HEIC format

SauRoNZA said:
Is it a Samsung problem then? Because it works for me on iPhone even in Tapatalk and I know you use the browser. Or maybe it’s the browser they use on other phones?
Click to expand...
I think so. Safari might have built in support. I'm in the US at the moment so I can't test Tapatalk.
 
I was looking into this as newer cameras support it but for all the hype it's just a quagmire of incompatibility. HEIF/HEIC actually uses a proprietary licensed video codec. 3rd party apps don't support it without native support and can't save it. Even Windows does not support it and you have to download 2 extensions. Wherever it's used it's just converted into JPEG.

It will probably fade into obscurity. C-RAW seems like a better middle ground to capture extra information.
 
Ockie said:
Correct me if I am wrong...but from what I have been reading...HEIC is the container. You can have a HEIC file extension but it is encoded with AVIF.
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They are just containers for images and audio/video. The problem is that Apple decided to go with HEVC as the codec and that's what everyone now uses. Leave it to Apple to go with what will cause the most incompatibility. JPEG-XL is already superseding it. JPEG supports 8-bit depth, HEVC 10-bit depth, AVIF 12-bit depth and JPEG-XL 32-bit depth.
 
Swa said:
They are just containers for images and audio/video. The problem is that Apple decided to go with HEVC as the codec and that's what everyone now uses. Leave it to Apple to go with what will cause the most incompatibility. JPEG-XL is already superseding it. JPEG supports 8-bit depth, HEVC 10-bit depth, AVIF 12-bit depth and JPEG-XL 32-bit depth.
Click to expand...
JPEG is proprietary though and wants royalties I believe. AVIF is royalty free.
 
Ockie said:
JPEG is proprietary though and wants royalties I believe. AVIF is royalty free.
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I'm not sure which JPEG you're referring to. Traditional JPG is obviously not a problem. JXL is also just a container that's royalty free. AVIF is a version of HEIF that uses the AV1 codec which is royalty free. With JXL it depends on which codec you use. In theory it can also use AV1.
 
Just a note, while HEIC has better quality it achieves it through larger files and not smaller ones. You can't do a comparison as was done as the settings mean completely different things for both. You'd have to analyse the images for comparable quality to see the space saving but really HEIC files are not used to save space but for better quality.
 
Swa said:
Just a note, while HEIC has better quality it achieves it through larger files and not smaller ones. You can't do a comparison as was done as the settings mean completely different things for both. You'd have to analyse the images for comparable quality to see the space saving but really HEIC files are not used to save space but for better quality.
Click to expand...

Have you told Adobe about this? They seem to think otherwise.

www.adobe.com

HEIC vs. JPEG: Which is better? | Adobe

Find out how HEIC and JPEG files compare. Explore the similarities and differences between these image file formats with Adobe.
www.adobe.com

Compression.​

Because they can compress large images into more manageable files, JPEGs are the more popular choice for many web designers. The trade-off for that smaller file size is what’s known as lossy compression, which means that whenever you edit and resave a JPEG, it loses some background data. This can affect image quality.

On the other hand, HEICs offer a much more efficient, modern compression method than the older JPEG format. HEICs break images into significantly smaller files without affecting quality.

Storage space.​

Most HEIC files will take up significantly less room than a JPEG on your computer, tablet, or smartphone. Their innovative compression process means HEICs can use as little as half the space that a JPEG file would. This can ease the strain on your hard drive while allowing you to store a much larger number of files. More streamlined storage is one of the reasons why Apple made the switch from JPEG to HEIC back in 2017.

​

 
Dave said:
Have you told Adobe about this? They seem to think otherwise.

www.adobe.com

HEIC vs. JPEG: Which is better? | Adobe

Find out how HEIC and JPEG files compare. Explore the similarities and differences between these image file formats with Adobe.
www.adobe.com

Compression.​

Because they can compress large images into more manageable files, JPEGs are the more popular choice for many web designers. The trade-off for that smaller file size is what’s known as lossy compression, which means that whenever you edit and resave a JPEG, it loses some background data. This can affect image quality.

On the other hand, HEICs offer a much more efficient, modern compression method than the older JPEG format. HEICs break images into significantly smaller files without affecting quality.

Storage space.​

Most HEIC files will take up significantly less room than a JPEG on your computer, tablet, or smartphone. Their innovative compression process means HEICs can use as little as half the space that a JPEG file would. This can ease the strain on your hard drive while allowing you to store a much larger number of files. More streamlined storage is one of the reasons why Apple made the switch from JPEG to HEIC back in 2017.

​

Click to expand...
That doesn't contradict what I said.
 
Here's one example. HEIF takes up more space for comparable quality settings, significantly so for lower quality settings.
Especially phone manufacturers with a vested interest in selling storage aren't going to choose a quality setting that results in using less space.

 
Swa said:
That doesn't contradict what I said.
Click to expand...

Oh? I thought you said

Swa said:
HEIC has better quality it achieves it through larger files and not smaller ones.
Click to expand...

While Adobe says

Adobe said:
HEIC files will take up significantly less room than a JPEG on your computer, tablet, or smartphone. Their innovative compression process means HEICs can use as little as half the space that a JPEG file would.
Click to expand...
 
Dave said:
Oh? I thought you said



While Adobe says
Click to expand...
You're comparing apples to pears here. For a true comparison you have to match the qualities of the apple to the pear. HEIF can use less space but for your average photo this isn't really going to be the case and it also doesn't stop there. Where the hype comes in is that HEIF captures more detail and if you compare it to a similar super high quality JPEG this uses less space to achieve. But we almost never use high quality JPEG and it's mostly medium to high quality. HEIF is essentially camera RAW.

Question, do you think a manufacturer with an interest in selling you storage is going to give you the same quality using less space or make you use more space?
 
Swa said:
You're comparing apples to pears here. For a true comparison you have to match the qualities of the apple to the pear. HEIF can use less space but for your average photo this isn't really going to be the case and it also doesn't stop there. Where the hype comes in is that HEIF captures more detail and if you compare it to a similar super high quality JPEG this uses less space to achieve. But we almost never use high quality JPEG and it's mostly medium to high quality. HEIF is essentially camera RAW.

Question, do you think a manufacturer with an interest in selling you storage is going to give you the same quality using less space or make you use more space?
Click to expand...

It’s all a giant conspiracy, isn’t it, Swa?
 
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