy]

The problem here is our currency. That being said, if I was gonna do it over again I'd buy a pc. I prefer Windows 10 to OSX.

+100 and it's only getting better with the insider releases.

 

[KleinBoontjie]

It's funny if you think about it....lightning broke your iMac. No pun?!?!?

 

[Progenix Oj101]

Sooo, my iMac (mid 2011 21.5" entry level model) got fried two weeks ago by lightning. Repairs were quoted at R34 500. WAAAAYYY more than what the iMac originally cost (can't remember exact figures, think it was around R14k in 2011, but speaking under correction).

So, my insurance quoted and paid out for a new iMac.

So I figured I had 3 options:
1. Get a new entry level iMac to replace the fried one
2. Buy a more recent 27" iMac with much better specs
3. Build a PC again (used to build my own PC's before I got the iMac)

Option 1: I was absolutely disgraced at the specs of the new entry level iMac's available! My 2011 iMac had a 7200 RPM drive, the new one: 5400 RPM. WHAT!?!?!?!?! Also no discrete graphics. Info from the interwebs confirmed it. It is SLOW. Wow, what an utter let-down from Apple. So Option 1, out the door.

Option 2: Some nice options available in the second hand market for 27" iMacs. Had a look around, lined one up to view, but then though to myself.
If my iMac was not fried by lightning, but a component broke down, then my insurance would not have paid out. That would have left me with a R34k bill for repairs, or a new or second hand iMac out of my own pocket. Whoah... Was I prepared to take the risk on a second hand iMac, it breaks down, and I am stuck with a massive repair bill? No thanks. So option 2 out the door.

Option 3: Built myself a monster PC with Skylake i5-6500, 8GB DDR4 2666 RAM, 256gb SSD, 1 TB HDD, case, psu etc. (keyboard and monitor excluded. Will also get a nice GPU later, maybe when the new tech drops), for R7k LESS than the entry level iMac. This thing FLIES... Yes, I had to manage Windows again, but Win 10 pretty great so far.

My point with all this:

Apple is shooting themselves in the foot. I cannot justify paying the high price for such a slouch of a computer. Put some MODERN components in there, for goodness' sake! With the added risk of very high costs to repair. My PC I can replace any faulty part myself.

Still love my MacBook Air, I am not anti-Apple just for the heck of it (I have an iPhone 6s Plus and Apple Watch, so pretty much all Appled out ). This is just my real-world experience and reasoning for moving away from an iMac as a desktop computer for work or gaming. I Will not venture there again. Too big a financial risk.

Anyway, just sharing my experience, use it, don't use it

As a PC user I need to come to Apple's defence here. I don't do Apple cause they don't have a device aimed at my needs, but I try to be fair.

Option 1. I've used basically every combination of storage drives you can think of, from single 5,400 RPM drives to multi SSD RAID arrays. Until you move to SSD, any hard drive or hard drive combination is around on par unless you need high sustained transfer speeds. For all intents and purposes, there is no appreciable difference between the speeds of a 5,400 RPM drive and one of the 7,200 RPM variety. Sure, benchmarks will say otherwise, but as a boot drive I struggled to discern between a single 5,400 RPM drive and two 1 TB 7,200 RPM drives in RAID 0 short stroked to 300 GB (with the remaining ~1.7 TB left unpartitioned). A 5,400 RPM drive DOES make enough of a difference in power consumption, heat output and noise to make it a valid choice for a computer where those three points are a concern, such as the iMac.

It also has a lot to do with how efficiently the OS can use the hardware available. In this regard, Apple wins hands down. It pains me to say it, but there's no competing. Look at something as simple as parallel file transfers to a flash drive on OSX vs Windows and you'll see that OSX is undoubtedly more refined and efficient. Have a look at this video comparing a video editing workflow on Windows vs OSX - while the video appears to make it out that the hardware and/or OS are what put the Macbook Air in the lead while in reality it is the editing software, it still boils down to software being more efficient and refined on the Mac.

[video=youtube;KnapaZYD2cU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KnapaZYD2cU[/video]

Option 2. Like driving a second hand BMW, if you can't afford to maintain it out of its motor plan you can't afford to own it. I'm not being a dick, but maybe look at chipping in a bit on top of the insurance payout and getting a slightly higher end iMac. Going from the cheapest iMac to the cheapest Retina iMac takes you from a dual core Core i5 1.6 GHz to quad core Core i5 3.1 GHz processor. Of course, for less than the price of the entry level iMac you can get the highest end Mac Mini.

Option 3. Have a look at the following:

Core i5-6500 3.2 GHz Processor - R 3,879
Asus B150M-A LGA1151 Motherboard - R 1,562
Adata 8 GB DDR4-2133 - R 815
Western Digital 1 TB Blue 7,200 RPM Hard Drive - R 1,076
Asus 24x DVD+/-RW - R 229
Raidmax Vortex V4 - R 481 (cheapest case they have that is available)
Corsair VS450 450w PSU - R 600
Windows 10 Home Edition - R 1,891
Total R 10,533

That leaves you with a much bigger, noisier, uglier, heavier PC that still needs a monitor (that little 21.5" iMac has a 1920x1080 IPS display), you to get used to a new OS, possibly purchasing of Windows software to replace your OSX software (which, depending on what software you need, could put you way past the price of a new iMac), more susceptible to malware (note that I'm not saying Macs don't get viruses - they do, just not as often)

The Rand/USD is affecting everything, while I paid just over R 3,000 for my i7-2600K (the top desktop processor at the time) a new i7-6700K is around R 6,717. Remember those X series HEDT processors that cost R 10,000 such as the i7-965XE? Well the i7-5960X is the same Dollar price but R 20,282! Remember when a top single GPU graphics card such as the GeForce GTX 680 could be yours for south of R 10,000? The GeForce GTX 980 Ti is now R 18,039! Saying the exchange rate is pushing the prices of Macs up is one thing, but saying it's making them less affordable than a PC is wrong. PC prices are going up just as much. Hell, a lowly Pentium Dual Core G3258 is R 1,281 at the moment, WTF.

In short - depending on what you're doing and your level of expertise, the Mac might be a very good option even if it has a lower spec than a PC at the same price point as it might just offer better performance and/or a better experience for you. Apple can't offer me anything that suits my needs, but if they did I'd be all over it even if the specs on paper are worse than the standard Wintel equivalent.

 

[KleinBoontjie]

All true… but it still only matters if you want to play games on it, doesn't it and there are still plenty of options besides PCs if you do. After all 56% of gamers still use consoles.

Where did you get that stats? Is 56% playing exclusively on consoles?

 

[Cassady]

As a PC user I need to come to Apple's defence here. I don't do Apple cause they don't have a device aimed at my needs, but I try to be fair.
....

In short - depending on what you're doing and your level of expertise, the Mac might be a very good option even if it has a lower spec than a PC at the same price point as it might just offer better performance and/or a better experience for you. Apple can't offer me anything that suits my needs, but if they did I'd be all over it even if the specs on paper are worse than the standard Wintel equivalent.

Wow. Thanks for this - puts some things in perspective. Some good food for thought.

 

[KleinBoontjie]

<snip>

In short - depending on what you're doing and your level of expertise, the Mac might be a very good option even if it has a lower spec than a PC at the same price point as it might just offer better performance and/or a better experience for you. Apple can't offer me anything that suits my needs, but if they did I'd be all over it even if the specs on paper are worse than the standard Wintel equivalent.

It still depends on what your using it for. Using all the basic stuff, stuff like photos, music, and movies....sure, it's much more snappier.
Open up an few spreadsheets with makros and power pivots on the Mac, and you'd soon wish you'd have the higher spec'd PC. All depends on you're perspective ofcourse.

 

[Rickster]

Saving R20k is a no brainer....get the PC.

 

[D tj]

The machine anyone wants is one with good hardware and ease-of-use. A custom Windows PC can provide that for much, much less than an Apple machine.

The Ease- of- use.A custom Windows PC??? Almost ALL whinging I hear is Window whines!!!

 

[Bryn]

The Ease- of- use.A custom Windows PC??? Almost ALL whinging I hear is Window whines!!!

That's because almost all PC users in SA are Windows users, and also because Windows machines can have cheap and unreliable hardware. Windows 10 is a very good OS.

OS X gives its fair share of trouble, as evident to me on Mac forums and from my uncle whose iMac has had him tearing his hair out on several occasions. iOS also has more than its fair share.

All platforms give problems.

 

[vinodh]

All platforms give problems.

Thats the trick right there. Being aware of this and then finding the platform that has the least problems for your own environment is the key. There is no perfect system.

 

[Progenix Oj101]

It still depends on what your using it for. Using all the basic stuff, stuff like photos, music, and movies....sure, it's much more snappier.
Open up an few spreadsheets with makros and power pivots on the Mac, and you'd soon wish you'd have the higher spec'd PC. All depends on you're perspective ofcourse.

Did you just quote a short part of my post, ignore an even shorter part that you quoted, and then disagree with me because you ignored the part that says exactly what you're saying?

 

[Bryn]

Thats the trick right there. Being aware of this and then finding the platform that has the least problems for your own environment is the key. There is no perfect system.

Except that Macs cost a fortune, which requires major benefit for such expense. I've never encountered a Mac that made me think the money was worth it.

Editing multimedia, coding, listening to and watching loads of entertainment, high end gaming and other PC tasks are perfectly pleasant on my Windows 10 machine, which costs about a third of a top spec iMac. It's really hard to see the value in a Mac, especially their laptops.

I resent having to use an OS X VM to code iOS apps. The OS runs smoothly, but the wasted space with the dock and menu bar bugs the hell out of me. You'd think a company like Apple would put more thought into user interface experience. Hiding either of them just creates other inconveniences.

 

[KleinBoontjie]

Did you just quote a short part of my post, ignore an even shorter part that you quoted, and then disagree with me because you ignored the part that says exactly what you're saying?

mmmm, saw the first sentence "As a PC user I need to come to Apple's defence here." and then saw the long story, scrolled and saw "In short". I tend to skip long stories and skip to the "in short" or "TL;DR version". Sorry. Can you maybe sum the part up that I missed...

 

[PostmanPot]

Bryn... Thank you for all the laughs. You should be in comedy. I've never!

 

[noxibox]

It's really hard to see the value in a Mac, especially their laptops.

I resent having to use an OS X VM to code iOS apps. The OS runs smoothly, but the wasted space with the dock and menu bar bugs the hell out of me. You'd think a company like Apple would put more thought into user interface experience. Hiding either of them just creates other inconveniences.

I love the Menu Bar, and wish that Windows had the same thing. My Dock takes up no more space than the Taskbar does on my Windows system. The Dock though is much more visually pleasing and functional than the Taskbar.

No matter what else the one area where their laptops shine is the touchpad. Even expensive Windows laptops simply can't seem to get this component right. And some of those Windows laptops have touchpads so bad I have to wonder why they even bothered to install one at all.

 

[greg0205]

I love the Menu Bar, and wish that Windows had the same thing. My Dock takes up no more space than the Taskbar does on my Windows system. The Dock though is much more visually pleasing and functional than the Taskbar.

No matter what else the one area where their laptops shine is the touchpad. Even expensive Windows laptops simply can't seem to get this component right. And some of those Windows laptops have touchpads so bad I have to wonder why they even bothered to install one at all.

And for some obscure reason, half the OEMs off-set them to the side of the machine, making it worse still.
With you on the dock and menu bar 'tho. Can't live without them.

 

[Bryn]

I love the Menu Bar, and wish that Windows had the same thing. My Dock takes up no more space than the Taskbar does on my Windows system. The Dock though is much more visually pleasing and functional than the Taskbar.

No matter what else the one area where their laptops shine is the touchpad. Even expensive Windows laptops simply can't seem to get this component right. And some of those Windows laptops have touchpads so bad I have to wonder why they even bothered to install one at all.

How is the Dock more functional than the Taskbar? And it does take up more space, unless you set the icons to be annoyingly small. There's loads of wasted space in the padding of the Dock. Also, the Taskbar does do the same thing as the Menu Bar - other than the menu options which rightfully belong inside apps. There's much more wasted space when your apps have the same uppermost space but also have a permanent Menu Bar.

Touchpads are irrelevant to me. I use a mouse, even when working on a laptop.